Getting your SPI

Ian Machen wrote:

Neither the course, nor the exam are really a "Learning Environment", as you are expected to show up with a baseline of skills.

I'll posit this is not entirely true. You are expected to arrive to the course with a baseline skill set. However, if well-facilitated, you should be able to learn a host of skills on the course. If everyone comes prepared, you may get to learn skills beyond the standard curriculum as well.

For the exam, how much learning occurs depends in part on the examiner and in part on the candidates. I just facilitated an exam this weekend, both days of which featured a number of good questions, critically considered answers, feedback, and short lessons for the candidates. A lot depends on the candidate:examiner ratio, candidate performance, and subsequent time available. In general, I'd say most providers attempt to make both the course and the examine positive learning environments (that assume a minimum baseline of skills).

Certainly not trying to invalidate your experience, but I don't think that assertion is necessarily representative of the SPI program as a whole.

Mark E Dixon wrote:

This should go in the great climbing quotes thread

Thanks Mark.

You'll notice, the machine goes largely unaffected by my joke.  

If you what to know what skills are taught in the AMGA SPI course buy the book from Amazon, every things is in the book. 

Rock Climbing: The AMGA Single Pitch Manual

Derek DeBruin wrote:

Derek, sorry for not being more clear. What I meant is that it's not a time to learn how to build an anchor, tie a knot or hitch, or the like. You should show up with the baseline of skills to be rearranged into the SPI style of program.

Ian Machen wrote:

Derek, sorry for not being more clear. What I meant is that it's not a time to learn how to build an anchor, tie a knot or hitch, or the like. You should show up with the baseline of skills to be rearranged into the SPI style of program.

Agreed--there's definitely prerequisite skills required.

Hobo Greg wrote:

Hm maybe I shouldn't take the course just yet. I know anchors and most (but not all) knots, but I've never done a pickoff or done an assisted rappel or whatever it is. And this is for the course right? Not just the exam?

You can certainly take the course without having done a belayed rappel or a pickoff. Regarding knots, you'll get a list of perquisite knots to know in advance, which you can practice beforehand. Otherwise, you just need to be competent at building anchors, placing gear, and trad climbing. The more you know going in, the more advanced skills you can pick up, but if you've got the anchors/gear/trad climbing then you should be good to go. A more complete list of prerequisites is on the AMGA website. 

Hobo Greg wrote:

 I've never done a pickoff or done an assisted rappel or whatever it is. And this is for the course right? Not just the exam?

They will teach you these techniques on the course. If you've ever rapped with a back up its basically a variation on that. The pick off is pretty damn easy as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8Ej3ob0rZQ

Right, but that isn't what he asked, of course the course covers a ton of topics besides the video I added. The releasable rappel was not something I had done prior to the course but I had tied munter mules before, so it was kind of basic.

Really the whole course is pretty simple and Falcon Guides has a book Bob Gaines put out that covers these techniques.

Thanks for the info on the pick off, Slevin. That was something I saw people struggling with. A good idea to use the gear in the gear list before you start so you know your lengths and how many wraps your hitches will need.

Anonymous wrote:

GDavis, is this a reflection of the course itself or more a discrepancy with some of the courses providers?

Good question, and though it would be easy to blame the providers I feel the course and exam purposefully leave much up to the discretion of the provider. There are providers with reputations for being really difficult both in their approach and the examination process but they teach great students, meanwhile others are known for being easier but are holding more true to the material and aren't as intense and hard-core. In the end I feel it is up to the individual to exercise how hard they want to enforce these basic guidelines, which are of course basic because it is the most basic training you can get. If these were Rock Guides making these mistakes I might say yes, it's due to the course, but the course is a whopping three days and an exam on how to build a handful of systems. I think the guys that change oil at Jiffy Lube might have more eyes on them during their classes. 

AMGA is great and they do a good job. It's just the limitations and a reality of a three day course / two day exam you can get for under a grand. Nothing replaces self motivation and training because the only one you can control is you so it is always best to seek outside training in addition to any course material.

I really liked Sierra Mountain Guides as a provider, up in the mountains and they have some of the most experienced guides on their roster in that area. I'm not trying to talk him out of it, just adding my experience.

Not sure never had anyone pay my WFR/guide fees. Only 450/350 

How about this place?

Can you use Americorps money in Canada?

http://www.tru.ca/act/adventure/cmsg-certprg.html