Rab Apparel Quality?

Heard conflicting reports of Rab's build quality / durability going downhill in recent years. Switching from Arc/Patagucci to more value-oriented brands, and rab has some great pieces and discounts through the ACC. Primarily concerned about their sleeping bag quality as well as down / synthetic garments. Thanks! 

I've had multiple seams go on Rab garments. there seems to be great variety with material quality, some years going for some off brand synthetic and another year carrying primaloft.

One year they bought out an active insulation piece and lined it with a non breathable pertex, it was fixed in the next refresh. 

that guy named sebwrote:

I've had multiple seams go on Rab garments. there seems to be great variety with material quality, some years going for some off brand synthetic and another year carrying primaloft.

One year they bought out an active insulation piece and lined it with a non breathable pertex, it was fixed in the next refresh. 

Ah shoot, that's no good, what jackets were they? Were you able to warranty the pieces easily? how was their customer support? 

I think their stuff is a little hit or miss, but I've mostly had hits. I love their down jackets and sleeping bags, and I have the Nexus, I think? and it's one of my favorite pieces of technical gear.

only misses I've seen is some little defects here and there, weird stitching, bad fit, the kind of thing you notice right when you try it on.

Yukon Corneliuswrote:

I think their stuff is a little hit or miss, but I've mostly had hits. I love their down jackets and sleeping bags, and I have the Nexus, I think? and it's one of my favorite pieces of technical gear.

only misses I've seen is some little defects here and there, weird stitching, bad fit, the kind of thing you notice right when you try it on.

Thanks! this is helpful. Which of their sleeping bags do you have, and do you happen to know how old it is? It seems most of the issues are with gear around 2023 and onwards. I'm looking at their range of Expedition bags (Andes or Expedition 1000-1200), which are $$$ so hopefully the quality is there. Unfortunately I don't have a great Rab retailer near to me but it looks like their return policy is fairly good.

I've never had durability issues with Rab aside from down-fill shifting in the inner bicep baffle of two down belay jackets leaving noticiable cold spots. I contacted Rab and they had me send the jackets in and "re-filled" the baffle. The cold spots came and went - must've been an issue with how they constructed the arms baffles.

I find Mountain Equipment to suit my needs a bit better than Rab, but their selection is much more limited vs. most other brands.

M DPwrote:

Ah shoot, that's no good, what jackets were they? Were you able to warranty the pieces easily? how was their customer support? 

In the uk it's all warranty at the store you buy it from not the brand. Americans get better warranty experiences in general so my experience means nothing unfortunately. 

If you are after sleeping bags, build quality isn't much of a differentiator, it's all about material choice and attention to detail. There are plenty of brands that excel in this area and don't cost a ton, like mountain hardwear and marmot, I've had a bag from both, both are excellent. 

Rab is as good as it gets in my experience/opinion. Particularly their down products since that’s really what their business was created around. 

M DPwrote:

Thanks! this is helpful. Which of their sleeping bags do you have, and do you happen to know how old it is? It seems most of the issues are with gear around 2023 and onwards. I'm looking at their range of Expedition bags (Andes or Expedition 1000-1200), which are $$$ so hopefully the quality is there. Unfortunately I don't have a great Rab retailer near to me but it looks like their return policy is fairly good.

my girlfriend has a couple of their sleeping bags, all from maybe five years ago? and loves them. ive used her zero degree down bag and it's probably my favorite sleeping bag I've used, although I don't have a lot to compare it to.

their more expensive stuff is really top notch in my experience. I lived in my down parka all last winter!

Hey all, Eric Schafer here.  I run Rab USA's warranty and repair department and am probably the best person in the States to comment on any build quality or durability issues.  We have in-house technicians in our Louisville, CO office who are repairing thousands of pieces a year.

I've been in this position for about 5 years and our department works on tons of pieces going back 10-20 years.  Every brand will run into occasional production issues where a particular factory run or even a particular style might have issues and we're no exception.  That said, there has been no tangible decline in build quality or durability.  Durability is largely tied to the weight of materials used (heavier fabrics are almost always more durable).  Something like the Mythic Ultra will be less durable than the Positron Pro, but that's by design--pick whichever works better for you.

If anything, I'd say the opposite is true.  Take the Microlight Alpine--our best selling down jacket.  In ~2018, we moved the main zipper from a #4.5c to a #5 reverse coil--much burlier zipper that will last longer.  On top of that, the construction has been tweaked a few times to make it easier to repair.  These are things a customer might not notice, but repairability makes a big difference in the longevity of the jacket.  A zipper will always wear out with enough use and having the infrastructure and design in place to easily replace that zipper means the jacket can last another 10-15 years.

Admittedly, I'm biased, but I think our down pieces are some of the best in the industry, especially at the price point.  Between the Andes and Expedition bags, personally, I prefer the expedition sleeping bags. Here's a list of staff-favorite pieces that I send out to folks looking for general recommendations:

• Borealis Jacket (Women’s) - Perfect summer high alpine layer. Super light and breathable soft shell at 9.6oz. There is also an alpine version (Women's) that caters to alpine climbing.
• Microlight Alpine Jacket (Women’s) - Classic hooded ~16oz down jacket with 153g of down fill. Great for casual or technical use.
• Xenair Alpine Light Jacket (Women’s) - Solid shoulder-season synthetic jacket or active insulation layer in colder temps. Body-mapped insulation with less under the arms. Surprisingly durable. I climbed the Casual Route on Longs in this piece and thought it would have been shredded from struggling up the chimney; no damage at all.
• Neutrino Pro Jacket (Women’s) - Excellent belay jacket (or expedition jacket on Rainier or similar).  Only 20oz total weight with 212g of down fill. For when you’re sitting around at camp or any time you’re not climbing in “good friction” temps.
• Momentum Pants (Women’s) - Our lightest soft shell pant at 8.4oz.  Same material as the Borealis.  Great for high-output activities or in hot conditions where you want leg coverage.
• Sonic Hoody (Women’s) - Super light sun hoody at just 4oz.  We have worn it in some of the sunniest high alpine conditions.
• Evolute Hoody (Women's) - Solid midlayer with fuzzy insulation similar to Polartec Alpha.  Very breathable and comfortable.
• Any of the Neutrino sleeping bags - Some of the best in the industry without compromising too much on durability.

Eric Schaferwrote:

Hey all, Eric Schafer here.  I run Rab USA's warranty and repair department and am probably the best person in the States to comment on any build quality or durability issues.  We have in-house technicians in our Louisville, CO office who are repairing thousands of pieces a year.

I've been in this position for about 5 years and our department works on tons of pieces going back 10-20 years.  Every brand will run into occasional production issues where a particular factory run or even a particular style might have issues and we're no exception.  That said, there has been no tangible decline in build quality or durability.  Durability is largely tied to the weight of materials used (heavier fabrics are almost always more durable).  Something like the Mythic Ultra will be less durable than the Positron Pro, but that's by design--pick whichever works better for you.

If anything, I'd say the opposite is true.  Take the Microlight Alpine--our best selling down jacket.  In ~2018, we moved the main zipper from a #4.5c to a #5 reverse coil--much burlier zipper that will last longer.  On top of that, the construction has been tweaked a few times to make it easier to repair.  These are things a customer might not notice, but repairability makes a big difference in the longevity of the jacket.  A zipper will always wear out with enough use and having the infrastructure and design in place to easily replace that zipper means the jacket can last another 10-15 years.

Admittedly, I'm biased, but I think our down pieces are some of the best in the industry, especially at the price point.  Between the Andes and Expedition bags, personally, I prefer the expedition sleeping bags. Here's a list of staff-favorite pieces that I send out to folks looking for general recommendations:

• Borealis Jacket (Women’s) - Perfect summer high alpine layer. Super light and breathable soft shell at 9.6oz. There is also an alpine version (Women's) that caters to alpine climbing.
• Microlight Alpine Jacket (Women’s) - Classic hooded ~16oz down jacket with 153g of down fill. Great for casual or technical use.
• Xenair Alpine Light Jacket (Women’s) - Solid shoulder-season synthetic jacket or active insulation layer in colder temps. Body-mapped insulation with less under the arms. Surprisingly durable. I climbed the Casual Route on Longs in this piece and thought it would have been shredded from struggling up the chimney; no damage at all.
• Neutrino Pro Jacket (Women’s) - Excellent belay jacket (or expedition jacket on Rainier or similar).  Only 20oz total weight with 212g of down fill. For when you’re sitting around at camp or any time you’re not climbing in “good friction” temps.
• Momentum Pants (Women’s) - Our lightest soft shell pant at 8.4oz.  Same material as the Borealis.  Great for high-output activities or in hot conditions where you want leg coverage.
• Sonic Hoody (Women’s) - Super light sun hoody at just 4oz.  We have worn it in some of the sunniest high alpine conditions.
• Evolute Hoody (Women's) - Solid midlayer with fuzzy insulation similar to Polartec Alpha.  Very breathable and comfortable.
• Any of the Neutrino sleeping bags - Some of the best in the industry without compromising too much on durability.

Thanks so much for taking the time to respond, Eric! The inner insight is much appreciated. What is the process for people in Canada to submit warranties? is there a repairs centre here or does everything need to be sent to CO?

M DPwrote:

Thanks so much for taking the time to respond, Eric! The inner insight is much appreciated. What is the process for people in Canada to submit warranties? is there a repairs centre here or does everything need to be sent to CO?

No problem at all.  We actually have a separate Canadian office that handles everything north of the border (in Montreal).  They also have an in-house repair tech who is super knowledgeable and has decades of experience.  I'm on a call with him and other Warranty/Repair leads around the world once a month to provide feedback to the design team in the UK and identify any potential production issues.

To submit a warranty claim in Canada, you'd start on that region of the website ( rab.equipment/ca/), hit the "Contact us" button at the bottom, and select "Repairs, Warranty, Spare Parts" from the dropdown menu.

I'll add my two cents from my Rab experience. I've had their Neutrino down jacket for 10 years now, and a 0 degree down sleeping bag for 13 years. Both have been amazing, and while I don't use them as hard or as often as some, I'm definitely not gentle on my gear. My only complaints are a bit of loss of down in the foot box of the sleeping bag and all over on the jacket (expected), and the main zipper's been a bit funky on the jacket. My girlfriend has a softshell that she definitely is gentle on but also loves it. They seem to fit roughly Arcteryx-like which I appreciate, since Arcteryx seems to be on the downhill slide. I'll probably be looking at Rab for a hardshell once my Arcteryx kicks the bucket.