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New belay device idea?


Original Post
garrett knorr · · fort collins · Joined Feb 2016 · Points: 60

An idea I alway think of is this: why has a company not come up with an auto locking belay device (like a grigri) that has a tube on the side that allows double rope rappelling? From my experience, a good number of people carry a grigri and a tube for rappelling and this would solve that issue (This is not the topic at hand though, the device itself is).

Questions and discussion: Ups and downs of the device? How would the rappelling action feel?

Things to note: the black wire on the tube would not need to be present since the device would be kept in place by the carabiner hole through the grigri.
The lip that you put your finger under could be cut off and replaced by the tube but would be kinda scary if your finger got caught in the tube portion during a lead fall.
It would add weight to the grigri but save weight since you don't have to bring a extra rappelling device. Top down belaying two ropes would work well but what about lead belaying on double ropes?


I don't even know why I'm even saying this, since I know I might as well wish for a million dollars but let's try to keep to the topic of the potential ups and downs of the proposed device. I'd rather not rehash the discussion on simul rapping with locking devices or why tube devices better anyways or why you shouldn't have to carry two belay devices yada yada yada.
Chase G · · Seattle, WA · Joined Jun 2017 · Points: 141

I think that would change the intended feed/friction direction of the rope since they designed it to run over that outer lip.

Matt Jones · · Colorado Springs, CO · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 81

When rappelling, having one rope through a Grigri and one through a tube style belay device could be problematic if the Grigri were to "lock up" and the rope through the tube style belay device continued to move through freely.  This could potentially lead to someone rappelling off the end of their rope.  Backing up the tube style belay device with some type of friction hitch could remedy this.  Rappelling on a single strand with a Grigri seems like a much better solution to me (this is what I normally do).  Also, having the tube style belay device on the side of the Grigri like that seems to be less than ideal for belaying though.

J W · · Las Vegas, NV · Joined Feb 2004 · Points: 1,546

Because you can just rappel on the grigri.

I used to carry a tube to rappel, but it turns out the grigri is really nice for rappelling to clear any tangles, etc. it’s also really nice for pulling if there’s a ton of friction.

Now I just rap down on the grigri, my partner clears the clove and raps down behind on a tube.

Warriors · · Rock City, GA · Joined Sep 2015 · Points: 310

I'm with John I use a gri pretty much exclusively even rappelling just the way it is.

Avery Angarshli · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2017 · Points: 0

Check out Climbing Technology Alpine up or Mammut Smart Alpine or edelrid megajul.  Double rope accommodating assisted braking devices.

Dana Bartlett · · CO · Joined Nov 2003 · Points: 890

You likely thought of this, but if you drop the device? Not catastrophic but inconvenient

Thomas Worsham · · Loveland, OH · Joined Oct 2017 · Points: 0

Sorry fam, Edelrid already beat you to it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSvXc7Wcwqg

Thomas Worsham · · Loveland, OH · Joined Oct 2017 · Points: 0
John Wilder wrote: Because you can just rappel on the grigri.

I used to carry a tube to rappel, but it turns out the grigri is really nice for rappelling to clear any tangles, etc. it’s also really nice for pulling if there’s a ton of friction.

Now I just rap down on the grigri, my partner clears the clove and raps down behind on a tube.

How do you manage double rope rappels with just a grigri?

Leroy Fielding · · Salt Lake City, UT · Joined Jun 2004 · Points: 23
Thomas Worsham wrote:

How do you manage double rope rappels with just a grigri?

How is rapping double ropes any different than a single rope rap? It’s pretty much the same either way with a grigri. 

Caleb Schwarz · · Colorado Springs, CO · Joined Mar 2016 · Points: 125
Thomas Worsham wrote:

How do you manage double rope rappels with just a grigri?

You just single rope rap on stand C, then pull the stand with the A hitch and locker at the bottom
J W · · Las Vegas, NV · Joined Feb 2004 · Points: 1,546

Thread ropes.

Clip locker to anchor and clove one side to it.

Rappel on grigri.

Second pops the clove, grabs the locker and rappels on a tube.

You can also do the overhand locker to the other side thing (pictured above), but I don’t like that as much because it tends to get the knot snug up against the anchor and can snag depending on the configuration.

rgold · · Poughkeepsie, NY · Joined Feb 2008 · Points: 526

Not to start a whole 'nuther fuss-up, but both partners simul-rapping on Grigris eliminates the need for knots that can jam in the anchor.

Thomas Worsham · · Loveland, OH · Joined Oct 2017 · Points: 0
Caleb Schwarz wrote:

You just single rope rap on stand C, then pull the stand with the A hitch and locker at the bottom

This makes a lot of sense now that I can see it  I've never heard of this technique before. 

Matt N · · Santa Barbara, CA · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 337
garrett knorr wrote: I don't even know why I'm even saying this, 

What is legalized weed, Alex

Derek DeBruin · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2010 · Points: 585
rgold wrote: Not to start a whole 'nuther fuss-up, but both partners simul-rapping on Grigris eliminates the need for knots that can jam in the anchor.

Yeah, but once you start simul-rapping, insta-death sets in, unless of course you have a protective amulets that keeps you from your imminent and untimely demise. 

E Mann · · front range CO · Joined Aug 2017 · Points: 11

Single strand rappels with a biner and clove have a lot more potential of getting stuck ropes on hairy rappels. Personally I also don't like a knot and biner falling 30m and landing on me. There could also be some sort of mechanism that could stop the auto locking side (Gri-gri part) from locking up on rappels

Z Winters · · Mazama, WA · Joined Aug 2014 · Points: 220
E Mann wrote: Single strand rappels with a biner and clove have a lot more potential of getting stuck ropes on hairy rappels. Personally I also don't like a knot and biner falling 30m and landing on me. There could also be some sort of mechanism that could stop the auto locking side (Gri-gri part) from locking up on rappels

It doesn't fall. The tail off the rope falls once the locker has slowly lowered to you. Has this really happened to you?

rgold · · Poughkeepsie, NY · Joined Feb 2008 · Points: 526

If you don't want the knot to wedge in the anchor rings and don't want to simul-rap, you can still have both partners rappel sequentially on their Grigri's, each on a single strand, no knots or carabiners in the rope.  The first person down either stays on rappel and/or ties off the rappel line and then the second person rappels.  The second person can test the setup while still tethered to the anchor and so avoid the catastrophic failure that comes from miscommunication about what is supposed to happen at the lower anchor.

E Mann · · front range CO · Joined Aug 2017 · Points: 11
Z Winters wrote:

It doesn't fall. The tail off the rope falls once the locker has slowly lowered to you. Has this really happened to you?

haha nah, but I have got a rope stuck cuz of the biner block.

Ryan M Moore · · Philadelphia, PA · Joined Oct 2014 · Points: 35

I can’t see a way that lead belaying in doubles would work smoothly with such a device. I think getting the ergonomics right so that you could override the auto lock with the same hand holding both ropes would be difficult.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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