What do you wish you had known before you started renovating your dirtbag van?

That keeping things simple and minimal is way easier and cheaper in the long run. No you dont need a fridge, no you dont need a kitchen, you dont need a thousand dollar solar system or fancy woodwork or expensive propane heaters. You need a comfy bed and some storage, privacy curtains are nice too. Just think tent on wheels, not 4star hotel. Save money for good food and beer.

You can stay at a lot of hotels for the cost of building out a van.

Hotels are gross and inconvenient. 

m Mobes wrote: That keeping things simple and minimal is way easier and cheaper in the long run. No you dont need a fridge, no you dont need a kitchen, you dont need a thousand dollar solar system or fancy woodwork or expensive propane heaters. You need a comfy bed and some storage, privacy curtains are nice too. Just think tent on wheels, not 4star hotel. Save money for good food and beer.

I'm wondering how much time you spent in your van? I'm thinking of moving into mine full time.

I spent a good amount of time living out of a tent while hiking, and a month living out of a Subaru Outback with my girlfriend, and the inconvenience of finding places to go to the bathroom and build a fire to cook started to bother me. I suspect living in a van full-time would make this a lot more stressful.

Scott Fagen wrote: You can stay at a lot of hotels for the cost of building out a van.

Sure, but part of the point of this is to be paying into something I own, rather than just spending money on rent and having nothing to show for it once the lease is up. A hotel is like rent but worse.

David K wrote:

Sure, but part of the point of this is to be paying into something I own, rather than just spending money on rent and having nothing to show for it once the lease is up. A hotel is like rent but worse.

You will have nothing to show for it with a van as well. Vehicles are a depreciating asset. Never forget that. Not to mention that all it takes is a single deer in the road to destroy your house, and vehicle insurance will never make you whole the way homeowner's insurance will.

If this is the reason you're buying a van, it's a very poor reason.

David K wrote:

I'm wondering how much time you spent in your van? I'm thinking of moving into mine full time.

I spent a good amount of time living out of a tent while hiking, and a month living out of a Subaru Outback with my girlfriend, and the inconvenience of finding places to go to the bathroom and build a fire to cook started to bother me. I suspect living in a van full-time would make this a lot more stressful.

Just get a propane camping stove and a bucket for #2

Before this thread heads south, David, I could send you more info but you are closer to a full-time van dweller.
Go to the Lost City Parking lot and talk to the "WanderWoman" Ranger (Terri)
& then there's this among the gathering herd:
No Short Bus Jokes, Please

You could go check it out during the "RRG Rocktober-fest"

Pretty much every hotel I stay in is about $100 after taxes and fees, and then you still have to deal with food. There's definitely some math there, if you're doing a high number of nights on the road, say 50...there's your van - or in my case, a trailer. 

Most people I know that can afford a nice van only get to use it for 2-3 weeks a year...and a few 3 day weekends...that’s maybe 30 nights per year...times $100 a night and that’s $30k over ten years...how much is a decent sprinter with working kitchen, sleeping area and solar power? At least $40k...but at least everyone will know you’re “core”.

You also can’t drive your van to the best climbing in the world: Spain.

Scott Fagen wrote: Most people I know that can afford a nice van only get to use it for 2-3 weeks a year...and a few 3 day weekends...that’s maybe 30 nights per year...times $100 a night and that’s $30k over ten years...how much is a decent sprinter with working kitchen, sleeping area and solar power? At least $40k...but at least everyone will know you’re “core”.

You also can’t drive your van to the best climbing in the world: Spain.

yeah I guess my math was on the beater builds my friends have done, not the pimp sprinter build. 

La MoMoface wrote:

yeah I guess my math was on the beater builds my friends have done, not the pimp sprinter build. 

I see a lot more pimped out sprinters in Bishop than beater vans...but maybe I just notice the nice vans more.

I do not have a van. I have a truck with a camper.  However, you cannot drive a hotel room to a crag. Also, it is nice to sleep in a bed that hasn’t seen hundreds if not thousands of strangers. 

The people I know who have lived full time in vans (as college students mostly) got old, beat-up e-series or similar vans. I think mostly they found old vans that still had had professional build outs in the distant past, but maybe one DIY’d it. They seemed very happy with them. An indoor cooking space and sink seemed important, but none had a bathroom and they all seemed pretty happy. The vans probably aren’t worth much now and the mileage is awful if you go on long trips but they still came out ahead compared to rent.

David K wrote:

Do you have more info about this? Or links?

If you google "fuel pump cut hole" or something like that you'll find some videos. You'll need to figure out where the fuel pump is on your vehicle in relation to the floor layout. I used a sawzall to cut the hole because I didn't like all the sparks that the grinder wheel was making but I used a really short blade and was careful not to cut any hoses. It took me just under two hours to replace my fuel pump including cutting the hole. Dropping the tank probably would've taken me two days and sucks if you don't have another helper.

That's why I love Subarus they put one there for you.

the schmuck wrote: I do not have a van. I have a truck with a camper.  However, you cannot drive a hotel room to a crag. Also, it is nice to sleep in a bed that hasn’t seen hundreds if not thousands of strangers. 

I just assume that every single inch of a hotel room has been rectally stamped...which makes $100 feel like a great deal.

Jon H wrote: 

You will have nothing to show for it with a van as well. Vehicles are a depreciating asset. Never forget that. Not to mention that all it takes is a single deer in the road to destroy your house, and vehicle insurance will never make you whole the way homeowner's insurance will.

If this is the reason you're buying a van, it's a very poor reason.

I think you're looking at buying a van in comparison to buying a house. However, buying a house isn't really an option for me right now--even if I wanted to commit to one location like that, I don't have the savings for a good down payment, so I'd be either buying a seriously flawed property, or paying out a lot in interest. So the comparison you should be making is between buying a van and renting a home. Then the comparison becomes pretty clear:

1. I don't think it's fair to say I have nothing to show for it with a van. In the end I have a van. In the very worst case I have parts and scrap metal. And being a careful driver who maintains their stuff, it's much more likely that I'll have an old van in reasonable condition, which can probably be sold for somewhere in the range of four digits. That's not nothing. With renting a home, I literally have nothing to show for all the rent I paid.
2. Even if the very worst happens and I get almost nothing back, the monthly cost of a van is lower than renting a home.

Regardless, this isn't the only reason I'm buying a van.

As you've already experienced in this thread, be prepared for lots of people trying to convince you that a van is a stupid idea. My entire family tried to convince me I was ruining my life. I've never been happier and as it turns out, the van even helped me get an incredible Financial Analyst position (que more naysayer doubts & complaints).

I wish I did a full layer of sound deadener, not just strips throughout van (Rattle Trap). It would make the van more quiet both for driving and when parked. Also  I could have done a better job ventilating the van for cooking. I went with the all stealth approach - I have no windows and only a single roof fan. Ventilation isn't an issue asides from when I want to cook. If i cook with the doors closed, my van will smell like whatever I cooked for a day. Would need to add either a second fan or at least a small window.

Jon H wrote:

You will have nothing to show for it with a van as well. Vehicles are a depreciating asset. Never forget that. Not to mention that all it takes is a single deer in the road to destroy your house, and vehicle insurance will never make you whole the way homeowner's insurance will.

If this is the reason you're buying a van, it's a very poor reason.

If it's just a deer you'll be fine in a sprinter. Just runs them over like a speed bump.

zeb wrote: As you've already experienced in this thread, be prepared for lots of people trying to convince you that a van is a stupid idea. My entire family tried to convince me I was ruining my life. I've never been happier and as it turns out, the van even helped me get an incredible Financial Analyst position (que more naysayer doubts & complaints).

Meh. Haters gonna hate.

I wish I did a full layer of sound deadener, not just strips throughout van (Rattle Trap). It would make the van more quiet both for driving and when parked.

I'm going to be using sheet insulation with plywood lining (mainly because wood is the material I know how to work with best) so I'm expecting the insulation/wood to absorb quite a bit of sound. Do you think that's enough?

Also  I could have done a better job ventilating the van for cooking. I went with the all stealth approach - I have no windows and only a single roof fan. Ventilation isn't an issue asides from when I want to cook. If i cook with the doors closed, my van will smell like whatever I cooked for a day. Would need to add either a second fan or at least a small window.

I'm thinking of a small fan in the side of the van with a hood over the cooking area. How do you think this would affect stealth? I suspect I'll be mostly parking in areas where stealth isn't needed, but I want to have options.