what post?

Jason, First of all,thanks for respecting the Ethics and Standards of the area.My ol-school brain wants to say,try EVERY option i.e.TR the roof to see if it wiil go free etc. etc....besides the bolt before you drill.And imagine this...you drill the bolt,then someone else sends w/o it.... a REAL issue.Or better yet,leave it the way it is and move on. There's plenty of rock out there STILL.
Also, the BEST way to start an ethics issue is to apply one climbing area's ethics to another.Sorry about your balls.

Could it go clean? Maybe with a ballnut of some size. If it is just one placement, there's got to be a way around placing the bolt. I think the fright factor would go down significantly with a brand new bolt. This may send more people to attempt the route, but that could be both good and bad.
I would research what gear might be out there that could fit the crack or pinscar.

Or just trust the pin...

I agree ,technology is sometimes a laxative for a constipated mind,or a lack of balls.Bolts and the holes they leave are there forever.Imagine in 2030 "Gees, my dad climbed this without having to drill any bolts!!!"

i commend your courage to bring this to the table.
you know that no matter what you end up doing, Jason, some one will find a reason to criticize it. Especially since this route has been done before. aiding on those pins is different than whipping on to them. those pins were placed as an aid ascent not a free ascent.

with the information given, i would say sail a bolt in if it would keep you alive. otherwise, risk a R or X rating on the free version. if the pins arent worth a crap, remove them, they are litter.

as adam C said, bonus points to you if you can finagle some trick clean pro, placing it on your free redpoint. but i would guess in this instance it may be next to impossible. if someone can, good for them. they should get a cookie or a free t shirt.

and not if but when someone eventually bitches about it, stand strong, be open to their perspective and they should be open to yours.

good luck with your send! if i start climbing again, i would like to check out the route after you are done with it. but hopefully its safe ;)

The Piker wrote:respecting the Ethics and Standards of the area.

where can i also find a copy of this? on some metal plates? do you need a seer stone?

WiledHorse wrote:...if someone can, good for them. they should get a cookie or a free t shirt.

we take coors and elk meat.

Jason, you'll never win. Do what is relatively safe that keeps the line clean by hand, you're in the shit; use a drill, your in the shit; put in another pin ladder, you're in the shit; try to solo it, you're in the shit.

My advice is that if anyone gives you grief, hook up a large generator to their house and blow their transformer; it's done wonders in the past.

Mark Nelson wrote: we take coors and elk meat. Jason, you'll never win. Do what is relatively safe that keeps the line clean by hand, you're in the shit; use a drill, your in the shit; put in another pin ladder, you're in the shit; try to solo it, you're in the shit. My advice is that if anyone gives you grief, hook up a large generator to their house and blow their transformer; it's done wonders in the past.

oh and if you do place a bolt it should be from a free stance with a hand drill. hopefully there is a no hands kneebar in the roof for you to accomplish this.

Jason Haas wrote:I started working an old aid route... need replacing no matter what.

So I'm not sure if you are trying to free it as a .13+ or just repeating the aid line - guessing A3 or A4 with funky pins?
If you're aiding, and the pins hold body weight, leave them in place That could be a spicy line as is.
If you do have a realistic chance at freeing the route, the best style, if it would take pro would be to do it clean, after you remove the pins. By what you say it sounds like they wouldn't hold much of a free lead fall.
But finding the first ascensionist for his opinion on bolts is never a bad idea.

Let me rephrase...Jason, I don't want you to put yourself in an R/X situation. I've got things to live for too and won't attempt an R/X rated route anywhere near my ability level.
Just saying, if you can get out there and scope it out safely, borrow a bunch of small gear to see if anything fits, try your best to make it go clean.
I'd love to see every route safely in the PG-13 range, because I don't want to see any more accident postings on this site.
But I HATE to see bolts next to gear-accepting cracks.

Adam Catalano wrote:I HATE to see bolts next to gear-accepting cracks.

Jason is not the type of person who would do this.

Bolt it, and free climb it. It was an aid line and you are trying to free it thus I think you have the right to put in real pro. You can leave it spicy or not it is up to you. You could talk to the FA folks but I think adding pro in order to free an aid line trumps the FA of an aid line. Just my .02

Are there bolts on routes in your area? If yes (and I know there are) what's wrong with another one. How long have people been climbing in Splatte? and no one has tried it? It's yours for the taking.

Jason...have you sent it on TR? Are you planning on leading it soon? Is it in a high profile location? Are there other routes in the area that are bolted? In my humble opinion, I think that these are all legitimate questions that should be strongly considered before changing the character of an existing route.

msamet wrote:the Platte isn't regulated this way,

thank God.

we've put together a book of all platte regulations; you can pick up a copy at the house down by the sphinx. (no, don't be a moron)

Mark Nelson wrote:we've put together a book of all platte regulations; you can pick up a copy at the house down by the sphinx. (no, don't be a moron)

Classic! Good stuff :^)

Mark Nelson wrote:we've put together a book of all platte regulations; you can pick up a copy at the house down by the sphinx. (no, don't be a moron)

Thanks for the rule book. Nice people at the house. I was especially psyched to see rule number III 7(b):

In order to climb @ Sunshine wall one must hike all the way to the rock with a rack. Then, go back to the car and get a rope and repeat the hike all the way to the rock. Now you may climb Sunshine Wall.

We followed this one to the T.

Someone out there thinks they are the "Mayor" of the Platte. Look at the Bucksnort ordeal a couple of years ago. Bolting cracks or established lines wasn't even the issue there.

Greg -- you need to precede that with a heinous traverse through boulderfields of hades (See III 2(a) to (c) -- Approaches)