Modular crampon systems

Looking for some advice on switching crampons. Right now I've got the g12s and g22+ for mountaineering and climbing. They're both solid, but are heavy, bulky, and not modular so I'm stuck with the stock setup for each. I'm looking for a setup that will be lighter (especially the mountaineering setup), able to be set up as monos, and take up less pack space (also especially the mountaineering setup). I'm climbing on the sportiva G-techs and aequilibrium LTs, and planning to pick up the aequilibrium speeds for summer 2025.

I'm in Ontario right now, with some trips down to the adirondacks and whites planned for this winter, but moving to Calgary/climbing in Canmore by winter 2025/26. I started climbing last season (stuck to ice TR) and hope to lead single pitch ~WI3/WI4 by late season this year. Also looking to get on some adirondacks mixed multis this winter, but depends on how conditions shape up and how my skills progress. I've got bigger goals of alpine ice and mixed routes down the line, but that's at least two years away. I'm hoping the system I pick up will also be suitable for scrambling objectives (e.g. tantalus traverse), and approaches to alpine climbs (e.g. BS Col in the bugaboos) where they'll live in my pack for a good bit of the day.

Right now I'm considering the following systems (red/green shows which of those components is lightest):

This lets me use the following setups (red/yellow/green shows which of the setups is the lightest):

The way I see it, blue ice is the best option for absolute lightness in both setups, but petzl has the option of using a linking bar. My thinking is that it would be nice for cragging where I'm less worried about weight and pack space, and the rigidity and reliability would be nice compared to the Dyneema.

Thanks!

You can't use the Petzl alu heel piece with the linking bar. Only the steel ones. Also I wouldn't plan on switching back and forth with the cord often between toes. It gets annoying quickly. 

For ice cragging I would always use a crampon with linking bar (but I haven't tried the Harfang. Just the petzl cord ones) and steel heels.

If you are interested in a mono point crampon pick up some Darts. Then if you also feel like you need something very light for ski mountaineering or certain alpine tours pick up the basket version of the leopard. Buying whole crampons on sale is cheaper than individual components. With those two you then have the option for rare situations to build up a Hybrid Dart for long alpine stuff where weight really matters. Also you have all different binding attachments from Petzl. 

You could do something similar with the Harfang but I would pick Petal over Blue ice because I like the basket heel for use with approach shoes and the Dart is the more refined ice crampon, especially for cragging, in my opinion. 

For general mountaineering your G12 is just fine.

Modular is over rated. get the kind of crampon you want ,  mono or dual and just use it. have more than one pair. switching them around is a PINTA

If you're counting grams, the original Dart (non-replaceable frontpoint) is lighter than the current version. You should be able to score a pair of them pretty cheap these days.

I would buy the crampon you believe will suit you for the discipline you'll use it for. There are a few reasons. 

1. The compromises on ice of using something other than a dedicated ice crampon aren't worth it in my opinion. Using your ice crampons in more general mountaineering situations can really suck though too. You're likely best served with at least two pair. 

2. Crampons are a wear item. If you are climbing enough to get the experience to lead, you're going to wear crampons out. You'll wear your ice crampons out super fast if you start scrambling/mountaineering in rocky terrain. When you get on an ice lead and suddenly find it more difficult than you expected, you'll be really happy to have sharp and fresh crampons on your feet instead of the rounded mess you were left with after scrambling a few thousand feet in them. 

3. Constantly swapping bails, bars, heels, points, etc. is not only a pain in the ass, but it's a total recipe to find out you brought the wrong bails on the wrong climb and now you're screwed. This has happened to myself, and a couple of my partners over the years and none of us are all that invested in modularity. Focusing on a completely modular system brings even more room for error. 

Have a pair of ultra light aluminum rigs for summer mountaineering, light steel mountaineering for winter scrambles, dedicated ice crampons for waterfalls, dedicated mixed for cragging and micro spikes for hiking.  I skip the dedicated mixed because I really don't do much of that. 

NateCwrote:

3. Constantly swapping bails, bars, heels, points, etc. is not only a pain in the ass, but it's a total recipe to find out you brought the wrong bails on the wrong climb and now you're screwed. This has happened to myself, and a couple of my partners over the years and none of us are all that invested in modularity. Focusing on a completely modular system brings even more room for error. 

I have struggled enough replacing front points and adjusting/swapping bails even in the comfort of my own home to know that I don't want to do it in the field.

Even "simple" adjustments can be miserable when you are on the side of a mountain.

Thanks for the replies, everyone - appreciate the insight and advice.

You can't use the Petzl alu heel piece with the linking bar. Only the steel ones. Also I wouldn't plan on switching back and forth with the cord often between toes. It gets annoying quickly. 

For ice cragging I would always use a crampon with linking bar (but I haven't tried the Harfang. Just the petzl cord ones) and steel heels.

If you are interested in a mono point crampon pick up some Darts. Then if you also feel like you need something very light for ski mountaineering or certain alpine tours pick up the basket version of the leopard. Buying whole crampons on sale is cheaper than individual components. With those two you then have the option for rare situations to build up a Hybrid Dart for long alpine stuff where weight really matters. Also you have all different binding attachments from Petzl. 

You could do something similar with the Harfang but I would pick Petal over Blue ice because I like the basket heel for use with approach shoes and the Dart is the more refined ice crampon, especially for cragging, in my opinion. 

For general mountaineering your G12 is just fine.

Good to know re. linking bar - I wasn't aware. I'd likely pick up the darts and irvis hybrid as separate sets, so I'd have the steel heel regardless. And I've heard the same from others on the cord, so it wouldn't be a frequent thing just if I have a specific reason to.

I don't think I'll need the hybrid darts anytime soon, but would be nice to start moving in that direction with my system since I think I'll be on longer stuff in the coming years. Maybe I'll start with them and see if they can replace my g22s.

Good point, and good to know re. dart being a better pick for pure ice.

And yes, the g12 is fine, just heavy!

Modular is over rated. get the kind of crampon you want ,  mono or dual and just use it. have more than one pair. switching them around is a PINTA

I'm starting to think you might be right - a set of g20 monos would also solve most of my issues...

If you're counting grams, the original Dart (non-replaceable frontpoint) is lighter than the current version. You should be able to score a pair of them pretty cheap these days.

That's great to know, thanks. I hadn't even considered the previous model but I'll look into it. Non-replaceable frontpoints isn't ideal but good to know if I'm looking to lose every gram I can.

I would buy the crampon you believe will suit you for the discipline you'll use it for. There are a few reasons. 

1. The compromises on ice of using something other than a dedicated ice crampon aren't worth it in my opinion. Using your ice crampons in more general mountaineering situations can really suck though too. You're likely best served with at least two pair. 

2. Crampons are a wear item. If you are climbing enough to get the experience to lead, you're going to wear crampons out. You'll wear your ice crampons out super fast if you start scrambling/mountaineering in rocky terrain. When you get on an ice lead and suddenly find it more difficult than you expected, you'll be really happy to have sharp and fresh crampons on your feet instead of the rounded mess you were left with after scrambling a few thousand feet in them. 

3. Constantly swapping bails, bars, heels, points, etc. is not only a pain in the ass, but it's a total recipe to find out you brought the wrong bails on the wrong climb and now you're screwed. This has happened to myself, and a couple of my partners over the years and none of us are all that invested in modularity. Focusing on a completely modular system brings even more room for error.

I definitely don't plan to use anything not designed for ice climbing on vertical ice, especially if I'm getting into leading. And yeah - otherwise I'd only have the g22s.

Great point. Having the option to replace frontpoints would be great, and I'm really hoping to avoid doing any scrambling in them.

I definitely get the sense that the modularity comes at a price. I hope I don't run into that, but will definitely keep in mind and make sure before I head out the door. Thanks for pointing that out, appreciate it!

Have a pair of ultra light aluminum rigs for summer mountaineering, light steel mountaineering for winter scrambles, dedicated ice crampons for waterfalls, dedicated mixed for cragging and micro spikes for hiking.  I skip the dedicated mixed because I really don't do much of that. 

This is pretty appealing - going to have to find some more room though...

I have struggled enough replacing front points and adjusting/swapping bails even in the comfort of my own home to know that I don't want to do it in the field.

Even "simple" adjustments can be miserable when you are on the side of a mountain.

Definitely agreed. Swapping anything in the field would be a last-resort option after something breaks (e.g. the cord breaks, I swap to the linking bars). I hope I'd never have to but I carry spare bails, frontpoints, and hardware now anyways.

Noah Lwrote:

I'm starting to think you might be right - a set of g20 monos would also solve most of my issues...

G20s are not great mountaineering crampons, and they are definitely not appropriate (likely even not useable) for summer mountaineering like the Bugs and Tantalus.

I'd advise against making crampons decisions with weight as a primary factor.  Crampons are highly abused pieces of critical safety gear, durability and functionality are far more important.

Many climbers end up with 3 sets of crampons: 1 set for pure ice/mixed, 1 set for mountaineering, and 1 set of lightweight aluminum universals for using on approach shoes and summer boots.  You might be able to combine the first 2 into one unit if you get a hybrid/compromise crampons (like a Lynx or G14).

Kyle Tarrywrote:

G20s are not great mountaineering crampons, and they are definitely not appropriate (likely even not useable) for summer mountaineering like the Bugs and Tantalus.

I'd advise against making crampons decisions with weight as a primary factor.  Crampons are highly abused pieces of critical safety gear, durability and functionality are far more important.

Many climbers end up with 3 sets of crampons: 1 set for pure ice/mixed, 1 set for mountaineering, and 1 set of lightweight aluminum universals for using on approach shoes and summer boots.  You might be able to combine the first 2 into one unit if you get a hybrid/compromise crampons (like a Lynx or G14).

Well aware the g20s aren't mountaineering crampons - what I meant (and I should have been clearer) is that adding a set of g20s to my current quiver would address most of what I need. I'd have a mono setup, and I can find other places to cut weight and just hang onto the g12s for mountaineering for now.

I have climbed a season on the Harfang techs and was pretty pleased. I also have a pair of darts, so for cragging, darts, but anything where space is tight or weight matters, Harfangs. 

Noah Lwrote:

Well aware the g20s aren't mountaineering crampons - what I meant (and I should have been clearer) is that adding a set of g20s to my current quiver would address most of what I need. I'd have a mono setup, and I can find other places to cut weight and just hang onto the g12s for mountaineering for now.

This probably wouldn't be a bad route to go. I'd seriously consider Darts vs G20. I've owned multiple sets of both now and really prefer the Dart (as it seems many others do as well.)

Noah Lwrote:

what I meant (and I should have been clearer) is that adding a set of g20s to my current quiver would address most of what I need. I'd have a mono setup, and I can find other places to cut weight and just hang onto the g12s for mountaineering for now.

Yeah, if you prefer monos, that's a solid plan for sure!

Be aware that there have been several failures of the new ultralight Darts, hard to know if this is a real issue to be worried about or just a freak thing.  One of my partners (not on MP) also had his fail in the same way: https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/120228341/cracked-petzl-darts

I really like my G20s and feel like they are a very durable, bombproof crampon.

Kyle Tarrywrote:

Yeah, if you prefer monos, that's a solid plan…

..I really like my G20s and feel like they are a very durable, bombproof crampon.

When Kyle and I agree, case closed.  

I have climbed a season on the Harfang techs and was pretty pleased. I also have a pair of darts, so for cragging, darts, but anything where space is tight or weight matters, Harfangs. 

Thanks for the info - what boots were you wearing with the harfangs?

This probably wouldn't be a bad route to go. I'd seriously consider Darts vs G20. I've owned multiple sets of both now and really prefer the Dart (as it seems many others do as well.)

I think I might end up buying both and keeping the one I like best.

 Yeah, if you prefer monos, that's a solid plan for sure!

Be aware that there have been several failures of the new ultralight Darts, hard to know if this is a real issue to be worried about or just a freak thing.  One of my partners (not on MP) also had his fail in the same way: mountainproject.com/forum/t…

I really like my G20s and feel like they are a very durable, bombproof crampon.

Not entirely sure if I prefer monos yet - only got one day at the end of last season, but I definitely noticed a good difference. Thanks for the heads up on the darts, going to look into it further and see if petzl has put anything out about it.

When Kyle and I agree, case closed.  

Ha thanks! I take it you're a fan of the g20s?

G12s, G20s and G22s are all awesome for their different uses. I have also used the original non-modular Darts/Dartwins and they’re great too but I prefer the semi rigid linking bar of the G20/22, it feels a bit more solid and precise for the given fit on my boots.

The Grivel G12 has different front point and secondary point profiles than most other 12pt crampons (BD, Petzl) which I much prefer; they climb water ice in the mountains really well. The G10s with aluminum heels are for skimo style objectives.  

+1 for just adding G20s

Noah Lwrote:

…..Ha thanks! I take it you're a fan of the g20s?

G-techs and G20’s (+)  make waterfall ice the breakfast of champions!

I liked the G20 Pluses a lot more after swapping in Katana front points