Proposed fees at Wrinkled Rock Climbing Area

The title says it all.

Proposed fees are YEAR ROUND at $5/ day.

 Public comments can be made by  November 29, 2024 and sent  to Black Hills National Forest, Attention: Bradley Block – Recreation Program Manager, 1019 N 5th Street, Custer, SD 57730 or bradley.block@usda.gov. Comments can also be provided online at arcg.is/qyij80.

What are the fees for hikers and picnickers?

The fee is for " parking".

Per day, meaning the " free " camping not to mention climbing would be " free" no longer.

For locals like myself it would cost a fortune.

Sounds a lot like what is happening in some other nat. forests.  Privatizing parking to contractors.  

Read only the 1st page here.  After that it devolves.  
  mountainproject.com/forum/t…

This is not a privatization plan nor a political one.

From what I read the proposed fees would go to enhancing the existing rock climbing board that is there and fixing some picnic tables. I'm pretty sure I would do that work for free rather than paying $5 a day. Please comment on this. The comment. closes 4 months from now but every comment matters and this would be a severe limitation for many local climbers as well as a dangerous precedent, IMHO.

Surely there's a yearly pass option at an affordable rate, there was a similar fee system on the Mt Lemmon hwy for several years, lot of people bitched about it but now there are much nicer facilities. Go to Sedona and most all of the FS TH parking lots have a fee, if there's a bathroom there's a fee. The program on Mt Lemmon ended, I doubt the Sedona one ever will as the place is always packed.  

Tim McCabe wrote:

Surely there's a yearly pass option at an affordable rate, there was a similar fee system on the Mt Lemmon hwy for several years, lot of people bitched about it but now there are much nicer facilities. Go to Sedona and most all of the FS TH parking lots have a fee, if there's a bathroom there's a fee. The program on Mt Lemmon ended, I doubt the Sedona one ever will as the place is always packed.  

The yearly America the Beautiful - Interagency Recreation Pass works for these parking areas. The pass is good throughout the US. The Forest Service was slapped due to their miss implementation of the Rec Fee Demo program. What is being described at Wrinkled Rock is happening throughout the US under the new implementation. I know of multiple areas that are becoming fee for parking.

$80 for annual pass.

https://store.usgs.gov/2024-annual-pass

Thanks for the heads up Leslie. I agree that the fee is excessive. The changes could be implemented in an afternoon by some more than willing volunteers. I'll leave a comment for whatever thats worth. Catch yall at poverty gulch. ✌ 

Tim McCabe wrote:

Surely there's a yearly pass option at an affordable rate, there was a similar fee system on the Mt Lemmon hwy for several years, lot of people bitched about it but now there are much nicer facilities. Go to Sedona and most all of the FS TH parking lots have a fee, if there's a bathroom there's a fee. The program on Mt Lemmon ended, I doubt the Sedona one ever will as the place is always packed.  

South Dakota is NOT Arizona, nor is Keystone Tucson.

There is no highway here, just a gravel pullout woth a sign and toilet.

No picnic area as described.

And NO proposed yearly fee.

IMHO this is clearly targeting a specific user group of the BHNF.

Why not implement this at Horsethief Lake and target fisherman or boaters?

Or out of towners picnicing at Breezy Point?

This is such a minimal amount of money for the forest  and a huge amount for local climbers like myself.

I estimate I would spend over $100 easily at the proposed rate.

But instead I will just cease climbing there.....

Or ride my bicycle instead.

Leslie H wrote:

And NO proposed yearly fee.

All Interagency Passes are honored. So just buy a pass which is what most people have been forced to do so not to be nickeled and dimed.

As for for your other points, make them in your comments. Basically if fee as going to proposed they need to be throughout the Forest for similar areas.

Hmmm, I certainly never tried to use my America the Beautiful pass to park for free at pactola. It seems odd to me that that would work. However this is still concerning because the closest National Park to this location is Mount Rushmore and they certainly don't honor the America the Beautiful pass because the $10 entry fee goes to a concessionaire. My point in all of this is that this is limiting access to a climbing area that for decades has had free access. It's no different than what's being done at the bottom of the Grand Canyon and if we sit idly by it will continue to happen. And of course I've commented already and I encourage others to do the same.

Being next to the highway Rushmore is an oddity because there is no entrance fee but a concession runs the parking. So one pays to park. 

At Pactola, many of the areas are not just parking but facilities like picnicking and boat ramps which there is a fee. Also some of the trailheads are at facilities like a boat ramp so a fee. However if you have the Interagency Pass the local pass is half price. That is not atypical.

The Interagency Pass is good for basic entrance fee and no facility parking. And sometimes discounts.

As I noted, compile of a list of similar areas in the BH Forest similar to Wrinkled Rock that people just park at with no facilities per say. And ask why are they also not targeted? On the Wasatch-Cache-Uinta the Forest released a series on places that all become pay to play. One of the parking areas the climbers did most all the leg work to convert into formal parking the FS is going to be charging starting this fall or next spring. More over the !@#$% close !@#$% gate because it is "winter" yet there is no snow. So at that point one has to park a half mile away.

Allen Sanderson wrote:

All Interagency Passes are honored. So just buy a pass which is what most people have been forced to do so not to be nickeled and dimed.

As for for your other points, make them in your comments. Basically if fee as going to proposed they need to be throughout the Forest for similar areas.

So with the regular interagency america the beautiful pass (standard $80 annul natl park pas) one does not have to pay the $5 fee?

$5/day seems pretty reasonable considering there is a bathroom (which costs money to maintain) and one can use an interagency pass. I simply don't understand why some climbers choose to complain about nominal fees, while not blinking an eye at spending hundreds of dollars on gas to get to climbing destinations or on personal climbing gear. Not to mention the thousands of dollars spent on vans or fancy off-road rigs. 

I have no qualms with paying a day use fee or buying a pass, if the money goes towards maintaining the facilities and infrastructure that I use as a climber. 

Leslie H wrote:

Why not implement this at Horsethief Lake and target fisherman or boaters?

Fishing licenses exist and in South Dakota they cost $28 for residents and $67 for non-residents. The money collected goes towards hunting/fishing access and wildlife management, which is basically what this proposed fee would do. 

Eli P wrote:

$5/day seems pretty reasonable considering there is a bathroom (which costs money to maintain) and one can use an interagency pass. I simply don't understand why some climbers choose to complain about nominal fees, while not blinking an eye at spending hundreds of dollars on gas to get to climbing destinations or on personal climbing gear. Not to mention the thousands of dollars spent on vans or fancy off-road rigs. 

I have no qualms with paying a day use fee or buying a pass, if the money goes towards maintaining the facilities and infrastructure that I use as a climber. 

The same people who complain about $5 use fees, quite often have $40K+ vehicles and are wearing $100+ pants.

It's interesting that, so far, nobody has mentioned the unintended consequences of this fee where everyone will start cramming into all the nearby roadside pullouts and avoid the wrinkled rock parking area. I'm sure someone will suggest blocking the nearby ones, but there are too many and people will just park a bit farther away.

Eli P wrote:

$5/day seems pretty reasonable considering there is a bathroom (which costs money to maintain) and one can use an interagency pass. I simply don't understand why some climbers choose to complain about nominal fees, while not blinking an eye at spending hundreds of dollars on gas to get to climbing destinations or on personal climbing gear. Not to mention the thousands of dollars spent on vans or fancy off-road rigs. 

I have no qualms with paying a day use fee or buying a pass, if the money goes towards maintaining the facilities and infrastructure that I use as a climber. 

Then pay it! But dont tell me I need to.

The BGNF did no outreach about this prior  to proposing it.

It also isnt proposing fees at several other areas with much nicer bathrooms like Breezy or Willow

I already have an interagency pass, which will cover the fee. The Forest Service is required by law to honor this pass for standard ammenties https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title16/chapter87&edition=prelim. If you go to Devils Tower from time to time, you probably already have one. 

It really isn't as big of a deal as you're making it out to be. 

To say that the BHNF isn't doing any outreach just isn't true. It was covered by local new sources, public radio, posted on their facebook page, and covered by the Rapid City Journal. They're actively seeking public comment and then involving the Black Hills National Forest Advisory Board (NFAB) and the Wyoming Recreation Action Team (REACT) before a final decision is made. I don't really know what you're talking about. 

As people, comment on this please note that interagency passes will NOT be accepted since the concessionaire currently doesn't accept them. They only accept military and senior citizen discounts.

An America the Beautiful pass will NOT work and unless the concessionaire changes or the policy changes they will NOT be offering a yearly pass .

If you would like to comment on offering that you certainly can. Also a heads up apparently  the Black Hills National Forest will release another round of proposed pay sites coming in September. They are modeling this after a forest in the Pacific northwest. This is also coming internally not from the Rocky Mountain area.

Maybe if they had stuck with logging we wouldn't be having to pay to use our own forest!??!