Edelrid Swift Protect Pro 8.9 - Still an 8.9

Despite some excellent marketing and seemingly exciting technology from Edelrid, my new Swift Protect Pro dry suffered a core-shot in less than 3 months and maybe ~50 pitches.

It was somewhat my fault, as I swang on TR (I expect there to be a few "WhY wErE yOu ToP roPinG" comments) over an edge that seemed very smooth (Red Rock sandstone). Although I may be a gumby, its disapointing as it seems by edelrid's testing the rope should be as cut-resitant, if not more than a 10mm, and no other ropes in our party suffered such damage from similar use.

Edelrid did not respond to my first warranty claim, so I had to track down a phone number and then they requested I email them. They responded that this was not covered by their warranty and "The warranty department sees ropes last a shorter time and for years." they offered 50% off my next. purchase but gave no discount code or instructions.

Again, maybe my fault, but pretty disapointed.

On the one hand, I'd be bummed too, especially if there was no obvious sharp edge.

On the other hand, shit happens, ropes are consumables, and even a 10mm could get core shot since the scenario you described is in some ways worst-case (I'm assuming you took before swinging, so all of the wear was on one point). I would baby a rope like that more than a literal child - it would be reserved for alpine routes and redpoint burns only. 

Nice of Edelrid to give you half off, that's a win in my book.

Indeed. I core shot mine when I stupidly placed a cam above me in a v flare where the angle changed from the slight overhang below, proceeded to take a couple falls on it. I was bummed at first, but then thought about how much more core shot would a different rope have been. Catastrophic core shot vs. the just barely visible core shot I experienced. Who knows.  

Garrett Genereux wrote:

Indeed. I core shot mine when I stupidly placed a cam above me in a v flare where the angle changed from the slight overhang below, proceeded to take a couple falls on it. I was bummed at first, but then thought about how much more core shot would a different rope have been. Catastrophic core shot vs. the just barely visible core shot I experienced. Who knows.  

Yeah, and just barely visible in my case too. I wish I could go back and investigate that edge and see how sharp it really was.

Take a look at the canary, the sheath % is very visibly different compared to the swift and in hand the diameter is barely noticeable different 

Matthew Rosen wrote:

Yeah, and just barely visible in my case too. I wish I could go back and investigate that edge and see how sharp it really was.

What route was it on?

mbk wrote:

What route was it on?

https://www.mountainproject.com/v/105938692

There to Here, fell near the top where I wasnt expecting to.

Jabroni McChufferson wrote:

Take a look at the canary, the sheath % is very visibly different compared to the swift and in hand the diameter is barely noticeable different 

8.8! Sheesh! Ill prob stay away from super skinny ropes for awhile. I already had ordered a 80m Dry Crag Classic from Mammut before Edelrid offered their 50% off.

Matthew Rosen wrote:

8.8! Sheesh! Ill prob stay away from super skinny ropes for awhile. I already had ordered a 80m Dry Crag Classic from Mammut before Edelrid offered their 50% off.

Realistically the canary is a heavy skinny rope because of the sheath %. For example I have a 70m canary that is slightly heavier than my 60m mammut protect 9.5 

I core shot my 60m 8.9 in its first week during a rope solo outing - was pretty stoked to see if it would hold up. Obviously with fixing and jugging you're likely to core shot, and I did. Whatever, it happens. I'd probably use the 8.9 as an alpine rope where falls are unlikely, the weight savings are worth it, and the cut resistance could give that extra margin. That being said, I still haven't killed the canary. Not sure what to do with my 80m 8.9 since I prefer the handling of other ropes for sport 

I hope you learn your lesson:

1. Thinner rope is always less durable/abrasion resistant

2. TR over edge is not the best idea. Constant rubbing even if you don't fall, and edge loading if you fall. On sandstone the edge might now be that sharp, but the rubbing will damage the rock and leave a lot of sand on your rope, which will make the abrasion to your carabiner worse. Try to use long slings/quad to extent your anchor.

To me, deciding which rope to buy is mostly about weight vs durability. I honestly don't think a lighter rope will make you send harder on a sports climb. I'd rather have a 9.5 - 9.8mm rope if I know I am whipping a lot (even thicker if I TR a lot). Lighter rope is mostly useful when in multipitch/alpine setting, where the approach is long and your have to pull the rope up a lot.

FYI I have whipped on a Beal Opera (8.5 mm single rope) once. Wouldn't be stoked about whipping on that repeatedly in a session...

Never quite understood the use case of the Swift Protect outside multipitch/alpine. If you're using it for sport/TR, it'll hold up due to the sheath % but with the tradeoff in fuzz due to the aramid interwoven with the sheath. Maybe it's just me, but I hate fuzzy ropes, not least because they pick up dirt so easily, which in turn renders the dry treatment useless.

The Mammut Core Protect is a genuine advancement, but since it's only available in 9.5 or 8.0 it too does not match the use case it's best for (multipitch/alpine) due to weight. When Mammut integrates their Core Protect aramid sheath into their 7.5 or 8.7 lines, I think it'll be game over for the Edelrid Protect series until they come up with something better.

Love mine! I’ve had it for ~6 months and have used it for general duty - multi, cragging, and yes top roping. It’s probably taken dozens of short falls and it seems to holding up fine.

The aramid has gotten a little fuzzy and the rope still handles kinda stiff. Overall I’m satisfied and will likely purchase another.

Joker unicore

9.1 that is as light as all these and I've found much easier to find for cheap

Stoked Weekend Warrior wrote:

I hope you learn your lesson:

1. Thinner rope is always less durable/abrasion resistant

2. TR over edge is not the best idea. Constant rubbing even if you don't fall, and edge loading if you fall. On sandstone the edge might now be that sharp, but the rubbing will damage the rock and leave a lot of sand on your rope, which will make the abrasion to your carabiner worse. Try to use long slings/quad to extent your anchor.

To me, deciding which rope to buy is mostly about weight vs durability. I honestly don't think a lighter rope will make you send harder on a sports climb. I'd rather have a 9.5 - 9.8mm rope if I know I am whipping a lot (even thicker if I TR a lot). Lighter rope is mostly useful when in multipitch/alpine setting, where the approach is long and your have to pull the rope up a lot.

FYI I have whipped on a Beal Opera (8.5 mm single rope) once. Wouldn't be stoked about whipping on that repeatedly in a session...

The Edelrid 8.9 is way more durable over an edge than your average rope. I tested it on a real rock edge and a 9.4mm rope got its sheath cut in 1/3rd the time of the Edelrid 8.9mm. I am pretty confident the 8.9mm Edelrid is more cut resistant than my 9.9mm rope, and probably by quite a lot. 

Its made for multipitch and alpine, where you are not expecting to fall.

When you are lowering, and the loaded rope is running over an edge, the location of the abrasion is changing. If you are top roping or leading, fall and hang, and pretty much just go down, not sideways, the rope stretch distributes the wear over a section of the rope and you stop and hang. The rope pretty much isn't moving any more. If you fall, then swing back and forth repeatedly and the rope is sliding across the edge... the area of the abrasion is not changing. This is a bad thing for the rope, no matter the rope. See it as this: The rope is not "sliding" back and forth along an edge, its "sawing" back and forth along this edge in a single spot.

I have seen a brand new 9.8x70m core shot like this on its very first route, on sandstone too.

If you have an extremely dialed belayer, they may see the potential for this and continuously lower you while you swing to prevent all the wear concentrated on a single spot... but people are generally not thinking about this at all.

When you are rappelling and the rope runs over a sharp edge, the idea is to minimize movement of the rope against the edge. Both side to side and up and down (from stretch). Smooth slow raps.

Desert Rock Sports wrote:

Its made for multipitch and alpine, where you are not expecting to fall.

When you are lowering, and the loaded rope is running over an edge, the location of the abrasion is changing. If you are top roping or leading, fall and hang, and pretty much just go down, not sideways, the rope stretch distributes the wear over a section of the rope and you stop and hang. The rope pretty much isn't moving any more. If you fall, then swing back and forth repeatedly and the rope is sliding across the edge... the area of the abrasion is not changing. This is a bad thing for the rope, no matter the rope. See it as this: The rope is not "sliding" back and forth along an edge, its "sawing" back and forth along this edge in a single spot.

I have seen a brand new 9.8x70m core shot like this on its very first route, on sandstone too.

If you have an extremely dialed belayer, they may see the potential for this and continuously lower you while you swing to prevent all the wear concentrated on a single spot... but people are generally not thinking about this at all.

When you are rappelling and the rope runs over a sharp edge, the idea is to minimize movement of the rope against the edge. Both side to side and up and down (from stretch). Smooth slow raps.

Be wary of the Swift Protect. After Robbie Philips and a partner found they'd blown a nut and a cam on a fairly small fall, I did a bit of digging into possible reasons why 5kn peices were breaking. Turns out the impact forces on the Swift Protect are a LOT more than normal equivalents. In summary - potentially 50% more forces compared to Beal Cobra half ropes and 33% more forces compared to Beal Opera as a single.

Jabroni McChufferson wrote:

Take a look at the canary, the sheath % is very visibly different compared to the swift and in hand the diameter is barely noticeable different 

I have the older canary that's 8.6mm claimed... wouldn't dream of TRing on it, it's so dang stretchy. That thing only comes out for routes with mix of glacier travel and pitched climbing, or maaaybe easy alpine rock route with a long approach. But for mostly alpine rock I'd rather bring my 9.2 petzl volta. 

Canary 8.6 left 8.9 protect right 

Wow that is a ton of sheath, which is actually the reason I bought it (this was before the protect line existed). 

. wrote:

Love mine! I’ve had it for ~6 months and have used it for general duty - multi, cragging, and yes top roping. It’s probably taken dozens of short falls and it seems to holding up fine.

The aramid has gotten a little fuzzy and the rope still handles kinda stiff. Overall I’m satisfied and will likely purchase another.

Same here, bout 6 months going strong but a bit fuzzy/stiff. Idk if I'd get another one but satisfied. I only bought like 40 meters