Totem Basic Cams are HERE

JLP wrote: It is very equipment dependent. To measure Rockwell with, say, an inexpensive pendulum type device and whatever tip, the results are going to be very operator dependent.

Which is why it's done as a comparative measurement against certified samples in the expected range of what you're measuring; it removes the influence of the operator. In any case, the range of operator influence in the results is nowhere near large enough to explain the 20 or 30 point variations I found. A point or two, sure. But not 20 or 30.

JLP wrote: You're agreeing with me and furthering my point. If it says 6061-T6, it probably is.

Sorry about that bit; I thought you were saying that you needed to be Boeing to get certified material. My bad.

JLP wrote:I do like the softening by "old school hardening" theory. Somehow I picture an oven meant for horse shoes, built in the early 1900's.

Unsubstantiated story I heard was heating them with a torch and tossing them in a bucket of water. Another, and more likely, story I heard (from the 3rd party that validated my results) is that the extrusion house may have been counting on the heat of the extrusion process to heat treat the bars rather than doing a proper heat treat on them. Only way to tell would be a crystalline analysis of the samples, and while the guy I sent them to was more than happy to do for me as a favor, he wasn't so thrilled with CCH getting a hold of the results of a test that would have otherwise cost them quite a bit of money. And since a hardness test was sufficient to show that the samples were not in fact 6061-T6 we took a pass on further testing.

Yup, and since John is not the past employee I heard the heat-with-a-torch story from I personally think the chances of funny things going on there metallurgy-wise are pretty high.

I agree with the impressions of the review.

I just got a full set here that I can't wait to go out and scratch up. The size differences on the reds (between Totem and CCH) are barely noticeable to me (how long does it take to wear .050" off anyway?

The build quality seems great and they feel just like the original aliens...

Got the Red, Yellow & Green Totem Basic Cams in the mail today. Ordered them on 10/5, got them on 10/13. Interestingly, they were shipped UPS Ground from Portland, Oregon on 10/7.

Interesting to see their overlap vs a 0.5 C4 and 2, 1 & 0 C3. See pic. The red Alien is just slightly smaller than the #0.5 (purple) C4 and the green "Alien" is slightly smaller than a #2 (yellow) C3.

Fills a good gap in my rack as I don't have the 0.4 or 0.3 C4s.

See what I'm talking about?

It is so funny to see people compare cams by just a glance at the heads. Especially when trying to compare Black Diamond C4s to others. BD C4 have a double axle.

The Purple BD and the Red Totem Basic have almost the same range.

Black Diamond C4 - .5 (Purple) = 19mm to 33mm

Totem Basic .95 (RED) = 19mm to 31mm

So really, they are the same size cam. Cause who uses a cam in the up 25% of the range.

I've found visually comparing them helps a bunch. From the picture I can see that the Totem Red will fit in a more shallow slot than the purple C4.

And yes, the Totem Red is slightly smaller than the C4 -- 2mm, that is. And yes, even if you only use both cams no more than 75% extended, the purple C4 will hold slightly better in a crack at the higher end of its range compared to the Totem Red because it is slightly bigger.

A visual comparison is a good indicator of where you might have overlaps or holes in your rack.

Another person might have filled out this same gap b/w the purple C4 and the yellow C3 with the 0.4 and 0.3 C4. I chose the Totem Basic cams because I think they'll give me more placement options (like piton scars).

Does anyone know if Totem has plans to make smaller basics? I never used aliens, but from what I've read, the smallest sizes are where they really excel.

Simon Hatfield wrote:Does anyone know if Totem has plans to make smaller basics? I never used aliens, but from what I've read, the smallest sizes are where they really excel.

Yes and No. Once you got below the Green Alien the design changed. The cams were too small to use the internal spring design so they went back to the normal external spring setup. This made the head width of the cam WIDER than other options in that size range. In areas where the cracks were DEEP (Moab, IC) the wider head width didn't make a difference in placements so the Blue and Black Aliens still were good. In other areas where the cracks bottomed out or where pin scared the wider head width was a liability for more placements.

I think once you get below a Green Alien, BD C3s or Master Cams are a better choice.

That said, I too have heard from Totem that they'll eventually get to making other sizes.

Are they still that super-soft aluminum that CCH made them out of? I prefer the "normal" aluminum of WC or BD, metolius is unnecessarily hard, IMO, and the old Aliens were so soft that the cams deformed if you fell on them hard.

Functionality-wise, how would you expect these Totem Basics to perform better/worse than Metolious Mastercams of the same size?

I find the Mastercams size 1 and smaller are fantastic in pin scars in granite. Would the Totems work better? Why?

I have no experience with offsets.

Spri wrote:Are they still that super-soft aluminum that CCH made them out of? I prefer the "normal" aluminum of WC or BD, metolius is unnecessarily hard, IMO, and the old Aliens were so soft that the cams deformed if you fell on them hard.

Boy, that shows that you don't know what you are talking about.

Killis Howard wrote:Now that I'm dirty broke again, I'm gonna see which ones start having brazing issues and blown heads first, and then buy a couple of the other company's.

Always a solid plan with new gear. Even new old gear.

Does anybody else get absolutely nothing out of the bitchy technical wanking? It must be engineers' nature or something ;).

After placing an order on the Totem website, how long has it been taking folks to receive the order?

Took 8 days from order to receipt from Oregon to New York.

4 days from order to receipt.

Heads up, a box of 30 of these Totem Basics were stolen in Portland Oregon. If anyone sees any suspicions sales (brand new Totem basics from a non-climber Meth head type for instance) please report it on Cascadeclimbers.com attention Plaidman. http://cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/841204/all/Possible_stolen_gear_being_sol

...and if you were thinking of giving Totems for Christmas, please do so as to support them in their time of need, and be generous if the previously fast shipments are not duplicated.

Regards to all.

Anyone had a chance to get out and use the Totem Basics over the past few months since this thread went up? Just wondering how the most recent comparisons of Totem, Fixe, and the originals are looking.

Mark S wrote: Boy, that shows that you don't know what you are talking about.

Doesn't sound like you've ever seen a well used one.

Has anyone else had trouble with the trigger cables severing themselves on Totem Basics?

The first time this happened, I blamed the placement, since the cam's stem was forced to bend sharply over an edge when I fell on it, and there was a coarse grain/pepple there. This was the blue Totem Basic in the photos below. It failed. I'm not sure if I'd ever fallen on it before or not.

The second time is with the green one, again shown below. This time, there wasn't any way the trigger cable could've contacted the rock while being loaded. In this case, the other two lobes of the cam held. I'm not sure if I'd ever fallen on this one before either, but I don't think I had. So, 2 out of 2 of my Totem Basics have ripped their trigger cables apart when falling on them, and one was clearly not placed in a manner that should've put the cables at risk.

If you look closely, it appears the cables on both cams were severed where the little bead is. Perhaps this is a weak point. Perhaps the cables are a bit too short when the cam lobes deform a bit under load?

Be it noted that I've taken dozens of falls on Wild Country Zeros of similar size, and never had one fail. While I realize my experiences are merely anecdotal, I suspect there is a weakness with the trigger cables on the Totem Basics.