Love of climbing, disdain for climbers.

JRZane wrote:

i somehow doubt that.  A few more details on the 'typical' scenario may clarify:

4-6 climbers walk up to a wall with the guidebook open and begin identifying which climbs are which. pointing to the climbs, the climber with the guidebook says "this one here is a 10b, this one is an 11b, that one is a 10d, and that one over there is the 12b."  A member of the group chimes in, "oh the 10b, lets do that one, its a good warm up for me." then proceeds to climb it bolt to bolt complaining about how the holds have too much chalk or the feet are too glassy, or some other excuse.

Ive heard/seen some version of this transaction 3-4 times in my 6 days at RRG in addition to other versions that are a different species.

Thats a classic one for sure, seen it many many times. 

I will say, as far as disdain goes, go to Maple Canyon or Indian Creek on a weekend and study the CO climbers, you'll see the exact same thing as the RRG.

One of my favorite events in Eldo occurs in the parking lot near Supremacy. At least once a year, a pair of random porn-stached dudebros arrive, ready to start their sick proj (or however you youngsters refer to such things) on the Web, but first they're going to "warm up" on Supremacy Crack. The ensuing beat-down on the Ament classic is a pure delight to behold.

climber pat wrote: I hate the phrase "this is a good warm up".  I don't even understand it.  

Honestly, I'm not trying to be a jerk, but warming up becomes extremely important as you start climbing harder grades.  At the grades you are climbing, yeah, there probably is no need to warm up, but once you start climbing harder (and as you get older, though I don't know your age) a warmup becomes absolutely necessary if you want to avoid getting a flash pump and ruining the rest of your day.  A warm up typically starts with something a few grades below your onsight level, and works up to maybe your onsight level or even a bit above it if it is a route you know well.  Typically, I like to do at least two or three routes as a warm up, and I can guarantee you that I can climb much harder and for a much longer time after a proper warm up.

Seth Jones wrote:

Are we still being sarcastic? **Sheepishly hiding behind my quiver of snowboards and splitboards**

Haha! What up Bill???

 That depends.. should I wave a white flag wearing my tele boots? They’re kinda old :(

Bill Kirby wrote:

 That depends.. should I wave a white flag wearing my tele boots? They’re kinda old :(

 Moving to San Francisco end of the month. That’s what’s up!

The Charm city wont be the same

Bill Kirby wrote:

 

 Moving to San Francisco end of the month. That’s what’s up!

Bill, we welcome you to California. What brings you here?

FrankPS wrote:

Bill, we welcome you to California. What brings you here?

Job

News flash: climbers are self-absorbed

What do you want? Some validation? Yeah, there’s tons of that narcissistic spew, cliquey, fart smelling bullshit going down and it’s fucking lame. Except when I do it.

climbing friend,

you go park of rifle mountain - they cannot wait to tell on you exact move to do every move for 100' route, every hold of which type it is, shape, texture, metaphor for the hold like it is fine wine, such as "shark's tooth",""coke bottle," "greasy nip," "snickers bar hold," etc.

In this way when they are telling on others about each movement of route, they may attempt feel quite superior, but they cannot fool the aleks, no, for those who need attempt feel superior are quite inferior, hahaa!

all their flash are belong to me

I think getting offended at someone saying "This is a good warmup" is quite silly.   If I heard that at a new to me crag, I'd be psyched to hear that. For the most part it means the route is well traveled, been cleaned up from all the portable holds, most likely is friendly bolted and has no weird tweaky or scary climbing. I'd rather hear "good warmup" instead of locals quietly watch me suffer and get scared on some obscure choss in the corner that I thought was "a good warmup" because it had the easiest grade on the wall.  And there is no shame in projecting the warmup - you are new to the wall, new to the style. Maybe you get it so dialed, it will be your "good warmup" next trip.

Bill Kirby wrote:

Job

Do you live close? I plan to live within the city limits.

Bill,

I live four hours south of SF, near San Luis Obispo. About halfway between LA and SF.

i think a lot of people are missing the point of the "good warm up" statement.  If its said in earnest, than fantastic.  My (albeit, limited) experience has been people say it to express "This climb isn't my top grade, I'm a much better climber than this 5.XX."

JRZane wrote: Im relatively new to climbing (entering year 4) and as a resident of the Northeast have spent the majority of those climbing years in the gunks or our local poor quality sport crags.  learning to climb traditionally in the gunks, Ive experience more fear falling on bolts than I do my own gear, nevertheless Ive ventured down to RRG twice and am wondering if someone can help give me some insight into my experiences down there.

First trip was with my wife for 4 days, we climbed Muir and PMRP.  By the end, we were making a joke about how many times a day we would either here "this is a good warm up" implying the OTHER climbs they were doing later were MUCH harder.  We also climbed next to a group where a guy swore because he worked at a gym and received samples and pro deals that he was "sponsored by Arcteryx."  These are just a couple select examples that immediately come to mind.

My second trip was Easter weekend.  As you may know it was fairly wet and Day 1 we were stomping my buddies new $250 rope into the mud.  We decided to go to Miguels and potentially split a cheaper rope for the trip and use it as a beater moving forward.  When I asked the worker there if they had any 60m ropes, the response I got from the peanut gallery sitting in the store was "nobody who lives in the Red climbs on a 60" with such a snicker and attitude, me and my partner actually laughed out loud. yes, Im sure there are more than a couple of longer climbs in a place with thousands of climbs, and yes, I understand that sport climbers often chop the first 12' or so, but what kind of response is that? And no, Miguels stocks exactly ZERO 60m ropes. We hung out at the pavilion for about 30 minutes that night before the bullshit spewing from climbers got too deep and we made our escape before drowning.

Ive had my fair share of questionable observations in the Gunks, but this place seems above and beyond the absurd.  I am beginning to realize as much as I love climbing, I don't like climbers.  Am I missing something? Am I just too cynical? What pieces am I missing here??

People sometimes suck. If you went to Muir Valley on Easter weekend... you have to go with an extremely high bullshit tolerance.

You were probably at one of the few crags that was good in the wet conditions, crowds, everyone is crankier than average... How much of this is you projecting your thoughts onto other people? Saying; "this is a good warmup" is hardly criminal, and if you happened to be climbing next to one of those climbs, then yeah, I bet you have heard it a lot in the course of the day. I don't know that many strong climbers who would go to an easy crag on a busy weekend and get a kick out of bragging how good a warmup something is, in order to indirectly tell everyone around them that they climb much harder. Do such people exist? I'm sure. Are there lots of them... don't think so.

Miguel's gear shop... again, "nobody climbs on a 60" can hardly be construed as "you don't climb as hard as we do". There are plenty of very hard climbs that do not require a 70m rope at the red. As far as salesmanship goes, that would be a very poor way to sell you a 70m rope, but if someone said that to me I would not at all take it as a slight/insult/jab directed at me.

Hanging out at the pavilion at Miguel's will get you to hear a LOT of bullshit, true. However, I think I have heard 100x more braggy bullshit coming out from people who are bragging about their hardest 5.10 hangdog than I heard it from someone who had flashed his first 5.13 earlier that day. (if only for the simple reason that there are at least 100x more people in the pavilion who are hangdogging a 5.10, than people who are flashing 5.13). So while the bragging and the silliness is quite thick, I don't think most people are doing it in order to impress the random bystanders with their climbing prowess. The ones talking the loudest are college kids that are on their first outdoor club outing, you have to forgive them their puppy-like excitement.

Regardless - I think Seth's advice remains the best. I think part of the answer is that you need to zen up a little and pay less attention to those details...

I started backpacking before climbing..."my base weight is 5.273 pounds. What's yours?" People are over rated. I would suggest avoid doing anything outdoors during the busy times or at the busy places, and don't be engaging.

My sister once told me that she loves everything about the community garden, except the community.

I don't like going to the Red anymore. It's too stressful with all the people, the parking, it's always wet everywhere, and more or less the attitudes you described. I much prefer the Obed, the New, etc.

JRZane wrote: i think a lot of people are missing the point of the "good warm up" statement.  If its said in earnest, than fantastic.  My (albeit, limited) experience has been people say it to express "This climb isn't my top grade, I'm a much better climber than this 5.XX."

I really wonder if you are just taking it the wrong way.  While I'm sure that there may be people out there who use that term to spray that a route is easy for them, I have honestly never heard it said that way that I am aware of other than as a joke about a route that is obviously way above the rating that the climber saying it can climb.  I know everyone loves to get offended about everything, but it makes life so much more enjoyable if you just don't worry about what route someone is calling a warmup.    

JRZane wrote: i think a lot of people are missing the point of the "good warm up" statement.  If its said in earnest, than fantastic.  My (albeit, limited) experience has been people say it to express "This climb isn't my top grade, I'm a much better climber than this 5.XX."

Yeah, that is literally what they mean. Maybe you are missing the point. It could be bullshit or it could be a perfectly humble statement of fact.

I warm up on my proj, dawg...

With the style of climbing at the red, there really isn't a need to warm up on anything else.