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Using two knots to shorten a quad: any thoughts?

Original Post
Wade T · · Grants Pass, OR · Joined Feb 2008 · Points: 5

I like using the quad anchor for top roping and multi-pitch moderates. It's redundant and "equalizee", and, it's a little bulky, gives people more confidence. 

Anyone have any thoughts on using two knots to adjust and shorten a quad?  

Gunkiemike · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2009 · Points: 3,687

I don't see a real problem with it.

NegativeK · · Nevada · Joined Jul 2016 · Points: 40

You can also triple over the cordo instead of doubling it. Sticking with Latin prefixes, it'd be a "sex". Greek's "hex" or "hexa" might be less cumbersome.

Wade T · · Grants Pass, OR · Joined Feb 2008 · Points: 5

Nice neg-K ! The "sex". Triple over the cordo. That does it. Thx

 

NegativeK · · Nevada · Joined Jul 2016 · Points: 40

Hired a guide for a self-rescue course, and he also taught me that guides are an absolute _wealth_ of little efficiency tips and tricks.

20/20 lack of surprise.

Russ Keane · · Salt Lake · Joined Feb 2013 · Points: 392

At that point, you just have way too much cord.

Bill Lawry · · Albuquerque, NM · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 1,814

Is it then time here to recite Goldilocks and the Three Bears?  ;-)

Wishing that on every route I took no more and no less gear than I needed.

dahigdon · · phoenix, Az · Joined Jan 2015 · Points: 195

Those knots look like a real bitch to tie with that much cord... Whats the benefit of the quad over a typical master point with that cord? Is it just the dual "master points"?

Nathan Hui · · San Diego, CA · Joined Feb 2016 · Points: 0
dahigdon wrote:

Those knots look like a real bitch to tie with that much cord... Whats the benefit of the quad over a typical master point with that cord? Is it just the dual "master points"?

That,  better load sharing, and the ability to have it pretied and applied to basically any two bolt anchor without too much fuss.  The nice thing is you get (in the case of a quad) 2 fully independent masterpoints.  I guess in the case of the sexallete?? you get 3, but why you need that many is beyond me.

Michael Abend · · Boise, ID · Joined May 2017 · Points: 60

If you want a shorter quad you should try a mini quad made from a double length runner. I find them very handy. 

King Tut · · Citrus Heights · Joined Aug 2012 · Points: 430

FFS since when did you need 4 locking biners and a quad to TR?

If you need to load share (equalization is a myth) the anchor you are using to TR then you need to find a better anchor.

Carabiners do not become unclipped from anchors when you are climbing below them. stop. period.end.

The point is to stop focusing on what is ridiculously over safe and keep your focus on the anchor itself. Can't tell you how many times I have seen this sort of thing and yet the person who set it up blindly assumed the bolts were fine and could not tell you what they clipped. All the locking biners and slings in the world will not otherwise save you.

Mark Says · · Basalt, CO · Joined Jul 2017 · Points: 395

Quickdraws are excellent sport route anchors. The best part is you can use them as quickdraws.

Spend a little extra if it makes you feel safer, or if like me, you just want to differentiate them from your regular draws. I'm usually lowering within 15-30 seconds of making the anchors.

physnchips · · Boulder, CO · Joined Jan 2016 · Points: 0

Mark, I think you missed the multi-pitch part of OPs description. A quad is great for multi-pitch routes that have a couple bolts at anchor stations. 

Everyone else, for the most part I agree on the all those lockers being overkill, but you don't really know the context of his situation (top-roping a big group of kids or something may warrant overkill) so let's simmer down just a touch. 

King Tut · · Citrus Heights · Joined Aug 2012 · Points: 430
physnchips wrote:

Mark, I think you missed the multi-pitch part of OPs description. A quad is great for multi-pitch routes that have a couple bolts at anchor stations. 

Everyone else, for the most part I agree on the all those lockers being overkill, but you don't really know the context of his situation (top-roping a big group of kids or something may warrant overkill) so let's simmer down just a touch. 

You sure AF don't need a quad at 2 bolts on a multi-pitch. Just clove off to them both and bring up the second.

Look, not trying to bust balls here....but a whole generation is bringing along a ton of crap they don't need....and consequently clogging up routes and having epics with over complicated systems and store bought doodads.

Figure out ways to bring less, not more.

TJ Brumme · · Morocco · Joined Dec 2011 · Points: 2,203
bruno-cx wrote:

Sweet freaking Jesus.

Just use two reversed and opposed biners if you think need to double up on the attachment point.

Don’t do this. Opposing gates, but not opposite orientation.

Andrew Rice · · Los Angeles, CA · Joined Jan 2016 · Points: 11

If you're using a quad regularly on two bolts I'd just get a shorter quad and be done with it. Your cordellette must be at least 25 feet to need that much take up.

King Tut · · Citrus Heights · Joined Aug 2012 · Points: 430
T. Brumme wrote:

Don’t do this. Opposing gates, but not opposite orientation.

Is it textbook?

No.

I'd be interested to hear of one single case where it ever failed.

Mark Says · · Basalt, CO · Joined Jul 2017 · Points: 395
physnchips wrote:

Mark, I think you missed the multi-pitch part of OPs description. A quad is great for multi-pitch routes that have a couple bolts at anchor stations. 

Everyone else, for the most part I agree on the all those lockers being overkill, but you don't really know the context of his situation (top-roping a big group of kids or something may warrant overkill) so let's simmer down just a touch. 

I didn't miss it, I was just offering some drive by commentary from someone with just enough experience to have gone through the quick draws > cordellette > quad > omgthisisntrocketscience > draws evolution of single pitch climbing.

I also find the quad to be a pain on multi pitch, I'd rather just carry a couple of lockers and swing or a cordellette and let the anchors dictate its configuration. But I wasn't commenting on that until now. :) 

Kirtis Courkamp · · Golden · Joined Mar 2011 · Points: 378

The quad excels in multi-pitch rappels just plop it on and you and your partner each clip in. No more clusterfucked anchors when rappelling and every one is nice and redundant and its supper efficient. Try it the next time you have 3 or more raps. Also if you are a trad climber you probably carry a cordellette with you if not you should go buy one and start using it. 

Bill Lawry · · Albuquerque, NM · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 1,814

I am generally climbing gear routes. And I do not use the quad with gear anchors.

But we found the quad to be extremely efficient as a lead-swapping threesome on a 15 pitch route with all-bolted anchors. 

Stagg54 Taggart · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2006 · Points: 10
King Tut wrote:

You sure AF don't need a quad at 2 bolts on a multi-pitch. Just clove off to them both and bring up the second.

Look, not trying to bust balls here....but a whole generation is bringing along a ton of crap they don't need....and consequently clogging up routes and having epics with over complicated systems and store bought doodads.

Figure out ways to bring less, not more.

^^^ This. ^^^

The quad is just a solution in search of a problem... If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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