Grivel North Machine Carbon.... Good???

Graham Johnson wrote:

I have climbed on the total ice on dark machines but to be honest the dark machines are such a compromised tool that it’s hard to evaluate how the picks performed. I like the normal forged ice picks on both tech machines and North machines- never had an issue with getting good sticks, they are plenty durable and just perform well all-round I think. 

Why do you say the dark machines are compromised? 

Bdot Bdot wrote:

Just an aside from the conversation, any opinions on ice rock products? I don't see any of their tools in the wild but I do get interested when I see a aspeed or a skeleton in an old photo. The technical specs on all their products really interest me

I have not one but two sets of aspeeds. Best drytool around in my opinion, especially the new version with the long handle. My first set has  held up to my heavy ass beating on them for 6 years now and aren’t showing signs of slowing down either.

I have non-carbon north machines and I've used a fair variety of tools just because I've had the opportunity to climb with friends and share. I really like mine. They are surprisingly light, but still swing nice imo. Ive climbed WI4 and up to M4 on them. In thin ice they have fantastic finesse. Because they don't have as much of a grip offset, sometimes they can be a little more challenging to stick when you're topping out or coming over a big bulge where you are swinging with your arms more forward, not directly above, but your body is still vertical. It requires more wrist motion but its something to consider. Not a deal breaker by any means.