Since I consider you a serious person who is open to taking in different points of view, I'll try.
I think people like Honnold and other famous climbers are not just monetizing their talents, which they should if they can, but are also commercializing climbing and contributing to what I call the "gymnification" of climbing.
I got into climbing as an extension of my love of the mountains. As I got bored of hiking to lakes and mountain passes, I started finding my way up ridges and faces to see what there was to see. Sometimes it was a talus slog, but sometimes it was an exhilarating 5.easy scramble before I knew anything about the YDS.
Based on all that, you might understand why the only famous climbers I have any interest in are people like Fred Beckey, who went up into the unknown and maybe did or maybe didn't find a way up or back down. It's way more impressive to me, considering the risks, even if it turned out to be 5.6 in shitty weather, than watching Adam Ondra scream his way up some 5.15 sport route. Beckey, Clyde, and others were way more adventurous and took on so much more risk.
Before someone rushes to point out how Honnold free soloed a 5.13a on El Capitan, I'll admit it was an amazing feat that I will never replicate, but it's also lame that he rehearsed it on TR so many times. It was still badass to pull it off, but it would have been so much more impressive had he not trained on it.
Fred Beckey didn't rehearse his first ascents into the alpine with questionable gear.
What I hate more than the famous climbers, who are just making a good living off their talents, are the climbers who idolize them, especially those that refer to them on first-name basis when they've never met them in person. Climbers talk a great game about being rebellious and all that, but it's funny how so many of them fall into groupthink and groupspeak.
When I started climbing, I didn't know the names of any famous climbers except the two guys who first climbed Everest. It was just about love of the mountains, the rock, and the clean air. Now, I can't not hear (or see) people who consider themselves as rebels and as heirs to the outcasts of the Yosemite OGs slinging around the first names of badass pro climbers as if they know them.
I wish these people had just stayed in the gym.
This is an interesting opinion. He’s done quite a bit of very cool on-sight adventure climbing, it just doesn’t get as much press as his solos.
Since I consider you a serious person who is open to taking in different points of view, I'll try.
I think people like Honnold and other famous climbers are not just monetizing their talents, which they should if they can, but are also commercializing climbing and contributing to what I call the "gymnification" of climbing.
I got into climbing as an extension of my love of the mountains. As I got bored of hiking to lakes and mountain passes, I started finding my way up ridges and faces to see what there was to see. Sometimes it was a talus slog, but sometimes it was an exhilarating 5.easy scramble before I knew anything about the YDS.
Based on all that, you might understand why the only famous climbers I have any interest in are people like Fred Beckey, who went up into the unknown and maybe did or maybe didn't find a way up or back down. It's way more impressive to me, considering the risks, even if it turned out to be 5.6 in shitty weather, than watching Adam Ondra scream his way up some 5.15 sport route. Beckey, Clyde, and others were way more adventurous and took on so much more risk.
Before someone rushes to point out how Honnold free soloed a 5.13a on El Capitan, I'll admit it was an amazing feat that I will never replicate, but it's also lame that he rehearsed it on TR so many times. It was still badass to pull it off, but it would have been so much more impressive had he not trained on it.
Fred Beckey didn't rehearse his first ascents into the alpine with questionable gear.
What I hate more than the famous climbers, who are just making a good living off their talents, are the climbers who idolize them, especially those that refer to them on first-name basis when they've never met them in person. Climbers talk a great game about being rebellious and all that, but it's funny how so many of them fall into groupthink and groupspeak.
When I started climbing, I didn't know the names of any famous climbers except the two guys who first climbed Everest. It was just about love of the mountains, the rock, and the clean air. Now, I can't not hear (or see) people who consider themselves as rebels and as heirs to the outcasts of the Yosemite OGs slinging around the first names of badass pro climbers as if they know them.
I wish these people had just stayed in the gym.
That’s a lot of negativity to carry around towards things that have no material to impact on you.
Live and let live. Are there thing I see that make me think, “That’s kind of lame”? Sure, but animus beyond that is just yelling at clouds.
Personally I think the kinds of things that Bronwyn and Jacob do are some of the most interesting and impressive adventures there are. Some of Honnold’s accomplishments are truly impressive; some are merely interesting.
There are a million activities that people do that I find pointless or boring but if they find value in them I wouldn’t want to discourage them.
Practising a sequence of moves is not "lame"; instead it is responsible given the level of difficulty and his obligations. Practising on a TR does not ensure success when not on a TR. The risk of a fall maybe reduced as a result of practising but to describe it as 'lame' perhaps points to your questionable evaluation of risk taking.
Okay, Matt & Robert. I challenge you two to name one high-end solo that wasn’t practiced beforehand or one high-performing soloist that did not make that a standard practice.
Ben g
·
Jan 31, 2026
·
Unknown Hometown
· Joined Apr 2023
· Points: 0
Okay, Matt & Robert. I challenge you two to name one high-end solo that wasn’t practiced beforehand or one high-performing soloist that did not make that a standard practice.
I wonder if this song is in heavy rotation on AH’s Tool playlist?
”Hooker with a Penis”
I met a boy wearing Vans, 501s And a dope Beastie tee, nipple rings New tattoos that claimed that he Was OGT, back from '92, from the first EP
And in between sips of Coke He told me that he thought we were sellin' out Layin' down, suckin' up to the man
Well now I've got some Advice for you, little buddy Before you point the finger You should know that I'm the man I'm the man and you're the man And he's the man as well So you can point that fuckin' finger up your ass
All you know about me is what I've sold ya, dumb fuck I sold out long before you'd ever even heard my name I sold my soul to make a record, dip shit And then you bought one
I've got some advice for you, little buddy Before you point the finger You should know that I'm the man If I'm the fucking man Then you're the fucking man as well So you can point that fuckin' finger up your ass
All you know about me is what I've sold you, dumb fuck I sold out long before you'd ever even heard my name I sold my soul to make a record, dip shit And then you bought one
All you read and wear or see and Hear on tv is a product begging for your Fat-ass dirty dollar Shut up and
Buy, buy, buy my new record And buy, buy, buy, send more money Fuck you, buddy Fuck you, buddy Fuck you, buddy Fuck you, buddy
For those who didn't watch the post-climb interview, this is a good edit, especially 5:00 onward.
The main commentator did a much better job in this format and asked some worthwhile questions. Even better, she let him answer them. It's worth a watch.
Re: rehearsing a route for soloing, I find it interesting to imagine the thought process as someone does it. How much work does it take for someone to say, "yes, that's wired enough to stake my life on" ?
And then there's the inner voice telling you "oh, you fell when you were roped up there ... that would be game over." And later you have the memory of falling at those spots.
Just like when a classic band that goes through a lineup change ... different Strokes for different folks. I'm impressed by both types of accomplishment.
Okay, Matt & Robert. I challenge you two to name one high-end solo that wasn’t practiced beforehand or one high-performing soloist that did not make that a standard practice.
I’m fairly sure Honnold’s solo of The Phoenix 5.13 was onsight.
Pretty much down with that view, Robert S, with the adjustment that the feeling towards those who are overly familiar with pros or celebs is less of ‘hate’, and more like pity and a little disgust. But it is their divine right to make fools of themselves- far be it from me to deny them.
And the accomplishments of Beckey and Honnold are both amazing, but apples and oranges in comparison. True adventure in wild, unexplored places is also my own default, but climbing at the highest possible level is also incredible. What rankles is that too many seem to lump them together as being equal to each other.
MattB
·
Jan 31, 2026
·
Unknown Hometown
· Joined Sep 2009
· Points: 55
Okay, Matt & Robert. I challenge you two to name one high-end solo that wasn’t practiced beforehand or one high-performing soloist that did not make that a standard practice.
I’m fairly sure Honnold’s solo of The Phoenix 5.13 was onsight.
Bachar doing the Moratorium? I'd call that high-end onsight FS for the era
I got into climbing as an extension of my love of the mountains. As I got bored of hiking to lakes and mountain passes, I started finding my way up ridges and faces to see what there was to see. Sometimes it was a talus slog, but sometimes it was an exhilarating 5.easy scramble before I knew anything about the YDS.
Me too
Based on all that, you might understand why the only famous climbers I have any interest in are people like Fred Beckey, who went up into the unknown and maybe did or maybe didn't find a way up or back down. It's way more impressive to me, considering the risks, even if it turned out to be 5.6 in shitty weather, than watching Adam Ondra scream his way up some 5.15 sport route. Beckey, Clyde, and others were way more adventurous and took on so much more risk.
I also find adventure climbing and big alpine stuff more interesting, but Ondra’s climbs are undoubtedly more impressive than easy adventure climbing regardless of whether you like the style or find them interesting. Many climbers continue to quest into the unknown these days, few (none) can do what Adam does. Adam also climbed the Dawn wall in good style.
Before someone rushes to point out how Honnold free soloed a 5.13a on El Capitan, I'll admit it was an amazing feat that I will never replicate, but it's also lame that he rehearsed it on TR so many times. It was still badass to pull it off, but it would have been so much more impressive had he not trained on it. Fred Beckey didn't rehearse his first ascents into the alpine with questionable gear.
Sure, and Meru would have been more impressive as a free climb, but no climber on the planet is currently able to do that. Also, if onsight free soloes are your standard of badassery, I’m pretty sure Honnold should be your favorite climber, he has done a ton of them.
What I hate more than the famous climbers, who are just making a good living off their talents, are the climbers who idolize them, especially those that refer to them on first-name basis when they've never met them in person. Climbers talk a great game about being rebellious and all that, but it's funny how so many of them fall into groupthink and groupspeak.
When I started climbing, I didn't know the names of any famous climbers except the two guys who first climbed Everest. It was just about love of the mountains, the rock, and the clean air. Now, I can't not hear (or see) people who consider themselves as rebels and as heirs to the outcasts of the Yosemite OGs slinging around the first names of badass pro climbers as if they know them.
It sure seems like you idolize Beckey a lot, maybe remove the log from your eye? The first-name thing doesn’t matter, I think it’s more a reflection of the fact that climbing culture is casual and that someone is so famous they can be recognized even by an incredibly common first name. I have never met someone who calls Alex Honnold “Alex” in an effort to imply that they knew him. Also, I don’t think most gym-crag climbers have this fixation with rebellion and badassery, they are just doing their thing.
I wish these people had just stayed in the gym.
If you stick to adventurous first ascents in the mountains, you won’t ever encounter them and don’t need to worry about them.
So many good levels of potential irony in this reference.
I'm going to choose your intent was the "I" was Alex's voice, the "you" is Robert and everyone in the public eye is a sellout on some level.
Am I right?
Like many great lyrics, I prefer that the listener, through their own experience and perception interpret the meaning. Over the years, my initial response to some lyrics has changed or evolved through nuance and perspective. I just thought that this cut seemed particularly appropriate for the discussion at hand.
Offhand did not Marq Twight, Stevie Haston, Barry Blanchard, Erhart Loretan, Marc-Andre Leclerc, Voytek Kurtkya, Derek Hersey, Peter Croft solo plenty of super hard things unrehearsed?
This list of mega ultra badasses is long as shit and could go on and on
I’m fairly sure Honnold’s solo of The Phoenix 5.13 was onsight.
“I'd considered the Phoenix on and off all season. I'd worked on it for two days and thought about it a bit. I'd decided that if I did it I wanted one of my friends to shoot it. The first day I worked on the route there were TWO rainbows in the waterfall below us. It was amazing. I figured a route like that, especially one that you have to rap into and therefore already have a rope on just has to be shot. It's so beautiful. So after I rapped in and warmed up my friend pulled the rope and my harness back up and filmed the solo.”
Most certainly did not onsight free solo The Phoenix.
Got me wondering. What is the hardest known onsight free solo?
Here's what Google Gemini AI says:
The hardest known onsight free solo is difficult to definitively determine as climbers rarely publicize these ascents in advance due to the extreme danger and the personal nature of the challenge. However, some notable ascents are reported:
Michael Reardon reportedly onsight soloed routes up to a potential grade of 5.13b/c (around 8a/a+).
The general consensus within the climbing community places the hardest recorded free solos at a much higher grade when pre-practiced with a rope. The single-pitch free solo record stands at 5.14b (8c), achieved by Alfredo Webber on Panem et Circenses near Arco, Italy, though this was not an onsight.
For big walls, Alex Honnold's historic free solo of the 3,000-foot Freerider route on El Capitan was graded at 5.12d/5.13a (7c+/8a), a climb he practiced extensively beforehand. This climb is considered the "moon landing of free soloing" due to its combination of difficulty, length, and exposure.
Onsight soloing means climbing a route without any prior knowledge of the moves, holds, or sequence, which is a significant increase in risk compared to the already life-threatening act of free soloing a known route. The lack of reliable grading consensus and public documentation for true onsight free solos at the highest levels makes a definitive "hardest" claim nearly impossible to verify.
I would take what Google AI says about Michael Reardon onsight free solos with a big grain of salt. As far as I know, the hardest onsight free solo that he claimed was Romantic Warrior, which was heavily disputed. As for onsight soloing .13b/c, that was very much at Reardon’s redpoint level, so an onsight free solo sounds like something that AI may have hallucinated.
Okay, Matt & Robert. I challenge you two to name one high-end solo that wasn’t practiced beforehand or one high-performing soloist that did not make that a standard practice.
Sorry you didn't get the joke: "There's no red-pointing in soloing."
Because you [climber] went splat. No repeats allowed. It would be more like red-painting.
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