Won a permit for Mt Whitney - gear question

Señor Arroz wrote:

Nah, he's right. People get in the mindset that they're never going to get another chance because the permits are "scarce." Even though they're not really that hard to get. But people take stupid risks just because they feel it's a once in a lifetime chance they're not willing to walk away from.

It'd be an interesting project to track the number of people turning around on Mt. Shasta (no quota for permits) vs. Whitney (permit scarcity mentality.) And correlate that against S&R calls and serious accidents. 

Put 4 times (or more on big weekends) the idiots on the mountain with no permit restrictions and there will be more accidents.

All of the out-of-state people and LA noobs trying to hike it always have the same "constraints" 'cause they have to get back to LA or Bumfuck Hicksville.

The permit system at least selects for those with above average commitment to the outdoors v. your average fat weekend selfie noob.

Harumpfster Boondoggle wrote:

Put 4 times (or more) the idiots on the mountain and there will be more accidents.

Thanks for doing the math.

Harumpfster Boondoggle wrote:

Put 4 times (or more) the idiots on the mountain and there will be more accidents.

All of the out-of-state people and LA noobs trying to hike it always have the same "constraints".

The permit system at least selects for those with above average commitment to the outdoors v. your average fat weekend noob.

You forgot to account for condescending silverbacks from Sacramento who just drove 7 hours...

Señor Arroz wrote:

You forgot to account for condescending silverbacks from Sacramento who just drove 7 hours...

Those know how to avoid noob shit shows.

Not sure the highest altitude you've been at been before, and Im sure youre already aware of this, but I would just keep in mind that altitude sickness is a real bummer (if youre prone to it).  I did Whitney 3 years back, and no amount of aspirin or ginger could take away the terrible feeling in my head.  I eventually summited, but it was long, difficult and SLOW because I had to keep stopping to rest.  Just trying to be helpful.  Good luck and stay safe

Harumpfster Boondoggle wrote:

Those know how to avoid noob shit shows.

But how are they ever going to learn to use the rope for anchors then?

Señor Arroz wrote:

But how are they ever going to learn to use the rope for anchors then?

From the Internet. Where they get all their other knowledge.

Harumpfster Boondoggle wrote:

From the Internet. Where they get all their other knowledge.

Thank Gawd you're here, then.

Keep your eyes on this thread:
http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/4904/Current_Conditions:_Mt_Whitney#Post4904

I also won a permit for Mt. Whitney in mid June. Crampons, Ice Axe and maybe snow shoes are recommended due to snowfall this year. Good luck!

Gerson R wrote: Keep your eyes on this thread:
http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/4904/Current_Conditions:_Mt_Whitney#Post4904

I also won a permit for Mt. Whitney in mid June. Crampons, Ice Axe and maybe snow shoes are recommended due to snowfall this year. Good luck!

I wouldn't bother with snowshoes as long as you hit the snow early, it should be plenty trodden down by then. The year before last year I was involved with a group of work folks who wanted to head over New Army Pass and were asking me about ice-axes, crampons, microspikes etc. my response to them was that the New Army Pass snowfield and cornice was not a place to learn snowcraft. Some years in the Sierra the snowpack is such that "hiking" is not something done until August or later.

My recollection of New Army pass is that it's STEEP as hell. And that was in summer. 

Good luck with your C2C effort. The only advice I would give is this: spend as much time as you can at Cottonwood- south of Mt Whitney you can drive up to 9,000 - go hiking all over. To the east of Cottonwood lake 1 you can find some 4,000 year old standing trees. Get acclimated to the altitude. Then on your day start at like 1am.... drink tons of water. Bring a winter down jacket.
Good Luck 

Guy Keesee wrote: Good luck with your C2C effort. The only advice I would give is this: spend as much time as you can at Cottonwood- south of Mt Whitney you can drive up to 9,000 - go hiking all over. To the east of Cottonwood lake 1 you can find some 4,000 year old standing trees. Get acclimated to the altitude. Then on your day start at like 1am.... drink tons of water. Bring a winter down jacket.
Good Luck 

I thought of this, too, but would be surprised if the road up there is even open by June 1. Definitely the Cottonwoods and Horsehoe Meadows Road is one of my favorite spots.

Wow, this thread has become a shit show (though mostly because of one obvious person whose profile provides no evidence that he has any experience to back up his big opinions). To the OP, Whitney by the trail is not a climb; it's a really long hike.  Get in shape for a 12 hr. day.  The only part you need to be mindful of are the switchbacks above trail camp, which in early season can be a big 2,000' snowfield.  If you're bringing crampons and an axe, know how to use them. I don't know where you live or what your fitness level is, but get a lot of up and down under your belt beforehand.  Sleep at altitude the night before like Guy suggested. I'm amazed that some people don't do that and then wonder why they're breathing so hard. That will give you a lot more trial sense than asking about something on the internet. I say that because nothing you've offered in this thread gives me any sense that you've done a lot of long hikes or peaks. Maybe I'm wrong but you volunteering that maybe you should start at midnight and bring Diamox don't seem to indicate that you've much like this before.  Having said that, people routinely do it C2C.  I have a couple times when I was in less than tip top shape. If you acclimate OK, then it's just a long day. But, if you don't have a few several 1,000' days in ahead of time, then I don't know why you'd bother unless you're just a collector. Whitney is a really cool thing to do, but do your homework (i.e., get out there and get some miles in so you know how you fare at altitude, etc.) so you can do it safely and have fun.

Good advice, Fat Dad.

To offer a few hypothetical / contrarian thoughts ... (why not, we're 3 pages deep already haha)

The northeast couloir on Langley would offer more solitude, no permit hassle, and I would even argue much safer intro. to snow climbing than the sure-to-be icy 99 switchbacks section on the Mt Whitney Trail. The northeast couloir never gets steeper than 30 degrees and if you drop your axe, lose balance, etc. you simply slide down a massive apron of snow. No rocks at the bottom.

ALSO -- I think the permit revenues should go toward funding an Inyo NF summer intern trail angel. Responsibilities include maintaining order / cleanliness at Trail Camp, checking permits and ensuring parties have a basic level of competence as the trail conditions necessitate .... I've been all up and down the eastside for years now and very rarely run into backcountry rangers (they are always so nice and helpful)

jt newgard wrote: Good advice, Fat Dad.

To offer a few hypothetical / contrarian thoughts ... (why not, we're 3 pages deep already haha)

The northeast couloir on Langley would offer more solitude, no permit hassle, and I would even argue much safer intro. to snow climbing than the sure-to-be icy 99 switchbacks section on the Mt Whitney Trail. The northeast couloir never gets steeper than 30 degrees and if you drop your axe, lose balance, etc. you simply slide down a massive apron of snow. No rocks at the bottom.
...

i agree that the northeast couloir of langley is a fun snow climb but it def hits 40+ degrees at the top, an uncontrolled fall there in firm conditions would be a very serious situation in my opinion.  

brian burke wrote:

i agree that the northeast couloir of langley is a fun snow climb but it def hits 40+ degrees at the top, an uncontrolled fall there in firm conditions would be a very serious situation in my opinion.  

Plus it's a long off-trail way from the Ashram to the summit.

Chris Owen wrote:
Plus it's a long off-trail way from the Ashram to the summit.

Yes perhaps you both are right.

However, I would also say that it's perfectly fine to turn around before reaching the top. It only steepens right at the end.

And it would be a much richer experience learning some off-trail nav. and snow climbing practice than stomping up the icy Whitney Trail with the hordes.

jt newgard wrote:

Yes perhaps you both are right.

However, I would also say that it's perfectly fine to turn around before reaching the top. It only steepens right at the end.

And it would be a much richer experience learning some off-trail nav. and snow climbing practice than stomping up the icy Whitney Trail with the hordes.

Doing Langley via Horshoe Meadows and the Cottonwoods is a great experience. But it'd be a miracle of that road is open before July 1 and, anyway, people want to climb Whitney because it's the highest.

I didn't find there to be HORDES of people on the Whitney trail when I did it last summer. But maybe I got lucky that a forest fire closed access to WP right after I came in. So all the day hikers who should have been on my tail weren't. We hiked out from the 12,000 foot camp to WP and only saw one other party of 4.

Señor Arroz wrote: If you were in the lottery that's a permit for the Mt. Whitney Trail. Not the Moutaineers Route.

This is only sort of true. It's all the same permit for day use, whether you take the mule (hiking) trail, MT's Route, or the East Face / East But. Only overnight permits for ascents of the North Fork of Lone Pine Creek routes (MT's Route, East Face, East But, etc)  are non-lottery.