Himali Altitude Parka

Does anyone have experience with this Himali Parka? With the AAC ExpertVoice discount (45%) it’s very tempting.

I found that my DAS doesn’t do it when it’s real cold and is marginally warmer than my DAS light, plus I’m starting to form loose AK plans and need a better parka. Can anyone testify to the warmth level of this parka on Denali or similar climates? There isn’t much info on it online relative to big mountain use.

8oz of fill and sewn through baffles. Not Denali grade.

Not warm enough for Denali but would be significantly warmer than a das

Not sure if it is common consensus but  you want 10oz(300g) and box baffles for Denali.

Would a FF Volant be adequate for those that have already done the mountian? 

Volant has box baffles so it is a start. The FF description makes it pretty clear they don’t consider it appropriate for Denali.

I don’t understand what it is that makes people want to cut corners on Denali. The route is easy as hell from a climbing perspective. However the success rate is absurdly low considering it. And there are tons of bad outcomes every year. Why? The conditions can be absolutely brutal.

Is the volant “enough” for Denali? With the right other layers and with the stars aligning you might never put it on. And maybe it would be enough as long as you don’t twist your knee up there. People who get stuck for any reason can die FAST up there. If your gear leaves no margin are you counting on another team who has the right kit?

Even so, do you want to invest all the time and effort into a climb which often fails due to conditions and then further limit the range in which it is safe/wise to make an attempt? If you have experience and want to do a hard route you might make some decisions which scrimp on gear with the knowledge it might preclude some attempt windows. But if you don’t have that experience don’t try to cut it close. You’ll be dragging a sled the whole way anyway.

So yes, you need double/6k boots, yes you also need over boots, yes you need a ridiculous down jacket, yes you need a BOMBER tent, yes you need -20 or better bag and no you will not ever NEED this stuff for anything else… It is the same sport but The conditions on Denali have the potential to be unlike anything else except probably  Foraker, Logan, Vinson and the high Himalaya.

And I don’t mean this as a personal dig on either poster in the thread. Just my opinion as someone who has been up there and who only wore an absolute zero puffy for summit day plus another half an hour. It wasn’t THAT cold, shit didn’t go too sideways, the team didn’t NEED the bag we carried to the summit. Or the shovel or the stove. But that’s how it’s supposed to end. 

diepjwrote:

Volant has box baffles so it is a start. The FF description makes it pretty clear they don’t consider it appropriate for Denali.

I don’t understand what it is that makes people want to cut corners on Denali. The route is easy as hell from a climbing perspective. However the success rate is absurdly low considering it. And there are tons of bad outcomes every year. Why? The conditions can be absolutely brutal.

Is the volant “enough” for Denali? With the right other layers and with the stars aligning you might never put it on. And maybe it would be enough as long as you don’t twist your knee up there. People who get stuck for any reason can die FAST up there. If your gear leaves no margin are you counting on another team who has the right kit?

Even so, do you want to invest all the time and effort into a climb which often fails due to conditions and then further limit the range in which it is safe/wise to make an attempt? If you have experience and want to do a hard route you might make some decisions which scrimp on gear with the knowledge it might preclude some attempt windows. But if you don’t have that experience don’t try to cut it close. You’ll be dragging a sled the whole way anyway.

So yes, you need double/6k boots, yes you also need over boots, yes you need a ridiculous down jacket, yes you need a BOMBER tent, yes you need -20 or better bag and no you will not ever NEED this stuff for anything else… It is the same sport but The conditions on Denali have the potential to be unlike anything else except probably  Foraker, Logan, Vinson and the high Himalaya.

And I don’t mean this as a personal dig on either poster in the thread. Just my opinion as someone who has been up there and who only wore an absolute zero puffy for summit day plus another half an hour. It wasn’t THAT cold, shit didn’t go too sideways, the team didn’t NEED the bag we carried to the summit. Or the shovel or the stove. But that’s how it’s supposed to end. 

Very good advice right there! It’s nice to have a big down jacket to hangout at camp. 

I’d say the reason the summit numbers are low is because loads of people try in early May. I believe this is because guides feel much safer to be roped up to beginners on the lower glacier, earlier in the season, when it isn’t as broken up. Just speculating. The probability of topping out is a lot higher and temps are usually warmer in early-mid June. Especially preferred for more technical objectives.

However, if OP is short on money and already has a bunch of other warm layers, I’d say DAS could be just fine. For example, Das light, DAS, another down sweater, something similar to R1 etc. It’s all about insulation, which can be achieved by multiple jackets, vs one huge jacket…but then you are likely gonna drop more money on a flight to the glacier, than the cost of two nice jackets more appropriate for Denali…at times I’m forgetting most people are not selling their kidneys to climb that mountain. :) If short on money, you can probably borrow a warmer jacket from a friend or someone from MP. Like the previous poster suggested, you can carry a pig to 14k camp on your sled, so do your best to bring a jacket that will make you happy. That peak is much more fun when you bring good food, company and do your best to make yourself comfortable.

If your family didn’t get you a Christmas present yet, ask them for Feathered Friends Helios down pants. :)  Great for belaying and climbing in the gnar on technical routes and for standing around at 14k camp. A lot nicer than some thin synthetic options.

I’d say over boots are not necessary if you are fit and not planning to take forever on your summit day. Especially if your plan is to summit mid June-ish. I’d say typically my extremities get colder than my friends’, and on four times I’ve gone to the top, I never felt the need to have overboots. Even on one shitty/windy day. I’ve used LS Spantik’s on my first trip long ago, and La Sportiva G2 SM for the second trip. My partner had Mammut Nordwand 6000 and I bought those shoes too and used for last couple expeditions

Usually when you are approaching camps, even in semi-shitty weather, you will be moving and won’t need the warmest layers. Typically, above 11k there is no need to do anything before the sun comes up. Definitely don’t have to leave the 14k camp to move up, or 17k to go to the top before the sun hits you in the morning. And when the sun leaves, you typically are making food in the vestibule and getting ready to go to sleep.

Best rule to follow up there is ‘don’t be an idiot.’ Stories I heard from a friend who worked as a ranger up there for many years are ridiculous. Most people are either cutting corners with acclimation, pushing it into bad weather because they HAVE to summit, or don’t have the proper self arrest skills. Autobahn could get pretty icy and if someone slips there, even experts at self arrest would have a hard time stopping before picking up speed.

Also, loads of people don’t quite give Cassin the proper respect. More than 90% of people who will be out there to ‘climb the Cassin’ won’t even get to the base.

Make sure to go with fun people you know well, and to have a bottle of Nutella in your sleeping bag. 

SirTobyThe3rd Mwrote:

Very good advice right there! It’s nice to have a big down jacket to hangout at camp. 

I’d say the reason the summit numbers are low is because loads of people try in early May. I believe this is because guides feel much safer to be roped up to beginners on the lower glacier, earlier in the season, when it isn’t as broken up. Just speculating. The probability of topping out is a lot higher and temps are usually warmer in early-mid June. Especially preferred for more technical objectives.

However, if OP is short on money and already has a bunch of other warm layers, I’d say DAS could be just fine. For example, Das light, DAS, another down sweater, something similar to R1 etc. It’s all about insulation, which can be achieved by multiple jackets, vs one huge jacket…but then you are likely gonna drop more money on a flight to the glacier, than the cost of two nice jackets more appropriate for Denali…at times I’m forgetting most people are not selling their kidneys to climb that mountain. :) If short on money, you can probably borrow a warmer jacket from a friend or someone from MP. Like the previous poster suggested, you can carry a pig to 14k camp on your sled, so do your best to bring a jacket that will make you happy. That peak is much more fun when you bring good food, company and do your best to make yourself comfortable.

If your family didn’t get you a Christmas present yet, ask them for Feathered Friends Helios down pants. :)  Great for belaying and climbing in the gnar on technical routes and for standing around at 14k camp. A lot nicer than some thin synthetic options.

I’d say over boots are not necessary if you are fit and not planning to take forever on your summit day. Especially if your plan is to summit mid June-ish. I’d say typically my extremities get colder than my friends’, and on four times I’ve gone to the top, I never felt the need to have overboots. Even on one shitty/windy day. I’ve used LS Spantik’s on my first trip long ago, and La Sportiva G2 SM for the second trip. My partner had Mammut Nordwand 6000 and I bought those shoes too and used for last couple expeditions

Usually when you are approaching camps, even in semi-shitty weather, you will be moving and won’t need the warmest layers. Typically, above 11k there is no need to do anything before the sun comes up. Definitely don’t have to leave the 14k camp to move up, or 17k to go to the top before the sun hits you in the morning. And when the sun leaves, you typically are making food in the vestibule and getting ready to go to sleep.

Best rule to follow up there is ‘don’t be an idiot.’ Stories I heard from a friend who worked as a ranger up there for many years are ridiculous. Most people are either cutting corners with acclimation, pushing it into bad weather because they HAVE to summit, or don’t have the proper self arrest skills. Autobahn could get pretty icy and if someone slips there, even experts at self arrest would have a hard time stopping before picking up speed.

Also, loads of people don’t quite give Cassin the proper respect. More than 90% of people who will be out there to ‘climb the Cassin’ won’t even get to the base.

Make sure to go with fun people you know well, and to have a bottle of Nutella in your sleeping bag. 

Thanks for the advice Vitaly. I picked up a MHW sub zero parka for a great deal which by the weight is nearing the same weight class of a Peak XV, albeit 650 vs 800fill. Layering this with a DAS light I think would prove sufficient. It was too warm in 15 degree weather this last week.

Some things in my personal life have to line up to go up the mountain this year just tentatively acquiring gear when I can and training appropriately. Hoping Ill be able to rent a bag and tent.