ADK Parking Ban- Rt 73 from Keene Valley to Chapel Pond

I just heard on NCPR that there is a new parking ban stating there is no longer roadside parking from Keene Valley through Chapel Pond region. It is enforced by a $250 fine. The DEC have stated they don't have a plan to address the significant reduction in access at this time. This is absolutely tragic as it will significantly limit access to all of the rock and ice routes, not to mention trails for hiking. The region as a whole will take a mighty hit and I can't imagine the logic. I understand their was an accident at the Cascade trailhead but to tank the local economy as a result is mind-boggling. I'm posting this as a call for grass roots involvement from the community as much as a helpful FYI so folks don't get tickets. I'm sure we have all see how they made new handicap access at the chapel pond parking area with little to know clarification and the subsequent tickets that many of us got. 

saw a ranger issuing tickets on Sunday, causing a very dangerous road condition. she just left her ranger pickup in occupying almost the entire lane. Coming down a hill around a bend there's just this ranger truck in the lane. It's not like I couldn't stop in time, but wtf. Had to drive in the oncoming lane to get around. The whole scene was dumb since there was plenty of places to put a giant pickup truck other than the middle of the road.
Wednesday evening we came up on a motorcycle accident at a pulloff. His motorcycle buddies were at the pulloff waiting and he was in the middle of the road in an ugly scene right in front of the pulloff, so the only scenario that makes sense is that he was trying to pull in and got rear ended.
Seemed like a busy weekend for emergency personnel.
Someone fell to their death soloing a waterfall? This motorcycle accident, I did hear about a bad accident (probably the one referenced in OP at Cascade) 

Josh Brown wrote: I just heard on NCPR that there is a new parking ban stating there is no longer roadside parking from Keene Valley through Chapel Pond region. It is enforced by a $250 fine. The DEC have stated they don't have a plan to address the significant reduction in access at this time. This is absolutely tragic as it will significantly limit access to all of the rock and ice routes, not to mention trails for hiking. The region as a whole will take a mighty hit and I can't imagine the logic. I understand their was an accident at the Cascade trailhead but to tank the local economy as a result is mind-boggling. I'm posting this as a call for grass roots involvement from the community as much as a helpful FYI so folks don't get tickets. I'm sure we have all see how they made new handicap access at the chapel pond parking area with little to know clarification and the subsequent tickets that many of us got. 

Josh,

Yes you are correct.  I think to most people that frequent the Adirondacks this didnt come as much of a suprise and the logic isnt to hard to see.  The shit show of cars parked on the side of the road by Giant Mountain had clearly become quite an issue.  On a busy Saturday it wasn't uncommon for both paring lots for giant to be full, the ausable parking lot to be full, and cars parked for a 1/2 mile in each direction.  Add in hikers crossing the road on foot and cars making u-turns on 73 and accidents have and would continue to happen.  We were up for the 4th of July weekend and had no problem finding parking for the beer walls, spiders web, and chapel pond but this obviously wont always be the case.  Hopefully the DEC will be slightly more proactive in looking for solutions.

Matt

When you say no roadside parking, does this apply to the designated parking spots (The wide parallel spots directly across from the slab)?

Or is this in reference to the hoards of cars parked on the shoulder after about 10:00am?

Where could I get more info on this? What a bummer.

Edit: a quick google search got me the info I needed. Just applies to outside of parking areas. Serious bummer nonetheless.

Would be interested where we could make our voices heard about this?

Hikers, climbers, and tourists (including those looking to do a 1 or 2 mile walk)  bring in $$$millions to the Adks (and other places) but the local / state "authorities"  won't spend $$$thousands to accommodate them.  Typical "small thinking".  (and yes, I know about the Keene Vly shuttle; that seems to be an exception.)

Maybe they should just hang big "ADKs CLOSED, GO BACK HOME" signs over the popular Northway exits to the Adks.

Anyone else think they could easily just turn the ridiculously deep parallel spots into pull in spots and double the parking there with the only cost being paint?

Here in NH, at a "swimming / picnicking "  location where we had a "parking" issue about the same "density" as at the Chapel-Pond-Giant-trailhead, the REAL issue, as explained by the local town council, was the people (including many children)  walking in the road (at times up to 1/2mile away) to get "around" the parked cars. I would think the NY DEC/State Police / local town authorities probably also believe this is the real issue....gotta save people from themselves, you know.

 Yes, at the above NH-location, some people parked directly in front of houses and even in pvt driveways, but this behavior could have been prevented without a total-and-complete parking ban except for the original 60-80 car parking lot on Nat. Forest land. Last year there was a shuttle from a paved lot about 2 miles away, but nothing's been seen of that this year. Probably because of some regulation, insurance/liability issue, or just inertia.

If its any consulation, this issue of "outdoors overcrowding" seems tio be pretty universal, I've seen it nearly eveywhere I've gone this past 4-5 years except for parts of Greece.  

Hobo Greg wrote: Absolutely tragic? Get a hold of yourself. It’ll be fine. Hopefully less parking equals less erosion on trails. Too bad it’s only a 6 million acre park, of which the high peaks are 250,000.

Erosion of the hiking trails is not the chief concern of the dozens of rock climbers who frequent the routes around Chapel Pond. I'll predict that on a typical weekend 90% of them will find that they can no longer access the area.  Once word gets out, they will simply avoid the choice climbing that the area has to offer. I can't imagine the Noonmark Diner and Mountaineer won't see a fall-off in business as a result.

Nolan Huther wrote:

Join the Adirondack Climbers Coalition

Done, thanks for the info. 

Hobo Greg wrote:

Well maybe it should be of their concern, because that’s part of the overuse problem in the high peaks. If they aren’t going to go the permit route, how else can you limit the use numbers? Bingo, limit the parking. And the noonmark diner is overhyped and overpriced with poor service to boot, would love seeing them take a hit.

Damn... you should try the fried chicken next time. 10/10

Seriously though, I think that the ban only affects pull offs that are not paved. Your best bet would be to reach out to the ADK Climbers Coalition for the official word and getting involved

http://www.adirondackclimberscoalition.org/

Don’t you be dissing the Noonmark! They’ve always been very nice to me. It’s just a reliable little diner with better pie than you’d expect. Heaven, in other words.

Hobo Greg wrote:

Well maybe it should be of their concern, because that’s part of the overuse problem in the high peaks. If they aren’t going to go the permit route, how else can you limit the use numbers? Bingo, limit the parking.

That's what they try to do here in Red Rock.  It's not really working, there's similar parking issues and they're shy about enforcement.  So they shut down the entire park for hours during peak season, causing traffic snarls and accidents along the only two lane road to access it.  But as long as the issue isn't *inside* the park they don't care.  [it's a tad unfair to say they don't care... they simply aren't able, capable, and/or willing to do anything about it]

Anyway, I digress.  There's pressures everywhere from overuse of outdoor resources.  With the ADKs in particular, you can start by pointing fingers at some of the hiking organizations.  They've been hyping the 46 for decades.  At one time I even got sucked into the turmoil.  How many new 46ers are there every year?  How many more was that from last year?  20 years ago?  How many repeats?  How many "naked barefoot backwards 5 season" 46er patches?

I digress some more.  I understand use/passion for the outdoors leads to conservation and awareness, but at some point you can love something to death.

Just got back from the Dacks (we go up every summer) and definitely witnessed an upsurge in trail use and parking issues this year, probably exacerbated by the temporary closure of parking at the Garden - I suspect this pushes hikers etc  to consider other entry points to the high peaks, and it certainly did for my family as we planned hiking and backpacking options.

I propose that the real solution is to embrace the popularity, build larger parking areas at entry points to the region (think commuter lots), and run shuttles.

Hamish Malin wrote: Just got back from the Dacks (we go up every summer) and definitely witnessed an upsurge in trail use and parking issues this year, probably exacerbated by the temporary closure of parking at the Garden - I suspect this pushes hikers etc  to consider other entry points to the high peaks, and it certainly did for my family as we planned hiking and backpacking options.

I propose that the real solution is to embrace the popularity, build larger parking areas at entry points to the region (think commuter lots), and run shuttles.

I think there are already shuttles from Marcy Field... for a fee. I've seen the signs, but can't speak to how popular it is or whether it's being successfully utilized. With NYS investing in promotion of tourism in the catskills and the adirondacks, you'd think that they would hire more DEC staff to manage/educate different user groups and develop the infrastructure to support the throngs of people that are straight up destroying sh*t to the point of near closure or permit systems. Any media outlet, government organization, brand that promotes the outdoors should be doing their part to educate LNT ethics...

Here's the shuttle info:

https://www.townofkeeneny.com/2019-garden-hiker-shuttle-information

Al Pine wrote:

I think there are already shuttles from Marcy Field... for a fee. I've seen the signs, but can't speak to how popular it is or whether it's being successfully utilized. With NYS investing in promotion of tourism in the catskills and the adirondacks, you'd think that they would hire more DEC staff to manage/educate different user groups and develop the infrastructure to support the throngs of people that are straight up destroying sh*t to the point of near closure or permit systems. Any media outlet, government organization, brand that promotes the outdoors should be doing their part to educate LNT ethics...

Here's the shuttle info:

https://www.townofkeeneny.com/2019-garden-hiker-shuttle-information

Yep, was going to mention the Marcy shuttle but it was convoluting my earlier response.  We looked into the shuttle for an outing while we were up there- $10/head adds up for a family of five.  Plus we were hiking out on a Tue, and the shuttle doesn’t run on tue (I think that changed after the 7/4 holiday), and there’s apparently no way to legally Uber or walk to/from the garden trailhead while construction is underway on the new bridge, as the shuttle has negotiated a route thru private land.

I suspect the fact that the shuttle costs money regardless of inconvenience probably increases other trailhead use for those trying to access the high peaks,especially given the popularity of that entry point.
Popularity in the region is definitely a double-edged sword, but at this point should probably be viewed as a necessary evil, or at the very least a net positive - not just adding needed revenue to the region but also in terms of health, quality of life for those enjoying the outdoors, etc.  Additional education and policing is almost certainly required; some of the trails I’ve been on over the last few years are super eroded due to overuse.  It’s definitely bittersweet, I try to be happy that so many others are also enjoying the outdoors.

The Adirondack Climbers' Coalition (ACC) has been advocating against the Route 73 parking restrictions since they were first proposed. The DOT and DEC have been moving forward with the Rte 73 parking restrictions, implementing them in stages. The first Rte 73 roadside parking restrictions started happening summer 2018, first just south of the Round Pond Trailhead and then just north of the Roaring Brook Falls (RBF) Trailhead. This year, 2019, has seen the closure of roadside parking from the Rooster Comb Trailhead just south of Keene Valley, all the way up to the Chapel Pond Tourist pullout. All traditional pullouts in the 2019 closure zone are currently open, i.e. Beer Walls, Case Wall, etc. The ACC position on the current parking closure is below:

ACC Position on Route 73 Parking Closures 

2018/2019 Roadside Parking Closure Effects on Climbers:

-Traditional roadside parking for the Spiders Web is CLOSED! Use the Chapel Pond Outlet Campground just across the road from the access trail or use any of the legal parking areas from Chapel Pond south.

-"Competition" for parking has been inadvertently created at the Case Wall, Beer Walls and Spanky's Wall pullouts between hikers and climbers. Every weekend since the 2019 closure has been implemented, hikers have been parking in what has traditionally been climber only parking. To guarantee parking at these pullouts on the weekends plan on arriving early, typically before 9am.

ACC Suggestions:

-Reducing the speed limit through Chapel Pond Pass to 35mph

-Construct all the parking lots purposed in the HPWUMP before anymore parking restrictions are implemented

-Expand and improve the Chapel Pond Outlet Campground parking

There are many more thoughts, ideas and conversations happening than what I've mentioned here. If you have any questions or concerns, please reach out. 

The Adirondack Climbers' Coalition is 100% volunteer based and is fighting hard to try and keep climbers access to the cliffs we all love. Joining is FREE and easy. By joining you are helping to show land managers that climbers are a unified user group that cares about the resource we use! Please join today by using the link below:

Join ACC Today! 

Will Roth wrote: The Adirondack Climbers' Coalition (ACC) has been advocating against the Route 73 parking restrictions since they were first proposed. The DOT and DEC have been moving forward with the Rte 73 parking restrictions, implementing them in stages. The first Rte 73 roadside parking restrictions started happening summer 2018, first just south of the Round Pond Trailhead and then just north of the Roaring Brook Falls (RBF) Trailhead. This year, 2019, has seen the closure of roadside parking from the Rooster Comb Trailhead just south of Keene Valley, all the way up to the Chapel Pond Tourist pullout. All traditional pullouts in the 2019 closure zone are currently open, i.e. Beer Walls, Case Wall, etc. The ACC position on the current parking closure is below:

ACC Position on Route 73 Parking Closures 

2018/2019 Roadside Parking Closure Effects on Climbers:

-Traditional roadside parking for the Spiders Web is CLOSED! Use the Chapel Pond Outlet Campground just across the road from the access trail or use any of the legal parking areas from Chapel Pond south.

-"Competition" for parking has been inadvertently created at the Case Wall, Beer Walls and Spanky's Wall pullouts between hikers and climbers. Every weekend since the 2019 closure has been implemented, hikers have been parking in what has traditionally been climber only parking. To guarantee parking at these pullouts on the weekends plan on arriving early, typically before 9am.

ACC Suggestions:

-Reducing the speed limit through Chapel Pond Pass to 35mph

-Construct all the parking lots purposed in the HPWUMP before anymore parking restrictions are implemented

-Expand and improve the Chapel Pond Outlet Campground parking

There are many more thoughts, ideas and conversations happening than what I've mentioned here. If you have any questions or concerns, please reach out.

The Adirondack Climbers' Coalition is 100% volunteer based and is fighting hard to try and keep climbers access to the cliffs we all love. Joining is FREE and easy. By joining you are helping to show land managers that climbers are a unified user group that cares about the resource we use! Please join today by using the link below:

Join ACC Today! 

Thanks so much for the informed response and links. This is what I was hoping we could learn when I posted, all the best Will!

Hobo Greg wrote:

$20-something bucks for average pie? That’s twice what you’d normally pay.

Cmon man those are some high-end pastries in there, amirite?  Anyway, if you don’t like the price of pie for $900K it’s yours:

Noonmark

Hobo Greg wrote:

$20-something bucks for average pie? That’s twice what you’d normally pay.

Maybe it's more than what you'd pay for a crappy supermarket pie. It's totally reasonable for a decent pie.

SethG wrote:

Maybe it's more than what you'd pay for a crappy supermarket pie. It's totally reasonable for a decent pie.

I had a NYC-based climbing partner who said he could make a living by re-selling Noonmark pies in Brooklyn for $40 a pop.

Gunkiemike wrote:

I had a NYC-based climbing partner who said he could make a living by re-selling Noonmark pies in Brooklyn for $40 a pop.

And everyone knows NYC and esp. Brooklyn aren't the real world!