Do you need a bd #7 for freerider

I have 2 6s would having a 7 be ideal mainly for the monster, can’t seem to find but beta on this. 

6 is more or less useless in 3/4ths of hollow flake, 7 fits well in this section. 

(Imo) It would be extremely hard to fall out of the hollow flake where the 6 doesn’t fit. 

I don’t think a 7 vs a 6 is a measurable difference in the monster, and  2x6 is fine (as well as 6+7)

Matt Carrollwrote:

6 is more or less useless in 3/4ths of hollow flake, 7 fits well in this section. 

(Imo) It would be extremely hard to follow out of the hollow flake where the 6 doesn’t fit. 

I don’t think a 7 vs a 6 is a measurable difference in the monster, and  2x6 is fine (as well as 6+7)

Thank you! 

If you need a 7 to protect the Hollow Flake there really isn’t much of a chance you’re going to get up Freerider.

And one 6 and one 5 is all you need for the Monster

Mark Hudonwrote:

If you need a 7 to protect the Hollow Flake there really isn’t much of a chance you’re going to get up Freerider.

And one 6 and one 5 is all you need for the Monster

Haha yeah that’s what I was thinking 

I think you should soothe your doubts in consumerism.

just to be safe.

Having a #7 makes the monster much more chill.

I've lead the monster with 2x6 and 6+7 and would prefer the latter.

It's worth noting that you do have to be careful getting your cam stuck on the monster.  It's possible in different sections to get the 6 or 7 stuck. 

I also don't understand why you would bring a #5. My reasoning behind bringing 2x #6 is that at some points it's too wide for a 6, but if you have two you can have one in a good spot and one in a bad spot (both cams above you on tethers) and then push one so it's good again. 

To simply this a bit more. I feel that the pitch goes as follows:

• Undercling down flake, do big move into monster place single #6.
• Bump #6 until you are at the first no-hands that's equal with the anchor, Sling the nice horn and continue. 
• Bump your two cams (2x 6 or 6+7) until you get to the Bermuda Dunes anchor. Clip a bolt. 
• Now the climbing gets wide and has a cruxy section above a chimney. #7 is great here #6 is tipped out. 
• Bump cams until you notice the crack thinning. Leave behind second #6 or #7.
• Bump #6 until it's almost stuck and then leave it behind
• Clip fixed #6 is stuck in crack
• Place whatever gear you like on the ramp up and right to the anchor. 

Luke

I’m smaller than most people so maybe I fit into it better but I don’t find the Monster to be too very difficult, I feel pretty secure in it. I push a 6 up it till the crux (imho, where that little overlap on the left face about 2/3 of the way up is). I push a five up after that and leave it to protect the moves exiting the crack.

The second time I did it, the first time I led it, I did the down climb with no gear at all. I climbed up to the pillar and pulled up the gear and continued. I also took a timed 10 rest at the bolts and another in the pod just below the crux. I wasn’t harried or out of breath nor did I lose any skin when I did the crux. I was quite proud of that! 

Mark Hudonwrote:

If you need a 7 to protect the Hollow Flake there really isn’t much of a chance you’re going to get up Freerider.

I definitely know someone that brought the #7 for the hollow flake and have sent FR but if I mention their name I’ll probably have to sleep on the couch for a little while…

Ha!

I’m gonna have to rib her about it next time I see her. 

Luke Stefurakwrote:

Having a #7 makes the monster much more chill.

I've lead the monster with 2x6 and 6+7 and would prefer the latter.

Agree 100% and think Luke's beta is great, with the additional lazy/weak tips that you can climb the first section with just a #6 on your left side, then easily tag over a #7 and #4 or #5 (and water!) at the pedestal rest if you want to make the start even easier and wet your whistle after the initial squirm. Odds are your follower will appreciate some water there too and hanging a bottle on the slung pillar keeps the sling secured.

With a #6 on the monster, there are multiple spots in the upper part (maybe just a couple 5-6' stretches, but still...) where a #6 BD or Friend is too small to not tip out and fall over, so if you are just relying on a single #6 on a tether you'll have to finagle this temporarily useless giant chunk of metal tied to your waist so that it doesn't get in your way as your squirm upwards while also looking at a huge fall should you slip. (last pro would have been either your other #6 left somewhere far below or else the midway bolt).

Also after borrowing the mysterious #7 Mikey alluded and using it on the hollow flake it made the final 40' so much more relaxed, quick, and far less calorie intensive than without it. If you don't have a #7 it shouldn’t stop you (from trying either pitch), but you are climbing while knowing that a slip will lead to a 50-60 foot fall (as the best outcome) and very likely an end to your attempt on the route or severe injury. It is secure and can be climbed in a slow, kinda strenuous, super-secure style, but you end up climbing it as though you are free soloing. With a #7 it actually feels like a 5.9 or whatever and I enjoyed it more and did it faster.

blakeherringtonwrote:

With a #6 on the monster, there are multiple spots in the upper part (maybe just a couple 5-6' stretches, but still...) where a #6 BD or Friend is too small to not tip out and fall over, so if you are just relying on a single #6 on a tether you'll have to finagle this temporarily useless giant chunk of metal tied to your waist so that it doesn't get in your way as your squirm upwards while also looking at a huge fall should you slip. (last pro would have been either your other #6 left somewhere far below or else the midway bolt).

I was able to find secure placements the whole way - just a few sections where it has to be placed maybe 2+’ back in the crack instead of overhead - at the extent of the range, but fully engaged and secure.  I actually don’t like a larger cam as the ones I’ve tried eventually overcam and have to be removed - burns calories.  The one spot a 6 doesn’t work - a 7 won’t either - at the pod where you chimney a bit - ez and gear just below your feet.

Also - you can’t downgrade the thing and talk about leading it like a p**s in the same post.

I did the monster and hollow flake recently. I'm from the UK so don't do much in the way of sustained wide stuff.

Thought the hollow flake was pretty secure. Though I did layback for a while above the bit level with the belay so maybe missed an awkward bit there? I was inside for the last 15m or so. I don't think I did it very well technically speaking, was a bit thrutchy and inelegant, but I felt secure and didn't feel the need for any gear, certainly don't think having a #7 would have made me faster. I do like soloing though, so ymmv.

For the monster I didn't really know what I needed so I had two #6, a #5 and a #4 (and a draw or two). I tagged most of it over at the hands off just above the level of the belay on the ear, I think I took one of the #6 on the downclimb and bumped it up to that hands off. I didn't sling the horn that apparently exists here. Carried on bumping the #6 to the bolt belay, clipped a draw. Carried on bumping #6 til I accidentally got it stuck in a thin bit, so I clipped it, this was actually pretty annoying cos I didn't extend it enough and it meant the rope kept getting stuck under my outside foot, which hadn't been a problem before. Then bumped the second #6 to pretty much the top. Getting past the stuck #6 was really annoying, would be nice if it was removed (we weren't able to), didn't clip it. Placed the #4 either just before or after the exit moves and left it clipped to protect the ramp. Removed the second #6 at some point but could have left it clipped I guess.

I never felt like the #6 was too tipped out or had to remove it because it was too small and wouldn't stay in.

If I were to do it again I think I'd do it with one #6 to bump up (and be more careful not to get it stuck in the thin bit). I'd rather not have to haul a #5 or #7 or an extra #6. If I were taking a #5 on the route anyway I'd take it and do the method Mark described.

James Wwrote:

Also - you can’t downgrade the thing and talk about leading it like a p**s in the same post.

I have no idea what this means but anyone can suggest any grade they want regardless of how many cams they brought on a pitch. 

 I would not suggest downgrading the monster and was intimidated to lead it despite having a bigger cam my first time.

blakeherringtonwrote:

Also after borrowing the mysterious #7 Mikey alluded and using it on the hollow flake it made the final 40' so much more relaxed, quick, and far less calorie intensive than without it. [sic] With a #7 it actually feels like a 5.9 or whatever and I enjoyed it more and did it faster.

Blake, perhaps some re-quoting will help clear up the confusion. I think James was assuming you were talking about the monster when you said it feels like 5.9

Cheers,

Luke

Luke Stefurakwrote:

Blake, perhaps some re-quoting will help clear up the confusion. I think James was assuming you were talking about the monster when you said it feels like 5.9

Cheers,

Luke

That make sense. 

It's ironic because I guess I was offhandly suggesting an upgrade not a downgrade since the hollow flake is just 5.8 on the topo. Either way, I don't think it's worth bringing a #7 up the route for just the hollow flake, but if you have one on hand already, you may as well use it on that pitch and not just the monster. 

I hope you are doing well these days Luke!

Mark Hudonwrote:

I’m smaller than most people so maybe I fit into it better but I don’t find the Monster to be too very difficult, I feel pretty secure in it....

i have a question about this. i think the monster OW gets something like 11d on the topos, but several folks i know who have climbed it said it's more like mid-10 (and several of these folks, maybe even most of them i wouldn't consider very good OW climbers).  curious to see what other folks on here who have climbed it think.  in my experience, 11d OW is hard as fuck.

climbs sometimes wrote:

11+ to downclimb into it. 

ahhhh, interesting. thanks.  i was assuming the OW sections were at the grade.  (apparently i forgot samuel l jackson's priceless advise about assumptions.)

Sorry for reactivating this old thread, but would you consider bringing a #8 instead if you did not have a #8? Or is the #8 too big for the wider cracks on Freerider?

no, I personally wouldn't consider it. I don't think an 8 would really fit anywhere of consequence on the route. 

slimwrote:

i have a question about this. i think the monster OW gets something like 11d on the topos, but several folks i know who have climbed it said it's more like mid-10 (and several of these folks, maybe even most of them i wouldn't consider very good OW climbers).  curious to see what other folks on here who have climbed it think.  in my experience, 11d OW is hard as fuck.

I was talking with one of the Wide Boyz, Pete Whittaker, and mentioned that I didn’t think that the Monster was very difficult. Pete said, “No, Mark, it’s difficult”.