To back up the haul bag or to not. that is the question.

So...

To back up the haul bag or not. that is the question. whether tis nobler is to spend the time and back it up. The slings and daisies of outrageous fortune...
you get the point.

I did try and look around and was unable to find much related to specifically this!

Do you folks back up your haul bags?
If there are two bags, I understand that each bag backs up the other bag, but what if there is just one bag?

One thing i found when trying systems out, is that it is very easy (for me specifically) to forget to remove the non-load-releasable backup before dropping the bag which then required me to rig a mini 2-1 to haul the bag off of that before being able to lower out the bag. Maybe the technique is to not be stupid and not do that...

I saw on a photo from Dr. piton himself (see attached), that he seems to back up EVERY haul bag with an adjustable daisy, but now my question... Adjustable daisies are, yes, load releasable but are only rated to a few KN (if i recall). I also know that to pass knots while rapping, having load releasable systems makes passing a knot with the pig much much more enjoyable.

I went on a trip to Yosemite a couple of years ago with a group of friends. We're mostly noobs.

We had a haulbag docking krab in each anchor kit extended down from a bolt krab with a quickdraw (iirc this a piece of Hudson advice). We had every haulbag attached to the docking krab with a 'double tail' style tether as the main attachment. Also a backup tether made of a single strand of 7.5mm dynamic rope with a tied off munter at the clipping to the anchor end. The backup tether was clipped to wherever (sometimes forgotten). Mostly we were climbing with one bag (or one bag with a second small light one clipped to the bottom of the first, making the second bag largely irrelevant in this discussion).

Because we are noobs we did forget to remove the backup tether a few times, including at least once on a pretty traversing pitch, so it had a lot of tension on it. The tied off munter could then be used to release the bags.

It's not a perfect solution - it's not adjustable, it's a little bulky (though not actually too bad with a thin rope), it has to be re-tied if you do end up using it. I think that for a team where everyone is competent at setting up a little 2:1 to get the tension off the backup tether that you forgot to unclip, or is strong enough to just yank the bag(s) back over with one hand and unclip with the other it's a bit pointless. However for a team of weak incompetents it's not a bad solution and could easily save you a considerable amount of wasted time*!

I have wondered about using a petzl adjust/camp swing, with either no knot or a releasable knot on the end. It could be almost more like the primary tether, for initial clipping of the bag to the anchor and adjusting position. Then tie on your normal releasable tether as a backup, would have to be tied shorter than the max extent of your adjust/swing tether. When it comes time to let the bags go, loosen off the adjust/swing, unclip and release as normal with the releasable tether. If you forget to unclip the adjust/swing, just let the rope go through it.

*Unfortunately I know this from experience.

Yes, that is how I do it. I have two points of connection for each pig, these being a Yates style adjustable Daisy plus a doubled 7 mm docking cord tied in a regular load release knot.

I will crank the pigs as tight as possible on the non-stretching adjustable Daisy, and then I will add the stretchy load release knot afterwards. If you hang the pigs from the 7mm docking tether cord first, you will lose a lot of height as the cord stretches under weight.

And as you correctly recognize, you have to have the presence of mind to release the adjustable Daisy first, and then use the load release knot cord for the final release. 

On such occasions as the haul is plumb, it doesn't really matter which one you release first. But lots of hauls are diagonal, and sooner or later you will find your pigs hosed on the end of the adjustable daisy. This is not big wall theory, this is big wall fact. Accordingly, get into the habit of always unclipping the adjustable daisy first!

Cheers, eh? 

PtPP aka Dr. Piton

Without having a dedicated adjustable daisy to spare to use Pete's method ( he uses them everywhere dammit, currently using my 2 spares on my ledge). I found the easiest way to back them up was when incorporating them into my self belay as the dynamic element on the lead rope. This year I have partners lined up and am going to try using a Kong slide on an old climbing rope length tied on.

A doubled hunk of 7mm perlon is pretty strong, but mistakes happen. I did stupidly drop a pig once off of Scorched Earth.  We had to speed up to make it to the top before we ran out of supplies, but we made it.  

Another thing you can do is - after you dock your pig on your 7mm docking tether cord tied in a load release knot, and after this doubled cord is weighted - is add another sling on top.  Just be bloody sure you unclip that backup sling before you untie the load release knot!!!

I'm a relatively beginner big waller (just the nose and the freerider so far), but I don't do a backup. I also don't dock the bags separately, I have them all attached to a mini rigging plate, and have a 9.5mm rope tied to the top of the rigging place which attaches to the anchor with a munter mule overhand. I'm not sure what the benefits are to docking them separately, or doing the 7mm doubled up munter mule, or to backing it up.

I always dock my haul bags with a piece of 7mm person and a hunter/mule knot.  I use a 25 foot piece that doubles as a short lower out.  I also back up the bags with a clove hitch on the haul line into the anchor. you do need to remember to untie the back up before the haul line goes tight but that's just part of the deal.