Sunset Park closure....

From what I saw this Sunday I don't see how Sunset will stay open much longer, and it will be well deserved. Of course, at the "toprope area" it was a mob scene. A group of at least 10 people toproping complete with boombox, many pairs of shoes, and stuff in the middle of the trail. I talked with them about there behavior and they were very polite.

The toproping must end.....period. This area needs to be closed or the anchors moved down and out of reach.

Also there was cars parked on the side of the road next to a no parking sign. I don't know if it was climbers or not,but it will not matter to the park service.

If the park service closes Sunset to climbing it will be totally our fault and not the park service. We represent very poorly

Bbrock I agree with moving the anchors down. The last time I was there about 3 van loads of people unloaded and setup all in that area. They blocked the lower access trail and a lot of the upper area above the anchors. Trying to talk to them sometimes goes well and sometimes not. But maybe moving the anchors would help, it wouldn't be so easy for them. I'm down to help do whatever I can, I love Sunset.

Thanks for stepping up and talking to this group, bbrock.

Just to throw another opinion in here,maybe they should just close this (toprope area) area for a while before we start moving/removing bolts. Maybe I'm making to much out of it but drilling new holes to get rid of problem climbers rubs me the wrong way. I'd rather see some of Sunset closed then all of Sunset closed. And I echo Justin's statement, I'll do whatever I can. I was hoping if I didn't go climbing there that would be 2 less people crowding the trail/parking , but now i feel like if I don't go I'm not there to help with the groups who are causing most of the problems in the first place.

They were kids around the age of 18 or whatever. Again they were very polite and listened to what I had to say. Hell, as soon as I left they may have just turned on the stereo again... I don't know. There should be some kind of push at climbing gyms to make people aware of these issues. I would assume these were gym rat kids out for a day of toproping and fun. Nothing negative meant by that, they just seemed to be unaware of appropriate outdoor behavior. When I was there age I could have cared less about acting appropriate and most likely would have started a fight for someone even mentioning I was acting poorly. Again props to the kids for acting courteous, but I'm sure their conduct was seen by many others.

As for the overlook being shut down for a while, the climbs there are some of the best Sunset has to offer, but whatever. As long as the anchors are within arms reach I think the problem will continue.

There is simply no excuse for the parking situation though. There are plenty of places to park that require only a short walk back to the crag. Also when walking through the neighborhood, be polite, wave, smile and have your shirt on, even if its 95 degrees. If you see trash on the ground pick it up whether its at the parking area, crag, or street.

bbrock wrote: As for the overlook being shut down for a while, the climbs there are some of the best Sunset has to offer, but whatever. As long as the anchors are within arms reach I think the problem will continue. There is simply no excuse for the parking situation though. There are plenty of places to park that require only a short walk back to the crag. Also when walking through the neighborhood, be polite, wave, smile and have your shirt on, even if its 95 degrees. If you see trash on the ground pick it up whether its at the parking area, crag, or street.

I agree that these are some of the most aesthetic lines there.

Just for the sake of discussion, if you move the anchors it will be harder for them to set topropes up but doesn't eliminate it. It could cause some to rap off trees over the edge to set up a toprope, which would be a even bigger problem. If they want to toprope they will find a way. I guess you could say the same for a temporary closer. I was just thinking that if it was closed for X amount of time, the word would spread. THey would look for new places to toprope and it would send a massage i.e. we are so F-ing serious about this we will sacrifice badass climbs for a season to correct it. This line of thought has flaws as well because as soon as you open it back up, the whole problem could start back up again. Both ideas have their pros and cons. I would support what ever the powers at be think should be done short of closing Sunset.

On the subject of parking, one thing i try to do is pick up people walking up the road to the main parking lot. Helps keep us out of sight, may make you a new climbing partner/friend, and if you find the parking lot full they probably won't mind waiting with your stuff so you can jog back up with out a load.

Thank you for being proactive and taking the proverbial bull by the horns this weekend. It is MUCH appreciated.

Fantastic idea of giving rides! Another option is to park at Craven's house and walk in from there. There is PLENTY of parking, and it's only about a 15 or 20 minute walk from there (the trail girdles the mountain, so it's mostly flat!); it is a much nicer walk than from the ball fields or the church.

Also noteworthy: the SCC is in full support of the Lookout Mountain police force writing tickets for illegal parking. If you are a climber and do park on the street, the likelyhood that your car will be ticketed is good; don't complain if you're one of the chosen ones!!

For those of you interested, I will have text only versions of the flyers available for this weekend (there is a graphics contest with a rope on the line for the winner). If you are going to be climbing at Sunset this coming weekend and would be available to help us out by sharing some of these, please contact me.

Thank you, again, to those of you who are taking a proactive stance and helping us out with this sensitive and fragile issue.

Samantha Christen
Sunset Area Representative
Southeastern Climbers Coalition
s_l_christen@yahoo.com

Samantha wrote:...Another option is to park at Craven's house and walk in from there. There is PLENTY of parking, and it's only about a 15 or 20 minute walk from there (the trail girdles the mountain, so it's mostly flat!); it is a much nicer walk than from the ball fields or the church.

This is very true. Flat, scenic, not too long, all from good parking. Craven's House is the way to go! I, personally, would rather do 15 minutes of a slight downhill on the way out than that steep hike to the parking lot any day.

The 15 minutes of a slight downhill at the end of the day is SOOO much more enjoyable than the hike up those seemingly never ending steps after a full day, for certain!

The Craven's House option is ideal for when you are climbing at the north end of the crag. For the south end option, park at Ochs Gateway (just below Covenant College). That trail runs you right under Blonde Ambition/View From Above and such; perfect access for the south end, and again, another FLAT TRAIL!!

flat trails are gooood... and parking is no problem at all with these two options.

Another idea would be to post the parking options/trails as an area and each one as routes(or how ever so people could look up specifics) at the Sunset page here on MP.com. I have only been in Atlanta and climbing at Sunset for a little over a year and this is the first I've heard about these options. I always hike it up from the ballfield/tennis courts and have never liked it. I'll try these other ways from now on.

Yet ANOTHER option for parking: park at the foot of the mountain at the Chattanooga Nature Center and hike the Kiddie Trail to Gum Springs. This combination brings you out pretty much at the bottom of the headwall, about 20 yards from climbers right Dick & Jane. While this option more closely simulates the T-Wall hike, my 37 year old out of shape self can schlep a 70m and a full rack up that way in 30-40 minutes so it isn't out of the realm of possibility!

Added bonus: you're most certainly warmed up for climbing, it's all downhill on the way back and you're car's closer to Mexican food than if you park anywhere else to access this area - there's a Las Margarita's less than 2 miles away if you hang a left on Hwy 41 out of the parking lot.

I will compile the parking options and get them posted. Thanks for the suggestions (should have taken care of that prior...)

Samantha

I've always noticed that if you have to hike in at all to climb not everyone is willing to make that commitment. Maybe closing the main overlook area would work to keep the large groups out of Sunset? And it would also keep climber to visitor contact more to a minimum. Only so many folks will hike past that Overlook. Just an idea.

Justin Dansby wrote:I've always noticed that if you have to hike in at all to climb not everyone is willing to make that commitment. Maybe closing the main overlook area would work to keep the large groups out of Sunset? And it would also keep climber to visitor contact more to a minimum. Only so many folks will hike past that Overlook. Just an idea.

I agree, and that is an option that has been considered; however, the "problem" (HA!) with this particular area in regards to everything is that this is a military battlefield, in essence, a graveyard set aside by survivors of the war to memorialize those who fought (same as Gettysburg and etc.) The parking was designed to accommodate the visitors of the park who are there for that reason. We cannot, and the park will not, shut down that lot. It is up to us, those who climb there and who wish for our children ad infinity to have the same opportunities to enjoy this crag, to find a working solution to the parking issue AND to bring all climbers on board.

While it is a National Park, it goes a step beyond: it is a National Military Battlefield, and whether we (collectively or individually) agree or not, thems the rules and if we want to continue climbing there, we MUST respect and abide by the rules and regulations set forth in the climbing regulations.

That said, the SCC stands firmly behind both the NPS and the Lookout Mountain police force in the ticketing of vehicles parked illegally on the side of the road, in the neighborhood, and in the designated one hour parking spots. As I've said before, if you park up top, don't be angry if you're the winner of a ticket at the end of the day.

THAT said, we are certainly open to suggestions and you are welcome to contact me directly or post here or on the SCC website (www.seclimbers.org).

In the meantime, enjoy the hike(s)! The forest is gorgeous right now!!! The redbuds and serviceberries are blooming out; the native azaleas are flowering; all the small flowers like epimedium and trilium and wild geranium and trout lilies and heuchera are blooming, the fake Solomon's seal is unfurling next to the ferns... ...even the cohosh and squaw root are starting to flower under the Mayapples!! It's a completely different hike each day!!

Samantha

Justin Dansby wrote:I've always noticed that if you have to hike in at all to climb not everyone is willing to make that commitment. Maybe closing the main overlook area would work to keep the large groups out of Sunset? And it would also keep climber to visitor contact more to a minimum. Only so many folks will hike past that Overlook. Just an idea.

I agree, and that is an option that has been considered; however, the "problem" (HA!) with this particular area in regards to everything is that this is a military battlefield, in essence, a graveyard set aside by survivors of the war to memorialize those who fought (same as Gettysburg and etc.) The parking was designed to accommodate the visitors of the park who are there for that reason. We cannot, and the park will not, shut down that lot. It is up to us, those who climb there and who wish for our children ad infinity to have the same opportunities to enjoy this crag, to find a working solution to the parking issue AND to bring all climbers on board.

While it is a National Park, it goes a step beyond: it is a National Military Battlefield, and whether we (collectively or individually) agree or not, thems the rules and if we want to continue climbing there, we MUST respect and abide by the rules and regulations set forth in the climbing regulations.

That said, the SCC stands firmly behind both the NPS and the Lookout Mountain police force in the ticketing of vehicles parked illegally on the side of the road, in the neighborhood, and in the designated one hour parking spots. As I've said before, if you park up top, don't be angry if you're the winner of a ticket at the end of the day.

THAT said, we are certainly open to suggestions and you are welcome to contact me directly or post here or on the SCC website (www.seclimbers.org).

In the meantime, enjoy the hike(s)! The forest is gorgeous right now!!! The redbuds and serviceberries are blooming out; the native azaleas are flowering; all the small flowers like epimedium and trillium and wild geranium and trout lilies and heuchera are blooming, the fake Solomon's seal is unfurling next to the ferns... ...even the cohosh and squaw root are starting to flower under the Mayapples!! It's a completely different hike each day!!

Samantha