Dangers of hanging on gear

Lady on the left behind me is set the medic! don't you know anything?

This is a stupid thread. There’s heat that you can hang on or are very willing to hang on and gear I’d be afraid to wait. If you never hang on gear you’re not climbing close to your limit.

Oh and there’s this climbing style maybe you’ve heard of. It’s called aid. Pretty much all you do is hang on gear. 

You revived a month old thread just to say that it was stupid?

Daniel Melnyk wrote: This is a stupid thread. There’s heat that you can hang on or are very willing to hang on and gear I’d be afraid to wait. If you never hang on gear you’re not climbing close to your limit.

Oh and there’s this climbing style maybe you’ve heard of. It’s called aid. Pretty much all you do is hang on gear. 

I always thought it was safer to french free all those pitches over taking big whips in the past. Now , thanks to Healy, I know I have small balls and don't know how to climb safely.

T Roper wrote:

I always thought it was safer to french free all those pitches over taking big whips in the past. Now , thanks to Healy, I know I have small balls and don't know how to climb safely.

and what are you going to do with that knowledge?

Buck Rio wrote:

and what are you going to do with that knowledge?

Keep pulling, hanging and sometimes sending , climb on as usual basically 

Bill Kirby wrote:  I like to place a couple of opposing nuts at the bottom of a route to keep the direction of pull downwards if possible.

This is confusing.  How exactly do opposing nuts keep the direction of pull downwards?  And direction of pull on what?  

Healyje wrote: 

• having a solid first piece 

What does this mean exactly?  Shouldnt all your pieces be solid?

• up/down zippering

What is up/down zippering?  

• opposition pieces

When do you use opposition pieces and how often do you need them?

• the need to carry and use more trad draws

How many trad draws do you carry? And by "trad draw" I assume you mean alpine draw?
 ...or the drawbacks of stiff sport dogbones in quickdraws for trad climbing. 
What are the drawbacks of stiff sport dogbones?

Aid is a way of learning to determine the quality and variety of placements and the distinction between solid and marginal pro, but has nothing to do with "resting" on gear relative to free climbing as you are never off the gear let alone repeatedly on and off the same piece. 

This is confusing.  Aid climbing is hanging on gear for upward progress and resting on gear on a free climb is also hanging on gear.  What is the distiction between the two?

Also, it's worth noting that lots of aid falls are a result of moving over gear and trying to get back on a piece you've started to move off of.

I didnt know this.  I thought most aid falls were from marginal gear pulling.  

"Aiding everything" is essentially what sport climbing is and defines its dominant characteristic/tactic: repeatedly resting your way up climbs until you can do a clean ascent. 

Hmm...I dont see aid climbing and sport climbing being even remotely similar.  Aid climbing requires you to climb the gear.  Sport climbing requires you to climb the rock.  Even if you rest on a bolt while sport climbing you still have to climb the rock between bolts.

without sport tactics is essentially nil.

What exactly are sport tactics?  Are you equating sport climbing with hangdogging?

I am now dumber from reading the last bits of this thread.

Nothing wrong with a gear hang every once in a while. One thing every new trad climber should do is learn to place good gear they trust. A big mental block can be overcome when you realize that the gear will hold you. The consensus of never hanging is bad as it does not allow a new(er) climber learn to trust gear and see how it behaves under real loads. The other issue I see is that when people hang, they restart the climbing process at that spot and sometimes the rope is still taught. That can affect the gear position. It's better to have the belayer lower you a few feet, give slack and then you climb past the hang spot and inspect the gear as you go by. Just my 2 cents. Again, learn to place gear and practice it on the ground or routes that are well below your top climbing grade. If you don't have a good mentor for trad, hire a qualified guide for the day and go climb trad with them so they can show you. 

Well since Jeff still is being a prick, and now he is posting pics of boulder problems I did the FA of...

Pics of bigger stuff are in the Kern/Lake Isabella area, plenty of rock out there. Boulders are outside of Olancha.

I will go into more detail when his dick-ish antics continue, because whats really "his" secret to keep anyway? 

I only hang dog on psychological pro

spenchur wrote: Well since Jeff still is being a prick, and now he is posting pics of boulder problems I did the FA of...

Pics of bigger stuff are in the Kern/Lake Isabella area, plenty of rock out there. Boulders are outside of Olancha.

I will go into more detail when his dick-ish antics continue, because whats really "his" secret to keep anyway? 

plz tell us more!

Jeff constine wrote: Lady on the left behind me is set the medic! don't you know anything?

no, not her.  i mean the elderly lady in the green shirt.

Howdy. Resident noob here. A real question?

I will likely be placing gear to French free sport climbs, add gear to stretches that are intimidating, and honestly, simply to practice. All on sport routes (ours often are amenable to gear).

I completely understand the mindset of not working gear like bolts. In this case, to practice? It seems reasonable to be falling, and also having the opportunity to see what changes when the rope is taut, when you climb past a piece, all the list of dangers in this thread, by adding gear to sport routes, before getting into leading on gear for real. 

Your two cents? Sorry to drift the thread into something useful, especially on a Friday afternoon.

Best, OLH

Old lady H wrote: Howdy. Resident noob here. A real question?

I will likely be placing gear to French free sport climbs, add gear to stretches that are intimidating, and honestly, simply to practice. All on sport routes (ours often are amenable to gear).

I completely understand the mindset of not working gear like bolts. In this case, to practice? It seems reasonable to be falling, and also having the opportunity to see what changes when the rope is taut, when you climb past a piece, all the list of dangers in this thread, by adding gear to sport routes, before getting into leading on gear for real.

Your two cents? Sorry to drift the thread into something useful, especially on a Friday afternoon.

Best, OLH

you could just bring your rack sport climbing and practice placing gear near the ground. you can still hang or weight it or even jump on it. knowing S Idaho basalt you could get 10 pcs. in before the first bolt

T Roper wrote:

you could just bring your rack sport climbing and practice placing gear near the ground. you can still hang or weight it or even jump on it. knowing S Idaho basalt you could get 10 pcs. in before the first bolt

Lol! 

Well, we had part of my fledgling rack in this week, between a second and third bolt. Tiny gear, it was awesome to see it placed so nicely!

Best, Helen

Well, glory be! Someone who knows the difference between taut and taunt! If you're placing gear on a Black Cliffs sport climb and clipping the bolts as well, feel free to hang or fall all over it. Extend the pieces as you would if you were leading on gear and see for yourself the effect of the rope coming tight on pieces.