Class needed for non-technical glacier travel?

In your opinion, how necessary is it take a class such as this one, in order to learn crampon technique and self-arrest? Do most people take a course or just practice on their own? My impression is that a lot of people are climbing couloirs in Colorado without taking a course; not sure about easier glaciated peaks.

I'm not referring to snow anchors, crevasse rescue, or roped travel. This year, my goals are to climb Mt. Adams, Mt. Hood, and Mt. Shasta by their easiest routes in May~June, which don't require roped travel. I would definitely take a crevasse rescue course before attempting Rainier or similar.

Generally I am willing to put in the research and practice to learn things on my own. But classes are still useful in cases where "I don't know what I don't know" or where expert instruction would meaningfully increase my safety. If I didn't take a course, I would find a partner and practice self-arrest in all 4 positions on a ~30-degree snow slope with a good runout (St Mary's Glacier in CO or Round Top in CA).

if there is any doubt, there is no doubt

you can learn alot from books and practice.  holy smokes, will the bros and tourists come far out of the woodwork to advise you, should anyone actually see you practicing.  a groomer ski run is unbeatable for lots of practice.  you gotta be confident in your abilities to be confident on the mountain. 

If you like mountaineering, a mountaineering course is a ton of fun, and sets you up for a lifetime of success and further exploration, in safety.  l recommend NOLS Wind River Mountaineering course.  

 Knowledge is power.  

I don't know about the setup in the States but on this side of the Atlantic, mountaineering courses are as much about climbing peaks and enjoying the mountains as they are about instruction on how to do so. They are worth their money if you have any ambition to become independent and proficient. It's a ton of fun, you meet a lot of like-minded individuals and guides have a lot of advice which extends far beyond just the course curriculum. 

Ellen S wrote:

If I didn't take a course, I would find a partner and practice self-arrest in all 4 positions on a ~30-degree snow slope with a good runout (St Mary's Glacier in CO or Round Top in CA).

I essentially took a self arrest course on this about 40 years ago followed by some summits akin to what you have in mind.  It was a good combo. Even with that, there are self-belay techniques on steep snow that I did not learn until years later.

Having good enough practice sessions with a similar-skilled friend can be hit or miss, though possible. Treat them as part of a continuous learning cycle?

^All of the above good advice.   I’d just add that aside from your own technical abilities, now is the time to start studying and getting background in the more ephemeral and hard to control aspects of the mountains such as avalanche danger.  This will be a lifelong process that you never truly “master”, just hopefully get incrementally better at judging.  

Save your time and money! Those classes are just to vet ppl on guided trips for liability. I went on a one day course like that (for free) when I was in college with a school program. Waste of time; basically amounted to a guide watching me glissade for a couple hours. Super fun, but not something to pay for.

I have a customer facing job, and I regularly meet people who make me wonder how they get their pants on without instructions. Those people will never be safe in the mountains, even after a three year course. Other people can just show up and figure it out. 

Those routes are 45* snow slopes...it is walking. You will have to answer for yourself if you need a class to learn to walk. Everything you need to know can be figured out. Reading the Petzl website instruction articles is way more useful than any of those classes.

For non glaciated travel and snow without crevasses the use of crampons and ice axe are pretty straightforward.  I haven't looked at a current copy but my old version of freedom of the hills has a pretty good description of French technique and ice axe use.  I would definitely recommend a fair bit of practice doing self arrest and using the gear on terrain that isn't too serious first.  One key thing to learn is to be really careful about how you put the crampons on the boots.  clean of the snow really well and make sure the crampon you buy not only fits but is the right one for the boots you have.  Having a crampon pop off at the wrong time is not only scary but dangerous as well. When I have guided snow school classes clients tend to pick it up pretty fast and a pair of crampons on firm snow is like going from a 2 wheel drive car without them to 4wd with chains with them.

Just to echo what everyone else said, for something like Mt. Shasta (no first hand-experience with Adams or Hood) there is very little "trick" to getting up Avalanche Gulch in normal conditions. I would make sure you have the proper equipment and try to tag along with someone whose done the route before (if only so that you don't go up the wrong way :P) 

Did a guided 3-day trip up Hood a few years ago. 2 full days of instruction followed by a summit climb. A lot of the instruction was about how to walk more than how to self arrest (and I agree with this emphasis). Mastering the various techniques for different slope angles was a big confidence boost for summit day. A few years later we climbed Shasta un-guided and it was way easier than Hood (ignoring the complexity of adding an overnight).

I like the advice of hitting up a steep ski slope. Get your technique down (more walking than self arresting) on steeper sections and then practice some self arrest with a safe runout.

Having climbed the three peaks you mention, I would recommend taking a class or having a mentor to introduce you to the techniques before making a summit attempt. In the right conditions, the routes are mostly walkups, but they can also be deadly. I mean this literally. Someone dies on Mt Hood almost every year, usually due to a combination of lack of experience, snow conditions, and weather.

Yes you can practice by yourself, but it can really help to have someone show and critique you.

Adams is a nice walk up a snowy hill and a fun glissade back down in good conditions. I would not say the same about Hood. Depending on what the chutes are like, if you fall unroped, good luck to you. People on the internet who don’t know you or your abilities cannot tell you whether it’s a good idea or you’re gonna die. Practicing self arrest on a low angle snow slope is all well and good but it’s steeper up there, often icy, and the runout area is a fumarole that emits toxic gases. Find a friend with some more experience to head up there with, at the least. People die every year on Hood. 

Max R wrote:

People die every year on Hood.

Take the advice to do this one with someone with skills and experience...after you yourself have practiced and done a few easier ones.  

Whatever you do, don’t rope yourself together with a bunch of other noobs all thinking that you’ll be safer somehow and then come down the mountain all tied together like clackers when one slips, Potentially wiping out other innocent parties below you.  Hood seems to be ground zero for this “technique”.

The couple of times I have been on Hood the bergshrund near the summit would have eaten anyone who slipped on the boiler plate above.  We skied up to that point. Then a bit of rope and some snow anchor and belay techniques are advised.

Shasta is route and season dependent as to how technical.

Glaciers by definition require roped travel due to crevasses. 

Your question shows you need to gain more knowledge however you pursue it. Read about accidents on Mt hood, read Freedom of the Hills, practice on your own, take classes, find experienced friends, join a club.

Crampons are like 4 wheel drive for your feet-

They help you go but don’t help you stop.

Such a class can give your some descent time in the field to learn some different techniques with hopefully someone who knows them well. The key is learning enough to get by "harder" sections without getting yourself in trouble or having to turn around. Far too often today people use two tools to make up for their lack of technique (incompetence) with one tool.

The issue that should not be skipped over with the standard routes in good conditions anyone and their dog can walk up the route. 

For the OP, Hood by its easiest route may or may not require a rope and protection. Above the Hogsback it can have icy sections such as in the Pearly Gates or be icy from top to bottom. As others have mentioned the bergshrund can also be problematic. 

Haha, OP is at least getting a good feel for all the opinions on how one Should climb these routes...   

There are numerous “right” ways to do them as long as you have sound reasons and some experience for doing it that way.   For example, Allen is in the camp that all you should need for Hood is Yaktrax and a sharp stick.  Others would almost always rope up and use two ice tools. It all works.  
But there are some patently “wrong” ways to do things  -  like roping up in firm/icy “no fall” terrain without clipping into running pro.  

For now, just enjoy safely learning “you” and then you do you.  Personally I don’t think you can take too many classes, read too many books, or do too much “practice”...for the next 40 years or so.  And despite what some may say, it is good to get exposed to the various opinions and advice here on MP.   It’s all part of the “pencil rub” of learning  

Mark Pilate wrote:

For example, Allen is in the camp that all you should need for Hood is Yaktrax and a sharp stick.

Never said that??? 

Besides I save the Yaktrax and a sharp stick for Denali. They work well with bunny boots :-).

An entrenching tool with the shovel locked at 90 degrees to the handle cuts excellent large steps for bunny boots.

Extreme snow hiking is pretty intuitive.  Best to get your self arrest down to muscle memory in a bunch of different orientations with a pack on.  Go find a 45 ish slope in the spring during the freeze thaw where the run out isn't consequential and just throw yourself down it with axe and pack only, don't use the crampons.  Throw yourself feet first belly down, then on your back feet first, then head first belly down, then head first pack down.  Start with these positions in the arrest position, then in your off hand position, then start with only one hand on the head of the axe.  Walking with crampons takes practice, I recommend using gaiters to tie up the loose clothing around your ankles so you don't put holes in them.  If you fall with crampons on, make sure you get them up in the air as quickly as possible so they don't catch on the snow and flip you over or give you a gnarly tib fib.  

Some people use an axe only, but I am a fan of two tools.  Axes arrest better but tools are better at preventing the slide in the first place.  They are also faster.  

Know when to turn around if you think you are about to get in over your head.  Better to tuck tail early than get halfway up and panic.  Master the down climb.  Play around with different axe and crampon techniques.

Michael McNutt wrote:

Some people use an axe only, but I am a fan of two tools.  Axes arrest better but tools are better at preventing the slide in the first place.  They are also faster.  

Faster how?

Derek DeBruin wrote:

Faster how?

Like this: https://youtu.be/NfpYNr7es0Y (skip to 2min 30sec)