Best All Around Alpine Boot for out west?

Summary: In the old days, double plastic boots were the standard for all ice and mountaineering, even in California. Today, REI, which is the dominant brick-and-mortar source for gear with try-on, carries exactly ZERO double boots. Have all alpinists gone to single boots? Do I have to buy 5 boots, one for every slightly different thing, when my old doubles were fine for everything? Please reply here to let the community (perhaps just poor ice-deprived californians) know, if you have bought boots for ice or alpine mountaineering in the last few years,
1)what boot you bought and how it went
2) why you would not buy double boots for general alpine adventures to 4000m
3) where to go to try them on first in CA
4) what is it like to put on your boot first thing in the AM after a night sleeping in the snow?

——————————————————————————————-
Long Version:
Years ago : Great! No more uncomfortable Koflachs! double boots like Asolo are comfortable! Today, REI the dominant brick-and-mortar retailer where I live, carries exactly ZERO double boots, and here in California, it seems like they are extinct (except you can order them on line if you swear you are climbing over 20,000 feet). Is this really the case, or is there a secret store somewhere for american alpinists, you all go to Europe for boots, or ….?

Those who accuse me of being a cranky old fart not wanting to change are probably right, but… none of the boots I looked at at REI (mostly Sportiva for $375- $500) seemed to have much insulation at all, not more than around 4 mm. If you’re standing in deep snow at a long belay, won’t you freeze your toes off? And let’s not forget: The original stated purpose of double boots was to put the liners in your tent over night, so in the AM you don’t put your feet into frozen boots. What happened to that? How is putting these single layer boots on frozen?

There is a $500 class of single boot, and a $375 class. What is the difference?

My intended use here is an all-around alpine boot, must be suitable for vertical ice climbing and multi-day mountaineering to 4000m, from California to Colorado. Yes, the stores would have me buy 5 boots, one for every slightly different use. Not gonna happen. My old Asolo double boots were fine for everything (if heavy). I walked some 15 km in one day in them, no discomfort, I’ve hiked in them in 60F no problem, showshoe all day moderate conditions, no problems, great for vertical ice too. I want a boot that will do all that.

My Basic Thesis: Double boots are heavy, but are never, ever “too hot” in snow/ice. In fact, they’re never really hot at all. Since they work fine, why shouldn’t I just get the same? It looks to me like these light single-layer boots are for Euros climbing from a nice warm hut, back in the heated hut for espresso and quiche by 3:30 every day, not mountaineers. Please, please, tell me if you think I’m right or wrong, and the best boot for this use.

Thanks very very much for any input.

———————————————-Some Data———————————

Single boots:
Sportiva Nepal EVO GTX $510 35.7 oz
Sportiva Trango Cube $375 710 g/ 25 oz (Trango ice cube says insulated and integrated gaiter 727 g)
Scarpa Charmoz II $375 27 oz.

Asolo 8000 $495 DOUBLE BOOT 1200g / 42 oz - yah, that’s a lot heavier than these single boots!

I bought some Zamberlain Paines two years ago and love them. They're a single boot with an built in gaiter. I bought them exactly for what you're talking about. They are great for steep ice and general mountaineering. I feel like they are a four season boot for anything under 4000 m. Double boots seemed too clunky for steep ice and dry approaches. The single boot won't get me up Denali but they're great for everything else.

I feel like the double boot market has almost shifted over to alpine touring boots. AT boots have an insulated liner, are super warm, will take a crampon, and walk really well on snow. The bonus is I can ski down.

The Regular Trango and Charmoz aren't up to winter waterfall ice climbing in terms of temps. These are springtime alpine boots, and excel at this. The uppers are thin.

I have three seasons of Adirondack ice climbing in my Scarpa Phantom 6000s. They do exactly what they're built for - Keeping my feet warm without weighing 10 lbs/boot.

That being said, Sportiva dropped a bomb on the double boot market with the release of the G2SMs. If Sportiva fits your foot, I'd give the G2s a try. I tried them on last winter & I was thoroughly impressed. Impressed enough to switch from my Phantoms if money wasn't an option ...

thepirate1 wrote:REI, which is the dominant brick-and-mortar source for gear with try-on, carries exactly ZERO double boots.

Well, not exactly zero. REI carries Sportiva Baruntses. rei.com/product/859910/la-s…. But finding them in stock in any given store at this time of year could be difficult.

FWIW I use double boots (Scarpa Phantom 6000s) for ice-climbing and winter mountaineering. But my feet get cold easily. Here in CO lots of people seem to manage fine in Sportiva Nepal Evos.

For your specific ask, I'd go with Nepals or Scarpa Mont Blanc. Durable, time tested for all-around application. They're also bulletproof for schwacky approaches. The lighter dedicated super gaiter style ice-specific boots with complicated fabric uppers may be less so (just conjecture on my part).

If you're cheap enough to want to be one and done for years to come on boots then I think that's the only game in town.

Ps always in stock in Seattle REI Flagship.

Pps - I think the real value of doubles is being able to fully dry the boots on multi day trips (not sipping espresso in heated huts) , as opposed to just warmth. For weekend warrior stuff I don't care if my nepal isn't exactly bone dry the second morning. If you really care about this then I'd look hard at a doubles.

It seems that more people go out for a day cragging icefalls in the winter aiming for technical difficulty over multi day trips. The manufacturers aim toward what the market wants (or think they want).

Since most of my climbing is done during three seasons I use scarpa rebel pros. They're warm enough for anything I'll be doing in WA, when it's coldest mid winter I'm out snowboarding anyhow. I use a vapor barrier liner sock to keep from wetting out my boot with sweat. Put my socks close to my core overnight, start camp chores in the morning with dry socks I slept in to warm up the boots. Switch out socks shortly before we start climbing in the morning. A little bit of a pita, but it gets them warm.

Last fall I purchased the Scarpa Mont Blanc Pro GTX. (The boot with the elastic gator/cuff.). I had been climbing in the Charmox, but wanted a boot for winter ice and alpine climbing. The Charmoz is definitely a summer boot. The Mont Blancs are awesome! I did a lot of walking in them prior to winter and they were even more comfortable than the Charmoz. Zero break in needed. They were great climbing WI 3/4. I did get a little cold in the toes, but that was while belaying in temps around 15 degrees. As soon as I started moving my toes warmed. I will use these for summer ice, and hopefully next summer in the alps. The only question you ask which I can't address is how the boot feels in the morning after a night in a tent. But that is more a function of how well you keep your feet warm at night and how your store the boots. I purchased my boots at REI.

Also, I prefer Scarpa because the toe box is a little bit wider than La Sportiva.

I have evos and spantiks covers me 3k-7k meters, both I got used for under 4. I was open to options, just went with the cheapest /best condition I could find, climbing doesn't have that much to do with the boot.

I think it depends on how much you plan to use them on multi day trips. I have some Batura GTX 2.0's and love them for winter climbing but feel bad about taking them through loose scree and bushwhacking with them. I feel like the super gaiter would get destroyed very quick. Although they are slightly lighter than the Nepals I would rather do a long tough approach with the Nepal Evos. I just think they would hold up better and since they have a lower cuff I feel like you can move quicker with them.

Order from Zappos. free shipping on returns

First let me thank all of you for really helpful and amazing comments! Thanks thanks thanks!

OK now, a new issue: I tried on some Sportiva Nepal EVOs and some Scarpa Charmoz.

• **I WAS TOTALLY SHOCKED AT HOW LITTLE SUPPORT THESE BOOTS HAD!

Don't your calves burn out while you're placing screws?????

True... I may have learned to ice climb one generation after koflachs, when any flex at all was considered a great, new thing, but am I really so out of touch? Wouldn't one want a more rigid boot for ice?

THANK YOU again for all your input, but would appreciate hearing from people who place screws.

Hey, pirate, I would recommend either La Sportiva Baturas or Scarpa Phantom Techs. They both excel in ice climbing, pretty lightweight for what they are and super warm (because of integrated gators). They are pricey, but they're in the category of hybrid boots (sort of integrated double boots). So they are may be your ticket.

About your categories of $500 boots and $375 boots - if you need any winter ice climbing boots they would start around $500. $300 boots are normally summer alpine mountain walking boots. There are boots that are around $400 (LS Trango Extreme aka "Silver Bullets") - they are good technical ice climbing boots for warmer climates or your spring climbing.