most expensive climber's campground?

the Gunks campground charges $38 per night (or $24 for members of Mohonk Preserve or AAC.)

Is there any other place in the US which is that expensive or more?

Seems to me that aside from free places, $10 per night or so is more normal.

Just curious.

Per campground? Per vehicle? Per dirtbag? Keepin the riffraff out so only white collar climbers can go there?

Malibu creek is $45 a night for a tent site.

The "high" cost for non-AAC/Mohonk folks is to maximize camping spaces for the climbing community by encouraging non-climbers to find camping elsewhere.

About the 10$/night as normal, I doubt it is normal for camping in a tony, suburban neighborhood like Gardiner. Even the non-member fee at the gunks campground is less expensive than those for nearby options; the member fee is half that of other options. For comparison, it's 20$/night for a soulless campsite at Red Rocks, where the BLM already owns the land, no showers, no wifi, no nice pavilion to hang out in, no climbers on the staff...

$$$
basecampreno.com/

richard aiken wrote:the Gunks campground charges $38 per night (or $24 for members of Mohonk Preserve or AAC.) Is there any other place in the US which is that expensive or more? Seems to me that aside from free places, $10 per night or so is more normal. Just curious.

$24 for 4 people doesn't seem too $$$. Within a few miles of the AAC CG is Jellystone. $60 for 2 people there. Acadia National Park (and I bet all the others) are $30 per site (up to 6 people).

I challenge you to name other campgrounds that are < $6 per person pernight. three are some but not many.

Eric Engberg wrote: $24 for 4 people doesn't seem too $$$. Within a few miles of the AAC CG is Jellystone. $60 for 2 people there. Acadia National Park (and I bet all the others) are $30 per site (up to 6 people). I challenge you to name other campgrounds that are < $6 per person pernight. three are some but not many.

Smith Rock

vgw wrote: Smith Rock

I second smith rock, bivouac is $5/night, skull hollow is the same, and if you want just a wee bit past skull hollow blm land is free

Shelf Road is only $7 per site I believe. Not sure the person limit but it's not less than 4.

1. Orenda, New York
Beside a babbling brook, in the middle of the pristine Adirondack Mountains, the 40-acre Orenda resort has canvas-sided cabins with one queen or two single beds, a wood-burning stove, and plenty of rustic charm. Meals are cooked over an open flame; dinner might include center-cut pork chops, arugula-and-radish salad, and fresh-baked pie. And the private outdoor shower is a work of cedar art, complete with a water tower. The wilderness is still right at hand, though: kayaking, hiking, rock climbing, and spelunking are just a few of the recreation options in the area. Rates: $135 per adult per night.

2. Paws Up, Montana
The 37,000-acre, all-inclusive Paws Up resort near Missoula takes glamping to unforeseen heights. Here, some of the country’s most luxurious camping is done alongside not only the Blackfoot River but also Lewis and Clark's famed Lookout Rock. The tents have spot-on Western styling, premium beds, and either a private bathroom in the bathhouse or a full en-suite bath with a slate shower and heated floor. Camping butlers light fires, make s'mores, and offer planning advice. Each camp also employs a chef who prepares dishes like smoked trout cakes or baby-back ribs with chipotle barbecue sauce. Check out Away.com’s Paws Up Photo Gallery for a virtual tour. Rates: Starting at $1,055 per tent per night for two adults.

3. Far and Away Adventures' Deluxe Basecamp, Wyoming
Check in at the Bridge Bay Marina on vast Yellowstone Lake and board a cabin cruiser to a remote dock—in another world. At Far and Away Adventures’ Deluxe Basecamp, you get all of Yellowstone National Park’s untamed wilderness out the front door of a luxury tent with two comfortable beds, carpeted floors, and even a nightstand. For adventure, you can paddle, fish, or hike the trails in the afternoon. In the evening, dinner features a classic table setting and such fitting dishes as Kobe beef or wild salmon. The day ends around the campfire with a naturalist talk and musical entertainment. Rates: Three-day, two-night outings are $840 per adult.

4. Sinya on Lone Man Creek, Texas
A short drive from Austin and amid Texas Hill Country, Sinya on Lone Man Creek is the glitziest camping spot that the Lone Star State has to offer. Featuring panoramic views and plenty of funky, Texas-chic style, the specially modified canvas safari tent—on a ridge and overlooking 300 feet of Lone Man Creek—has a king-size bed, a vintage claw-foot bathtub in an en-suite bathroom, and high-speed Wi-Fi. When you're not in the tent, there’s plenty to do: hiking, swimming, tubing, fishing, and exploring the nooks and crannies of the Hill Country. Rates: Starting at $245 per night.

5. Sequoia High Sierra Camp, California
Within the boundaries of California's Giant Sequoia National Monument (adjacent to Sequoia and Kings Canyons National Parks), the Sequoia High Sierra Camp is accessible only by trail, but you can opt for a three-quarter-mile hike from the parking area if you don't want to take the challenging 12-mile route. Once you get to camp, you have it made. The 330-square-foot canvas-sided cabins have plush-top mattresses and reading lanterns. Days start with a hearty breakfast buffet and end with a gourmet Mediterranean-inspired dinner and a toasty campfire. In between, you can hike one of the area’s numerous trails to groves of enormous giant sequoias, go fly-fishing or horseback riding, or just relax and enjoy the peace and quiet that comes with being “off the grid.” Rates: $250 per adult per night with a two-night minimum.

From: gorp.com/camping-guide/trav…

Just dropped $20 to camp in NH White Mountains. Nice enough, but all you get is water, a pit toilet, and a patch of gravel amidst the pines.

Princess snowbird in Seneca. $6 per person :)

Many of the "camp sites" that Marc801 mentioned are in a completely different category. First off, they offer services far beyond what any of the aforementioned climber camp grounds provide, such as inclusive meals and transportation services. While I think a general knowledge and awareness of these types of institutions can be beneficial for perspective for climbers, I still don't think it relinquishes the AAC from being fairly criticized for building a "climbers' campground" that is financially prohibitive for a large percentage of climbers.

Eric Engberg wrote: $24 for 4 people doesn't seem too $$$. Within a few miles of the AAC CG is Jellystone. $60 for 2 people there. Acadia National Park (and I bet all the others) are $30 per site (up to 6 people). I challenge you to name other campgrounds that are < $6 per person pernight. three are some but not many.

The lilly pad is $5 per person a night.

Nolan Huther wrote:Miguel's Pizza in RRG - $2 per night per tent. Not expensive at all, spend the money you'd usually use for camping on pizza

Yes, and the reason Miguel's can keep their costs down so much is because of the pizza.

(rant ahead)

The bottom line is that, unless you've got a deal like Miguel's (or the several "adventure resorts" in WV near where I live that offer restaurants, rafting, etc. in addition to camping) where another service subsidizes camping, or where your land is already paid for, a campground is a terrible investment.

The AAC actually struggles to break even on every one of its properties, despite numerous complaints about pricing. If you do the simple math, factoring in things like bad weather, mid-week lulls, and capacity caps on full weekends, you'll see that campgrounds do not make that much money.

When I managed the AAC's place at the New River Gorge, complaints were common about having to pay $8-12/night, often from climbers pulling brand new racks out of brand new cars. No one stopped to think about the fact that the AAC has sunk over three quarters of a million dollars into the campground that it will NEVER recover in the next 50 years, and that the fees are calculated just to pay utilities, maintenance, insurance, and managers' wages.

Most climbers and campers have a sort of entitled attitude that sleeping outside is some sort of off-the-grid, anti-consumeristic wilderness exercise that should be completely free. And yeah, some (but definitely not all) state and national parks can be a bit cheaper, but ultimately, you've got to pay for what you're getting.

Nick Goldsmith wrote:Princess snowbird in Seneca. $6 per person :)

You're livin in the past Nick. I think it's up to $7.

Pnelson wrote: (rant ahead)

your rant changed my mind about campground fees

JohnnyG wrote: your rant changed my mind about campground fees

... said nobody on the internet, EVER.

has anyone stayed at any of the places on marc's list? Those look like my dream wedding venues.

I thought the Teton ranch was not bad for the price - a year ago we paid $25 a night so $50 for both of us as we are not AAC members. Anyway, not only are there the amenities, but having those in such a wonderful location is really great.

I also think these land managers are largely just covering their costs.

Pnelson wrote:No one stopped to think about the fact that the AAC has sunk over three quarters of a million dollars into the campground that it will NEVER recover in the next 50 years, and that the fees are calculated just to pay utilities, maintenance, insurance, and managers' wages. Most climbers and campers have a sort of entitled attitude that sleeping outside is some sort of off-the-grid, anti-consumeristic wilderness exercise that should be completely free. And yeah, some (but definitely not all) state and national parks can be a bit cheaper, but ultimately, you've got to pay for what you're getting.

What's more, land where the Gunks AAC CG is located is currently around $25K per acre. Regarding the sense of entitlement, a lot of climber also conveniently forget that for most of them at most climbing areas, they are tourists just as much as the tourists they so eagerly denigrate.