New and Experienced Climbers over 50 #31

Yep, Donald is in hock to the Russians. He puts their interests (and his own) before those of the American people... and it's a lot of "bullshit."

A cult of personality. So angry with and afraid of the left that ANYONE that bashes it gains their support. No thought, no analysis. Only emotion.

Tell me, tell me, oh please - WHAT IN THE WORLD would Donald Trump talk to Putin about (and minions) while President... that the people of the United States shouldn't hear?

If Trump wins the United States position in the world will be radically different by 2034 (ten years). But "libtards bad," America be damned.

Liz Cheney is a true conservative. One who actually loves her country.

Donald Thompson wrote:

So are y'all telling me that if you once worked alongside someone who ended up running for POTUS one day you are so out -of -it you wouldn't remember? 

And this "supporting genocide"  is really over-the-top stuff. No one hunts with that dog. " The Republican Party is supporting genocde". Oh , ok.

And I don't have to be shown that people disagree with me -- that is the challenge knowing that perhaps a few million people do. We gotta get that number down.

All…(the rest chopped out , cause it’s “ formulaic…”

The Liz Cheney line below is one for the books. Lol

Trolling, nothing but, trolling…

ed “ best internet advice I ever got: “ Don’t feed the bears…”  e

ps. And as Smokey the Bear (in the internet era) would say: “ Only you can prevent dumpster fires….”)

Frosty here this AM….

I worked at the Snow king Holtel in Jackson in 81 I  remember the head chefs name and the first name of the guy who was most often behind the line with me. I don't know the name of a single other employee in that kitchen of a 200 room hotel.. A lot of life has happened since then.   The other  restaurants I worked in there are dozens of short term employes that came and went that couldn't tell you their names if you put a gun to my head.  You guys keep making a stink about Micky D's while your guy is a freakin convicted sex offender. whatever..  

Hit the beach for sunset last night

found a sunset

Willoughby Gap

DT, let's just start with the assumption that your view of the degradation of the Republican Party since prior to the 60's is correct, and the need for a populist revival is the only hope for the survival of the Party and Country (it would be nice if the preferred priority on these two would be kept in mind). Given this, is Donald Trump really the best choice for the revival? Any rational person, including rational Republicans, see him as a charlatan with a capital charlatan, who is obviously not driven by any kind of specific ideology, except to the extent that it serves his own glorification. Wouldn't you prefer to see someone....anyone...who could lead in the direction you'd prefer, than this particular person?

Great pics, Nick, as always. Clearing storm this morning at sunrise coming over Turnagain Pass and around the arm. Snow line down to sea level for the moment. Always fun to figure out the roads are icy when you’re doing 65.

Donald Thompson wrote:

Li Hu: 

Since this story surfaced Harris has had plenty of opportunity to corroborate her claim with photos, fellow employees, and the like, but there has been only the sound of crickets. In fact, that there would be no records acts as an incentive to try to pull off this minor league lie in the first place. 

This reminds me of Hilary Clinton's announcement --prior to a state visit to New Zealand --that her parents named her in honor of Sir Hillary, the first to climb Mt. Everest. It didn't take very long before critical people realized that she was born several years before Sir Edmund climbed that mountain and long before he became a known figure. Biden tells eternally recurring lies of this sort, ad nauseum, as we all know. Part of the reason is that they are pathological liars but also that traditionally their corporate press will not out them, so they feel free to lie whenever it suits them, even if the lie appears inconsequential and trivial.

I think it was Mao tse Tung. who said he lies because he has to ( in itself a lie). The dive bar writer Charles Bukowski said he only lies to women because he enjoys it. Pathological liars of the garden- variety political sort do so because they don't respect the public and they know that others will provide cover, such as the fake media who have earned their fakeness by pretending to be neutral.

Apogee:

Au contraire mon frere. What's wrong with populism? Historically it has always operated as the Hegelian dialectical opposite of the bureaucratic managerial corporatist state ,such as the one we have been incubating steadily in Washington to the tune of trillions in debt , for starters. This bureaucratic state has no interests outside of its own and treats people as mere objects and is the tepid forerunner of totalitarianism.

The  BITD conservatism you alluded to was never a bastion of  conservative values, as traditionally understood. That Republican party was dominated by RINOs ,and was nothing less than a branch office of the Liberal/Left-- from the early 60s onward. They were the Washington Generals of national politics-- you know the team who perpetually lost to the Harlem Globetrotters. They were the designated losers. (Despite the odd Reagan  moment or two along the way.)

Starting about 15 years ago that all began to change . When I think back to the enormous task that lie ahead, its hard to convey how futile I thought it would all be. First, shoehorning the ironclad control of the Republican Party by RINOs and their enormous money had to happen. The Bushies, the McCains, the Cheneys, the Romneys, etc. had to go. Next , a grassroots effort had to be launched to redefine the new Conservative movement and to establish a set of coherent values and objectives in direct polemic opposition to the Washington mob and the early stirrings of Wokism. (The Tea Party was the earliest example of this.) And of course because of the onslaught of electoral politics, leaders had to be found. Not just orange- man-bad but numerous local yokels. And all of this against the fierce and scurrilous opposition of the fake media and the official propaganda machine . This process still continues.

All of this stuff was the bare minimum in order to get to where we are today.  For the first time in my life we have what I consider to be a fairly strong conservative movement coupled against an obviously moribund Left; never have I seen such vigorous, articulate and energetic push-back to the reigning narratives of left wing culture and politics --despite woke paradigms controlling most of this nation's institutions. Nevertheless, either these institution's or their current woke master's days are numbered.

But still there remain huge, huge ,huge obstacles to overcome. Politics is just a relatively small portion of the change ahead of us.

"May you live in interesting times."

Tell me DT, how do you discuss felon Trump with your daughter or granddaughter?  I'd really like to know.  My great granddaughter is 9 and I hope I never have to explain to her how so many people were conned by Trump.  But, perhaps you don't have children, and are just a "catboy" to borrow a phrases from JTV.

Li Hu wrote:

This is the “old people” thread. I think most of us are pretty reasonable here, and when the election is over, it’s over. After that it’ll just be about climbing stuff, travel, food and other somewhat related retired or soon to be retired people stuff.  

"Old people thread"....

Huh. I think y'all have made my point...  

(Old people with less restraint that a 2 year old...)

Politics - add a 1 to your 2 and take it to the bar please.

JW - you sir are a true gentleman. 40's are great, no need to rush it to 50. :)

Feeling a lot more comfortable leading now. Did three I did the other day plus two onsights, one a mixed route (nuts and carrot bolts). Not a fan of carrot bolts. Keep missing them and just thinking it’s a run-out section.
This is the mixed route. Only a grade 16 but two stars.

I'm interested in the US election but there are plenty of other places more suited to taking about it. 

Attempting  - euphemism for failing on - the classic Heaven's Door (E3 or about 10d trad.) at Pembroke last month. Can't recommend this place highly enough if you're ever in the UK: 100s of classic routes from 5.4 to 5.14, all naturally protected. 

As well as the usual weather considerations, climbing above the sea adds a few more factors to take into account: the tides, the size of the waves, bird nesting restrictions, and - in parts of Pembroke - when the army are training. The reward is a great experience, somehow small cliffs feel a whole lot bigger and more serious when there are waves crashing beneath you. 

Great shots Colden. Looks like Carl is hitting the jackpot. 

Donald Thompson wrote:

So are y'all telling me that if you once worked alongside someone who ended up running for POTUS one day you are so out -of -it you wouldn't remember? 

And this "supporting genocide"  is really over-the-top stuff. No one hunts with that dog. " The Republican Party is supporting genocde". Oh , ok.

And I don't have to be shown that people disagree with me -- that is the challenge knowing that perhaps a few million people do. We gotta get that number down.

All this stuff about Putin and the Russians is a lot bullshit most Americans could give a rats ass for. Seriously , it's crap. That's another dog that don't hunt.

Gaza is a war. That's what happens in war. It is virtually impossible in modern warfare to have only combatants killed, especially in a place like Gaza. If you are suggesting that Israel is deliberately targeting civilians then you got bigger problems than just arguing with me.

"...can be described as genocide"

Oh, ok.

The Liz Cheney line below is one for the books. Lol

Wow Donald,  you must think Trump is still president eh? You may be better served by reading all the news, not just your MAGA sources. I'll spell it out for you- democrats are involved in genocide and doing very little to stop it besides occasionally scolding Netanyahu. 

I completely support helping Ukraine even if I think proxy wars are inherently bad, this was explained really well by Frank Stein a couple pages back. I do not support what Israel is getting into,  leveling civilian targets daily with weapons from us is horrible and should be discussed . I'm not suggesting that this is happening,  I  know it's happening,  that's where the term genocide comes in...

And this all has plenty to do with climbing.  I want all kids to be able to experience what we all have, I feel that if we don't discuss these things we would be turning a blind eye to their future. Turning a blind eye to how corrupt governments have become is something that apathetic people do, we let them get away with too much because we have become too comfortable with having plenty of money to buy whatever we want, go on multiple vacations etc. People that get too comfortable/fat and happy don't tend to bite the hand that feeds them.

And then you have this white nationalism on the rise right here in this country and we have people of color too darn dumb/numb to see it happening, some of whom are supporting it! It's become popular to be a racist again , how in the hell has this happened so quickly? 

Had a great gym session yesterday before work. It's tough to not take a whole day to hit the rock when the weather is this good,  c'est la vie...

ed esmond wrote:

Trolling, nothing but, trolling…

ed “ best internet advice I ever got: “ Don’t feed the bears…”  e

Frosty here this AM….

Frosty here too:

Randy!  Welcome to the neighborhood!  What brings you out east?  Glad you enjoyed Rumney, and you really couldn't ask for better (very unseasonably warm and dry) weather to get out and climb here in mid to late October.  Have fun in North Conway, so much fun stuff to do there.

GO

M M wrote:

It's tough to not take a whole day to hit the rock when the weather is this good,  c'est la vie...

Ah, but some of us out West will be.

Today's dilemma: climb wonderful existing routes at a cool, crisp 8,000 feet (with a magnificent although distant view out over California's Central Valley), or put up first ascents at a forested band of granite at 6,000 feet.

The dogs vote for the first one (it's a longer approach).

E MuuD wrote:

"Old people thread"....

Huh. I think y'all have made my point...  

(Old people with less restraint that a 2 year old...)

Politics - add a 1 to your 2 and take it to the bar please.

Holy wow, Todd, no-one knows this breed (or, apparently, almost no-one).

Yes, Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retrievers ("Tollers").

Halifax is 10 years old and Digby is almost two (Digby is the name of a town in Nova Scotia):

If I were to consider a person for a job, say, POTUS, I would probably check in with folks who had worked intimately with that person previously—say, his Chief of Staff, Attorney General, top military generals, and even, say, his former VP. Their recommendations would carry a lot of weight with me.

Also, as a retired USAF career officer, it carries a lot of weight with me what this person has said and done relative to the military, those who serve, Gold Star families, and so on. And if the person has served in the military honorably (or served honorably in a public capacity in some way) that is a bonus. Ukraine and NATO (world security) also weighs heavily.

Finally, who America elects has an important ripple effect throughout the world on what behavior is acceptable or not from other world leaders. I prefer democracy to autocracy. Once that is stabilized (as much as it can be), we can argue about taxes, the debt, tariffs, the border, etc. 

For me, the choice couldn’t be more clear.

I’m currently in Mendoza, Argentina for the birth of our granddaughter and probably not climbing much for the next two months while down here. I’m jealous of all of you getting out on the rock in such beautiful places!!!

Donald Thompson wrote:

Woke libtards-- prepare yourselves for a whuppin'- which you richly deserve.

This is what it's all about isn't it. What a repugnant view of the world.

Most of my friends and relatives have already voted for Harris/Walz. They figured they would rather pay more taxes in the interim until a better candidate such as Liz Cheney matriculated to the top of the Republican ticket.

A couple die hard Texans are still planning to vote for Trump.

I’m more or less the “Libtard” and the poorest member of my family.  

I spent a lot of time (way too much time) in SuperTopo political 'discussions', and there were a few takeaways I gained related to the dynamics there- there was also the constant, ongoing question of whether politics should be discussed at all in a climbers forum, in the same manner that has occurred here. Anyone's view of whether this is appropriate is as valid as another, under the assumption the forum owner believes it is acceptable in their forum (that seems likely to be more restrictive here than at SuperTopo).

Productive, thought provoking discussions focused on principles of ideology and how they apply to current world/political events, and the comments were not personalized towards a particular individual. Using the actual name of the political person portrayed an effort to maintain respect towards others that may find them acceptable or appealing. When dialogues included ad hominems aimed at another poster, or characterized entire groups (or public persons) with negative nicknames, the dialogue became very hostile and circular, and turned off most others who might encounter them.

Over the years, I was certainly guilty of all of these things to varying extents, and as the question has arisen here about whether politics should be discussed, I remain pretty dubious that it is possible for this to happen in a productive manner. I can certainly see and support the arguments in both directions, though there is an overly-idealistic part of me that believes that it could, and should be possible to do it among rational people that results in better understanding and insight for many others. 

But to be quite honest, I'm pretty doubtful about that. And would love to be proven wrong.