Epic on Solar Slab led to Avulsion Fracture (11/9/2025)

curvenutwrote:

Water so important !
1-2% = Slight decrease in alertness, increased reaction time
3% dehydration = Significant reduction in attention, impaired working memory 

And what is unfortunate, a lot of people are ready to bring less water just because of weight !

how the heck do you quantify 1-3% dehydration?
How would you know what level you were at? Or to know it's not exhaustion lack of calories causing greater effects? Just feels like numbers that mean nothing in the field.

I find feeling hydrated with a limited supply of water comes down to spreading it out more than the overall volume after a certain point.
If I'm doing a big day in a new area I'm not familiar with the 2/3 or 3/4 "rule". Use up to 66-75% in the more physical part of the day(the climbing) and have 25-33% left for the return trip.

Alex C wrote:

OP, thanks for writing this up. I applaud your self-reflection and wish you a speedy recovery.

I strongly agree with those who have recommended backing up your rap anchor. But the way I read OP’s report, the rope got stuck prior to reaching the fixed nut, and OP simply downclimbed (which is potentially even sketchier). OP, could you clarify?

If the latter, I wonder if the downclimb could have been avoided by cutting the stuck rope on the last rap (as someone else suggested) and using what remained for one additional rap.

Hi Alex,

Yes my rope got stuck before I ran into the fixed nut. So we downclimbed the section which was really sketchy. We didn't cut our ropes because we didn't have a knife and we were both incredibly dehydrated. Our decision making at that time was poor at best to be completely honest with you, having a knife at the time would have made that downclimb much easier but hindsight is 20/20. Thank you for the well wishes!

phylp phylpwrote:

Declan, I am very sorry you got hurt, but I am happy that neither you nor your partner had a worse accident or a fatality doing a first time descent in the dark while exhausted and dehydrated. There are a lot of things you can learn from this and your writing it up will help others. Here are some of my thoughts:

Some good points have been made about headlamp management and back up batteries, but as a learning point, I would like to add that as a newer climber (?) you should not be doing a route where the timing predicts that part of the climb or descent requires that you use a headlamp. By continuing past the top of pitch 7 and not rapping, you were pretty much guaranteeing that you would be doing part of an unknown descent in the dark. Even walking a rocky trail by headlamp has its dangers, as you have discovered. I try to time things such that I am getting back to the car by dark.

How does this timing work in practice? A common strategy to avoid darkness dangers is to agree with your partner a head of time on a turn around time. You picked a good objective in that at any point in the Gulley or Solar Slab itself, with 2 ropes, you could stop and retreat. 

Part of planning for big routes is being able to predict how long each part of the day is going to take: approach trail to base, climb, descent, trail back to car. Sometimes a reconnoiter day combined with a shorter objective in the same area can be so valuable to save time on the day of your long climb. Then obviously the most important aspect of predicting timing is knowing how fast you and your partner climb per pitch (or per 100 feet) at a particular grade. For shorter routes you can be casual and not watch the clock but for big routes you have to know you have the ability to move fast without rushing. I would say that from the base of the Gulley to the top of pitch 7 in 6.5 hours with pitches of those ratings is a bit too slow of a pitch time (once the time changes and it gets dark so much earlier). If you have never timed yourself, and you don't have a sense of how long it takes you to lead 150 feet of 5.5, 5.6, 5.7, 5.8, 5.9 etc., this could be a valuable observation for you to make.

Good luck, heal quickly!

Hi Phylp,

Thank you for the valuable advice. The goal of the day was to be done before it got dark, obviously that did not happen. The the part of taking too long to lead, yes each took longer than expected however, it is important to remember there were 2 parties ahead of us. I personally thought we should have just rapped the route after we got the top of pitch 7 but I was convinced by my partner to keep climbing. Hindsight is 20/20 and I have done a lot of self reflection about how I should trust my gut feeling to retreat. 

Happy sending!

Declan Westwrote:
The goal of the day was to be done before it got dark, obviously that did not happen. The the part of taking too long to lead, yes each took longer than expected however, it is important to remember there were 2 parties ahead of us. 

A key point is buried in here. On a classic route where you are likely to encounter other parties — and especially on an easy to moderate classic where you are likely to encounter slow parties — that should enter into your calculations too. Personally if I get to the base of a route and there are already two parties ahead, I tend to bail unless it’s fairly short and I’m really desperate to do that particular route. But even then I’d generally rather not waste my day waiting in line. Getting up ridiculously early is often preferable.

Even one party can be too many if they’re moving slow. I very nearly learned this the hard way some years ago on A Dream of White Horses in the UK, a traversing sea-cliff climb where you rap in and it’s impossible to bail after the first pitch. Thanks to a slow party before us, partner literally finished following the last pitch with the very last of the light. 

...

how the heck do you quantify 1-3% dehydration?
How would you know what level you were at? Or to know it's not exhaustion lack of calories causing greater effects? Just feels like numbers that mean nothing in the field.

If I remember correctly, when you get to 10% dehydration, you're dead; then you'll know exactly how dehydrated you are. 

I'm in general agreement that for the time being, you're probably the expert on knowing when you're dehydrated vs. exhausted vs. glucose/caffeine throttled. That said, pretty soon % dehydration will be something your smart watch (your smarty pants?) will tell you:

https://www.annualreviews.org/docserver/fulltext/bioeng/25/1/annurev-bioeng-062117-121028.pdf?expires=1763335874&id=id&accname=guest&checksum=E76E03CC1DD398765E2592C6EA5269FE

https://arxiv.org/pdf/2009.13626

dave custerwrote:

If I remember correctly, when you get to 10% dehydration, you're dead; then you'll know exactly how dehydrated you are. 

I'm in general agreement that for the time being, you're probably the expert on knowing when you're dehydrated vs. exhausted vs. glucose/caffeine throttled. That said, pretty soon % dehydration will be something your smart watch (your smarty pants?) will tell you:

https://www.annualreviews.org/docserver/fulltext/bioeng/25/1/annurev-bioeng-062117-121028.pdf?expires=1763335874&id=id&accname=guest&checksum=E76E03CC1DD398765E2592C6EA5269FE

https://arxiv.org/pdf/2009.13626

well color me intrigued....

I’ve been trad climbing for 30 years and guiding for 20. I was just in red rocks last weekend as a matter of fact. To be honest you didn’t really do anything major wrong. You had an epic for sure but that happens when you start getting on longer routes. You had a few small mistakes (or things that just didn’t go your way) and you had an epic. If it wasn’t for the broken ankle which I would chalk up to bad luck. ( I can’t even count how many times I’ve hiked out in the dark over the years. I’m sure I could’ve broken my ankle any number of times with an unlucky step) I also did lose a rope many years ago and never got it back. (Probably 1999) if it weren’t for the ankle it would have just been a long day that cost you a rope. Learn from the experience (better time management. Climbing big routes in November when it’s dark by 5. Moving efficiently, reliable headlamps) and keep getting out there. A lot of my most valuable lessons in the mtns were when I got my ass kicked. Best wishes on a quick recovery.

Declan, Thanks for sharing your story and learning. You made a few mistakes but we all do and you came away with great learning. Sorry about the rope. If you contact me Dale@JHMG.com I'll help get you a new rope so you can get back to climbing. Leaving gear behind is normal and next time back up that stopper with more gear. Best, Dale

Glad you're mostly ok.  Also, good job remembering and analyzing aspects of the descent that could have given in a worse accident.

Even 3pm seems kind of late for turn-around on Solar Slab in November. The fact that the partner resisted turning around has 2 interpretations:
(1) Up may have been the quicker way out from pitch 7 (considering the risk of stuck ropes etc)
(2) The partner wanted to finish the route regardless

I am sure (1) was voiced during the discussion, and it may even be true.  But, going forward, I would keep an eye on your partner's personality and tendency towards (2) because it can result in the same decision even when (1) is false.  It's not necessarily a question of right vs wrong, but ideally partners should have similar views on the risk/reward of finishing routes.

Hope your Ankle heals up soon.

Actually, sounds like a typical red rocks descent in the dark!  I don't remember descending in the daylight, although there was that one time with Scary Larry...anyway:

Many many moons ago, say around 1992 I did solar slab with a friend and we topped out at 5 pm.  There was no one else on the route that day and it was nice and sunny as advertised.  During that era, we only had the little red book which said something vague about descending the gully to the right.  Well, this was December, so it got dark at 5.  My wife liked to rotate my batteries at that time, and I think my headlamp used AAA's with a regular not LED bulb.  As soon as I turned it on the battery died.  I think there was moonlight, so I went without.  We then started what became 14 rappels.  There were no anchors or bolts back then.  I remember rapping off of a manzanita root into thin air (probably not the brightest idea!).  Finally, we got to the ground around 12:30 am.  Then in the final rappel the rope got stuck!  My buddy had to climb back up to free the rope.  We lived.  My dream is to go back and do the painted bowl descent...

You don't need a knife to cut a stuck rope.  Grab a rock and bash on it against the wall or against another rock.  Takes less than a minute.  Or faster if you get some tension on the rope.  I had to do this once in the wee hours of the night on a backcountry route in WA.

Thanks for the share. To add to the convo, I've been a big proponent of what I call "trad" chalk bags for long routes. Basically one with a zippered pocket. Lots of people make em. I like supporting cottage business and the ones made by Josh at Tufa up in Montana will do the trick (although the price has gone way up), but others like Misty Mountain and Mammut make decent product too so look around and you'll find one you like. https://tufaclimbing.com/products/cache-chalk-bag

In the zipper I put: 

1st) A tiny headlamp. I like the Petzl E-lite at 26 grams. They use coin cell batteries which don't degrade over time.  Better lamps are now available, so search it out. I like light and reliable as the 2 main features needed here.

2nd) A tiny lighter. Bic mini is a small version of their regular one that is supurb. 11 grams

3rd)  A tiny knife. I like the Trango Piranha at 20 grams, but CRKT makes a better one that Hans Floriene designed called NIAD. Very light as you'd expect, 17 grams. If you really want to go uber-light, piece of duck tape and tape a single edge razor blade to your helmet is something I know some folks do. Then you've also got some emergency duct tape. The CRKT people have a better serration than the Petzl ofr cuttng rope and webbing. Much beter. 

4th) A piece of paper towel. I like brawney. This has 2 functions. Emergency Toilet paper and as an emergency fire starter. The knife will get some tinder fuzz off a stick and the dry tp should work to get a fire started even in rain. Stuff it all in the zipper chalkbag pocket and off ya go. 

5th) Optional because it's heavy(ish), a mylar space blanket. So I'd stuff this in for say, climbing Epinephrine and maybe full Dark Shadows, but leave it out for days like Birdland or 4P Dark Shadows.

My son went off to college and took up climbing. I tossed some gear his way, including one of these set ups, along with the usual parential admonisions such as to "be careful". His chalkbag headlight was the origonal (now discontinued) Black Diamond Ion, a tiny lil POS thing that took a single 6V battery. Not very bright at all....embarassingly and dimly so. After a long day climbing he and 3 other beginners got benighted out at Hell's Canyon, the lonely and deepest canyon in the country. Getting down the hill (no trail) necessated navigating down some cliffs in the pitch black. He noted at the time that in their hour of need, he was the only one with a headlamp which was the one essential that helped them all survive and get back to the car in the pitch dark, alive. 

Billcoewrote:

3rd)  A tiny knife. I like the Trango Piranha at 20 grams, but CRKT makes a nice one that Hans Floriene designed called NIAD. Very light as you'd expect, 17 grams. If you really want to go uber-light, piece of duck tape and tape a single edge razor blade to your helmet is something I know some folks do. Then you've also got some emergency duct tape. 

The CRKT Hans knife, the NIAD, is no longer available and has not been for a long time, unfortunately. It's an awesome knife.
Be stoked if you find one, or have one.

Mr Rogerswrote:

The CRKT Hans knife, the NIAD, is no longer available and has not been for a long time, unfortunately. It's an awesome knife.
Be stoked if you find one, or have one.

I just ordered one after seeing Billcoe’s post. Ships from Hong Kong and is on sale now. 

https://www.knivescrkt.com/special-style-crkt-niad-framelock-folder-climbing-knife-1-625-satin-serr-2406/ 

Terry Ewrote:

I just ordered one after seeing Billcoe’s post. Ships from Hong Kong and is on sale now. 

https://www.knivescrkt.com/special-style-crkt-niad-framelock-folder-climbing-knife-1-625-satin-serr-2406/

I get the feeling that is a scam site unfortunately. Looks like that knife has been unavailable for a while according to Hans.

NIAD Knife - Reddit

hangontightly letgolightlywrote:

I get the feeling that is a scam site unfortunately. Looks like that knife has been unavailable for a while according to Hans.

NIAD Knife - Reddit

Definitely a scam site. Don't order from it.

Terry Ewrote:

I just ordered one after seeing Billcoe’s post. Ships from Hong Kong and is on sale now. 

https://www.knivescrkt.com/special-style-crkt-niad-framelock-folder-climbing-knife-1-625-satin-serr-2406/

Hans is a very good friend. They do not make it and have not for ages.
That site is a scam

Edit: glad ya remedied your CC situation quick Terry! I truly wish it wasn't a scam cause that knife is so good for its intended purpose.

Mike Larsonwrote:

Definitely a scam site. Don't order from it.

Thank you all!  Purchase hasn't gone through yet and I cancelled my credit card.

Sidebar. There are so many scam websites these days it is ridiculous. My MO with most all is to look at the contact us page and the address/phone number then do a google map search. Most any business, even one in an industrial park will at least have a business sign above the door. No sign and no valid phone number == scan site. That is not fool proof but it filters out most.

Also be careful with web sites that look like a mfg "store." Most are scam sites. If you find them, send the mfg an email with a link. I have many friends in the industry so usually contact them directly. They send it off to their legal folks which get the site shut down. It is whack-a-mole.

Second bar - my spouse recently placed an order with a shop that was a local to our state. Thinking it was local shop she placed an order, the charge went to a business in Hong Kong. When I looked up the address it was in an industrial park with no signage. She canceled the order, the company refunded the charge. So in this case the business while real it was located in Hong Kong but spoofing it was in the USA and local. When she canceled the order they said that the duty was paid by them. Which may have been true but why would a USA store be paying duty?  We pieced this together by looking at the CC charge and a google map search.

So in the end, one really needs to do their due diligence.  Gald Terry E was able to cancel the purchase.