Please give recommendations for standard RMNP rack

I’m looking to build a rack for RMNP for this summer and I was curious what a basic rack for the park would look like, then how I could proceed to build that rack out for all the trad that park has to offer. So what would a basic rack look like, and what would a complete rack look like. Do I need hexes or tricams or other pro than just cams or nuts? How many draws and what type? Thanks.

Standard trad rack. Cams from 1/2” to 4” with doubles in 1” to 3”. Full set basic WC Rocks. Biggest 4 DMM Brass Offsets and full range of Alloy Offsets. Tricams are brilliant on the flared cracks of Lumpy Ridge.
Mal

Standard rack will be fine for most routes. Doubles and extra alpine draws are helpful as pitches there can be long. No need for hexes or tricams (almost anywhere IMHO). 

Malcolm Daly wrote: Standard trad rack. Cams from 1/2” to 4” with doubles in 1” to 3”. Full set basic WC Rocks. Biggest 4 DMM Brass Offsets and full range of Alloy Offsets. Tricams are brilliant on the flared cracks of Lumpy Ridge.
Mal

...you had me til the Tricam thing...

I’m interested in buying BD C4 Camalots. Do you know what sizes I would need in singles and doubles? I’m assuming #.4-#4 with doubles in #.75-#3, but I’m unsure. Thanks

perhaps consider a .3 also.

Personally, I would highly recommend a cam with a narrower head width than the BD C4 cams in sizes .75 and under.

and I would hold off on a double #3 for now and opt for a double #.5 instead

• For most routes, the double standard rack of BDs .3 to 3, plus a set of nuts should cover it. For thin lines, I like having Aliens and a set of C3s. Totums are great for the flairs (and there are alot of flared cracks). Also, there are some fun offwidths so 4, 5, and 6s can be handy as well.

For most routes I've done there I've brought doubles .4-2, stoppers, one 3, and loooots of runners. Never felt lacking in gear but I often climb below my limit in the alpine

Little late to the party, But i always had tcus to 3. Doubles .5-2 (more of the smaller peices if the route was harder for me). About 18 nuts including some brass and a lot of runners. Up to 12 on hallet routes as they tend to wander. 

In RMNP I carry a rack of about 10 nuts doubles from .4-1 and usually one 2 and maybe one 3 and a dozen alpines. This can vary greatly and the rack can grow or shrink depending on the route. You can get up lots of easy routes with this rack. This is a very generic reply. And a generic question too. Gear requirements are always changing for every route you'll get on. It sounds like you are just building your first rack which is awesome! But RMNP is not the place to learn traditional climbing techniques. It's best to figure this stuff out in easier terrain. When you have a better understanding for the system and gear you start heading to the alpine. I have not climbed in lumpy but people say it's a great stepping stone in preparation for real alpine climbing in the park. If you and your partner don't know how to move fast through complex terrain you are putting yourselves in harms way for sure. I am not trying to lecture. Just my two cents apologies. 

I run doubles .3-3 (mix of C4, WC friends, totem, UL mastercams), set of offset nuts, regular nuts, 12+ shoulder length runners, and 2 double length runners. This is my standard rack when I climb pretty much anywhere in Colorado. I don't have any brass offsets, but I do have the 3 smallest ball nuts. I have ran into a few situations where smaller nuts would be nice, I should probably buy a set. I also own single #4-6 which come with me sometimes, there are some nice wide pitches that are worth having the big stuff for. I carry a pretty big rack, but I am kind of a pussy and I like to link pitches wherever possible to save time and skip shitty belays. You can never really have too many runners, I carry most of them as alpine draws, and then 4 over the shoulder with a single carabiner.

For starting out, try and figure out what your potential partners have and buy stuff to supplement. Buying a full double rack outright is going to be a big purchase. Doubles .5-3 with a set of nuts will get you up a lot of climbs, but you might want some more small stuff depending on what you are climbing. 

A rack consisting of 6 black totems, 4 pink tricams, and a gold big bro should get you up just about anything in the front range.

Malcolm Daly wrote: Standard trad rack. Cams from 1/2” to 4” with doubles in 1” to 3”. Full set basic WC Rocks. Biggest 4 DMM Brass Offsets and full range of Alloy Offsets. Tricams are brilliant on the flared cracks of Lumpy Ridge.
Mal

IMO, if I were to leave anything off of this list, it would be the offsets.  But I'd add a set of good micro nuts.  As for Tricams?  Yeah, the 3 smallest ones (up to pink) are good, and serve as a few spare nuts anyway, so yeah, no harm in those.

Tony B wrote:

IMO, if I were to leave anything off of this list, it would be the offsets.  But I'd add a set of good micro nuts.  As for Tricams?  Yeah, the 3 smallest ones (up to pink) are good, and serve as a few spare nuts anyway, so yeah, no harm in those.

Tony,

I am curious about tricams having never placed one myself nor climbed with anyone who uses them. Are they particular and fiddly to place in flairs compared to  totums or offsets? Or easy once you get the hang of them? I love be able to quickly drop in a cam or nut in,  but I could see the appeal of having a set of tricams due to price and weight.  Thanks!

HughC wrote:

Tony,

I am curious about tricams having never placed one myself nor climbed with anyone who uses them. Are they particular and fiddly to place in flairs compared to  totums or offsets? Or easy once you get the hang of them? I love be able to quickly drop in a cam or nut in,  but I could see the appeal of having a set of tricams due to price and weight.  Thanks!

I think, like with all gear, practice makes it easy. 
Placing them isn’t hard. Getting them in the exact spot you want may take a second. 
It’s removing them that can be a pain. Basically because of the shape, (in active placement mode) they are like a one way cam. 
You can accidentally push them in too far and it’s easier for it to go in than out. 
Imagine a cam without trigger wires. Cams fine. Works. But if it slips deeper it’s just that much harder to retrieve. 
You’ve got to use a nut tool (usually) to act as your trigger by squeezing the metal bit into the sling bit and extract it out of the crack at the same time. 
Again, practice makes perfect and if you’re perfect at using tricams then that would be pretty rad. 

With the exception of splitter sandstone and granite cracks, Tricams are my go-to nut in the sub- 1.5” size. In Tricam speak, that means Black, Pink, Red, Brown and [gasp!] Orange. For most routes in Eldo, RMNP, Red Rocks, NRG, etc, I’ll carry 1-Black, 3-Pink, 3-Red, 2-Brown and 1-Orange. I only place the Black where it’s really needed: they’re so small they’re tricky to get out. A word about the Orange: I know I said that I only carry Tricams to 1.5” so the Orange is an exception. It’s the most versatile nut or cam I’ve ever owned and it always has a place on my gear sling. It floats into huecos, tucks underneath boulders, fits securely into weird V-slots and I’ve even wedged between a tree and the rock. Once, after dropping my rap rig 5 pitches up on BVW at Red Rocks, I figured out that I could stuff a bight of the ropes through it, clip in and rappelled 4 more four pitches to the ground.

They’re only tricky to place if you’ve failed to practice placing them. With practice they’re no harder to place than a cam. Really. The problem I run into often and, it’s my bad, I forget to show my partners how to remove them. Yup...there’s a technique and, yup, you need to practice the technique. Better yet, when your second FUBARs getting one out, they cost a quarter to third of what that fancy cam costs. 

Please spare me the “they’ll go where nothing else will go” crap. They’ll go anywhere a cam or nut will go. Sure, if you’re plugging Camelot’s at Indian Creek or the Valley, those cams slide in pretty easy and any beginner can pull them out, but anywhere else Tricams are lighter, faster, cheaper and waaaaay cooler then cams.
Climb Safe,
Mal

Malcolm Daly wrote: With the exception of splitter sandstone and granite cracks, Tricams are my go-to nut in the sub- 1.5” size. In Tricam speak, that means Black, Pink, Red, Brown and [gasp!] Orange. For most routes in Eldo, RMNP, Red Rocks, NRG, etc, I’ll carry 1-Black, 3-Pink, 3-Red, 2-Brown and 1-Orange. I only place the Black where it’s really needed: they’re so small they’re tricky to get out. A word about the Orange: I know I said that I only carry Tricams to 1.5” so the Orange is an exception. It’s the most versatile nut or cam I’ve ever owned and it always has a place on my gear sling. It floats into huecos, tucks underneath boulders, fits securely into weird V-slots and I’ve even wedged between a tree and the rock. Once, after dropping my rap rig 5 pitches up on BVW at Red Rocks, I figured out that I could stuff a bight of the ropes through it, clip in and rappelled 4 more four pitches to the ground.

They’re only tricky to place if you’ve failed to practice placing them. With practice they’re no harder to place than a cam. Really. The problem I run into often and, it’s my bad, I forget to show my partners how to remove them. Yup...there’s a technique and, yup, you need to practice the technique. Better yet, when your second FUBARs getting one out, they cost a quarter to third of what that fancy cam costs. 

Please spare me the “they’ll go where nothing else will go” crap. They’ll go anywhere a cam or nut will go. Sure, if you’re plugging Camelot’s at Indian Creek or the Valley, those cams slide in pretty easy and any beginner can pull them out, but anywhere else Tricams are lighter, faster, cheaper and waaaaay cooler then cams.
Climb Safe,
Mal

If they raised the price of them they might become more popular. 

Alex Fletcher wrote: I think, like with all gear, practice makes it easy. 
Placing them isn’t hard. Getting them in the exact spot you want may take a second. 
It’s removing them that can be a pain. Basically because of the shape, (in active placement mode) they are like a one way cam. 
You can accidentally push them in too far and it’s easier for it to go in than out. 
Imagine a cam without trigger wires. Cams fine. Works. But if it slips deeper it’s just that much harder to retrieve. 
You’ve got to use a nut tool (usually) to act as your trigger by squeezing the metal bit into the sling bit and extract it out of the crack at the same time. 
Again, practice makes perfect and if you’re perfect at using tricams then that would be pretty rad. 

Thanks for the info!