Mountaineering Physical Conditioning

My name is Jake. Im a 22 year old from Kalamazoo, Michigan. One of my father's co-workers son's named Bo Parfet (BoParfet.com) has climbed the seven summits, including everest, cho oyu etc. I have been reading and reading and reading about mountaineering and want to take the next step. I got a few brochures from Alpine Ascents out of Seattle and I think I want to do a 6 day moutaineering course followed by a climb of Mt.Baker next season. My question to anyone with experience is this:
1- What kind of physical condition do I need to be in?

I am 5 11, 225 lbs, but have plenty of muscle. I have started shifting my physical training from lifting heavy to more of an endurance improving workout. I have played ice hockey, ran track, cross country and played soccer. I am just wondering what kinds of workouts specifically I need to be doing to prepare.

Thanks for your time. Jake

Walk up hill for a long time with a heavy backpack. Seriously. The AA guys will be able to take care of the rest. Some squats never hurt, and neither did good mornings. Just get ready to want it, and you'll be fine. Good luck in your future adventures!

Yep, hike hills with a pack and get your cardio up. Stuff on top of that also never hurts..

And if you don't have hills, hit the gym and get the muscles hiking hills would work. Squats, lunges, core workouts, stuff that works your calves...etc.

All the above. Lungs, quads and calf muscles. Do it until it hurts, then drink some 'Crank forearm fuel' and do it again.

Instead of spending X amount of dollars why not try just hanging near a mountain town with access 2 mtn routes. tetons or sierras where ever. make some friends & start hikeing the mtns. Maybe you will just meet the guides make pals & get taught after all ya need partners
dont ya theres lots 2 learn about mtn travel.
sometimes finding out about yourself.

In addition to all of the above, you should try to get yourself on some peaks at elevation to see how your body handles it.

check out Alaska Mountain Guides 12 or 24 day ski mountaineering courses. They do a lot of intensive training for high altitude mountaineering. (alaskamountainguides.com).

I would reccomend running uphill with a pack. Then walking at elevation wont be as much of a shock.

Dude I feel your pain! For those who know nothing about MI and have all this great advice...bud out! Just kidding. Man I lived in MI part time for a year and oh man, it's hard to find outdoor workouts there that will get you ready for peaks. But, it's possible. Camp out and get good at it. get all the little things down: drying wet socks, cooking, staying warm... that stuff you can do in MI cause the weather sucks and that's good cause the weather sucks in the mt's too!

That's course from AAI is the way to go! They are great and will teach you things the right way and WAY better than some of these bums running around mtn towns who are one miss step away from a flight for life...

As for the Physical training...Dude, I'm not dissing you but, you're BMI is way high! You need to get that down or no matter how much you "want" it, it ain't going to happen. Gota think about is like this: if you want it that bad train your guts out (in a smart way)

Training: Get used to eating right on the go. GU and gels are your friend. electrolite pills are a great way to go in the hills. Simple fast foods that won't mess with your gut even when you're nerves are maybe giving you GI issues.

Don't run up hills with a pack on and for god-sake don't ever run down them with a pack on! If you had hills I'd say running them is a great way to go...if you're a runner. If not (and since you don't have hills) I'm going to rec. treadmill walking with a pack at the steepest setting (AFTER YOU WARM UP FOR 10-15Min) WARM UP WARM UP WARM UP WAM UP EVery time WARM UP that is very impartant!!!!

The down side to this is that you don't get the quad busting downhill training so for that ride a bike or jog outside if you like to run. I'd shoot for treadmill workouts in the 3-5 hour range with a 20lb pack to start and work up from there. Eat and drink while you sweat your ass off too! Get good and doing this on the go. Really you need to get your bodys muscles to recruit more mydocondria till you're at the point where going for 24-48 hours (with good water/food) is a truly only a mental one not a physical one.

Good luck and get out there to Baker and get those skills under your belt from real cert. guides. Penny wise and pound foolish not to.

my advice might seem a little over the top so I'll just give you a little background on me: I'm a colorado climber and ultra runner. I run 50-70 miles a week and do long weekend runs reg. in the 20-30 mile range with races up to 50miles in 10-12 hours.

I love the cascades and couldn't think of a better range to start getting the skills you're after. (gota hit up squamish too;)
Good luck and have fun,
Aj

Woodchuck ATC wrote:All the above. Lungs, quads and calf muscles. Do it until it hurts, then drink some 'Crank forearm fuel' and do it again.

Haha, crank forearm fuel...

Goto your nearest pub; get utterly shitface wasted.
Smoke 1 pack of unfiltered camels.
Get a full ash tray; pour a scotch in it; put in water bottle.
Get home around 3:30a.

Now, goto stand-in freezer, put mixture in.
Put coat, hat, & gloves on and climb in; yes, goggles are fine, holding ice axe or tools are a plus.
5:30a, climb out and drink mixture.
Run the biggest flight of stairs you can find.
Run until your heart almost explodes.

This should replicate certain physiological elements you experience on the mountain.

Climb On!

Augmented in discussion from Dale (old school from Greg Hamilton).

Yeah Mark, almost perfect.

My mountaineering conditioning often envolves many pints of Guinness (at least 8) followed by no sleep and severely early wake-ups.

Make sure you put your pack together at the last minute and make sure you forget at least one important item.

Slog....for....the....rest....of....the ....day/week/month on the mountain.

A very good indication of your conditioning is the color of the bile in your first barf-fest. If it's yellow, lucky fellow! If it's red, go back to bed.

EMT wrote: I'm an ... ultra runner.

Awesome! I'm more an ultimatum runner.

Everytime I even think about it, I give myself an ultimatum ...

to drink more beer, or wine, or both,

and scotch, too.

Okay, maybe a few ultimatums, but that's where I draw the line

I am with some of the people in here... Hike hills with a backpack. But also use water to hike up with and empty it out at the top to save your knees. Build up over time as you need your tendons and ligaments to strengthen in your feet and knees.

A few other things you can do is get starting your stove down to the shortest time possible. Running is great for you (without weights would be much better for your knees.) Learn all the food that you really like that is easy, light and fast to cook. Learn how to cross your fingers and toes for good weather is also an invaluable tool.

That's great you want to give mountaineering a try... it might very well change your life (make you move out west so you can acquire skills you need to climb mountains w/out a guide).

My quick thoughts on training for your objective:
- emphasize LUNGS AND LEGS. Get a pack and a gallon of water. go as fast as you can maintain up the biggest hill you can find. Pour water out at top. hike down. Fill water up at base in a stream ideally. REPEAT. Increase duration and number of jugs as you get more fit.
- remember rest days
- gradually increase work load when you start a new routine - beware of overuse injuries right off the bat. THINK: KNEES, CONNECTIVE TISSUES, ETC
- eat more nutritionally dense food - fruits and veggies. Cutting back on cows milk helps me reduce swelling when I'm training hard.

One more quick lesson for you:
- As a guide in the Sierra, the most common category of people who develop ALTITUDE SICKNESS (like a hangover= need to come down), is people like you - fit, young, never been to altitude and have no idea how to pace themselves over the course of a 12 hour day... Check your ego at the trailhead and pace yourself.
- Remember to breath on the way down... often people breath less on the way down (including myself) because they aren't working hard... but the body still needs to process teh CO2 and O2. This is also when a lot of clients start getting Acute Mountain Sickness, and I will even sometimes get a headache if I'm not making myself breath, even if I'm well acclimated.
- Drinkn lots of water.
- prevention is everything w/AMS

Best wishes Jake

When you get tired of hiking up and down hills with a pack, or if you don't have any hills available, you can always go to a tire store and ask for a tire they are throwing away. They will give it to you for free, as it costs them money to dispose of them.

Drill a small hole, put some webbing through it and make a 10ft or so lanyard that you can attach to yourself. Put weight in the tire and drag it down the street.

You can get cheap weight by buying play sand or filling the tire with rocks. Play with different attachment points: waist, shoulders, or pulling it with your hands. Pull it walking backwards, forwards, sideways.

Simple, cheap, effective.

David Aguasca! wrote:When you get tired of hiking up and down hills with a pack, or if you don't have any hills available, you can always go to a tire store and ask for a tire they are throwing away. They will give it to you for free, as it costs them money to dispose of them. Drill a small hole, put some webbing through it and make a 10ft or so lanyard that you can attach to yourself. Put weight in the tire and drag it down the street. You can get cheap weight by buying play sand or filling the tire with rocks. Play with different attachment points: waist, shoulders, or pulling it with your hands. Pull it walking backwards, forwards, sideways. Simple, cheap, effective.

that's a good idea...

dirtbag wrote: One more quick lesson for you: - As a guide in the Sierra, the most common category of people who develop ALTITUDE SICKNESS (like a hangover= need to come down), is people like you - fit, young, never been to altitude and have no idea how to pace themselves over the course of a 12 hour day... Check your ego at the trailhead and pace yourself. - Remember to breath on the way down... often people breath less on the way down (including myself) because they aren't working hard... but the body still needs to process the CO2 and O2. This is also when a lot of clients start getting Acute Mountain Sickness, and I will even sometimes get a headache if I'm not making myself breath, even if I'm well acclimated. - Drinkn lots of water. - prevention is everything w/AMS Best wishes Jake

There's some good points here, however AMS has nothing to do with physical fitness, and time & experience in the hills; i.e. prevention. It can happen to anyone; yes even guides -- I know a shock, sometimes those at the center of their own universe are not immune to the frailty of human pathophysiology, even more susceptible to the ego problem.

There really isn't enough research to offer what exactly is going on to predict how/when AMS will onset, other than being at altitude -- which indicates a pressure change problem, the amount of oxygen available stays constant. There is something to predisposition though, if you are susceptible, you will more than likely continue to be.

If you're exerting at altitude and feel bad; but rest or slowing the pace makes you feel better, guess what might not be onsetting? You're just over-exerting/over-taxing your body's ability at that moment.

For me, whatever the reason, I can feel like crap until I hit about 12.5 then I usually feel just fine. Could be I just gun it until my body forces me to slow it down a bit. I guess my indicator is if I'm still feeling crappy and getting worse after I rest &/or slow it down a bit, then maybe AMS has onset.

My body does seem to make an adjustment, though.

I guess I just need to decide what's best my alternative at that point when it's not going away. A matter of the best way to deal with the symptoms and the risk I'm in; also to consider the risk I can put others in.

Mark Nelson wrote: There's some good points here, however AMS has nothing to do with physical fitness, and time & experience in the hills; i.e. prevention. It can happen to anyone; yes even guides -- I know a shock, sometimes those at the center of their own universe are not immune to the frailty of human pathophysiology, even more susceptible to the ego problem.

Cause is different than correlation. It is very common to see fit, inexperienced (at altitude) over-exert themselves because a) they know they are in shape and b) they don't have a respect for altitude, hence check the ego at the trailhead... just wanted Jake to learn from my hard-earned lesson.

As far as the "ego problem"... IMHO, it's not a problem unless it leads you be rude to people or make bad decisions in the mountains. A strong ego can be helpful on sketchy pitches or when you approach an ominous looking wall.

Mark Nelson wrote: There really isn't enough research to offer what exactly is going on to predict how/when AMS will onset, other than being at altitude -- which indicates a pressure change problem, the amount of oxygen available stays constant. There is something to predisposition though, if you are susceptible, you will more than likely continue to be.

I'm sure there is some research out there that concludes dehydration as a common cause of AMS.

To train high altitude cardio at lower elevations, try hiking or walking with a mouth full of water, only breathing through your nose, do this until it burns, swallow, catch breath, take swig, repeat. Or just run on a treadmill with a taped nose and only breathing through a snorkel, seriously, I'm not being funny here, it's hardcore and it works.

Do any of these workouts regularly plus some stairmaster, hauling heavy pack uphill, etc. and you'll crush...

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