Hauling on the south face of washington column

Is a 1:1 hauling system okay if I’ll only be hauling to Dinner Ledge? I have the rock exotica wall hauler and want to avoid spending more money if possible, but also don’t want to be the shit show holding other parties up if I’m struggling to haul. I tried searching through trip reports and past threads but couldn’t find much about whether folks use a 1:1 or 2:1 for sfwc. It seems like 1:1 should be fine since we’ll only have stuff for one night and it’s only three pitches of hauling but I’m just worried because I’m 120lbs and I’ve read those pitches are a pain to haul. Thanks in advance!

You’ll be fine. They’re a PITA to haul b/c it’s such easy terrain, which is (almost) always more difficult to haul over. You need to be running a 50-60ft lower out line (I.e., tie in your haul bag at 40m, instead of to the end of the line, so that the follower can use the “lower out” line to help navigate the bag over/around obstacles. Alternatively, the follower will have to follow the bag in order to do this (which isn’t really possible on P3 and not ideal on P1).

On the bright side, it will only get easier to haul on other routes, as it’s truly a PITA for that first pitch :) 

1:1 is good.  We had no problem with the follower following the bag to wrestle it around hangups.

Awesome good to know, thanks guys! 

The pitches aren’t that hard to haul

No 2:1 needed… If you can’t move the bags at any point have the 2nd throw their Jugs on the free end of the haul line and counterweight (they ride down- bags go up) 

You do not need a lower-out, the second is close to the bag at all spots where the bag catches on each pitch 

Certainly you could wear packs- but jugging with a heavy pack is just awful- since SFWC is usually a starting point for people trying to build skills to do more walls- I suggest practicing the skills you’ll need later in that journey..

 it’s literally only 300ft of hauling!

Quinn Hatfield wrote:

The pitches aren’t that hard to haul

If you can’t move the bags at any point have the 2nd throw their Jugs on the free end of the haul line and counterweight (they ride down- bags go up) 

You do not need a lower-out, the second is close to the bag at all spots where the bag catches on each pitch 

Certainly you could wear packs- but jugging with a heavy pack is just awful- since SFWC is usually a starting point for people trying to build skills to do more walls- I suggest practicing the skills you’ll need later in that journey..

 it’s literally only 300ft of hauling!

Yeah, the hauling does kinda suck but the second can just loose the bags whenever they get stuck, it's not that hard. If this wannabe of a wall climber can do it, anyone can. 

Ricky Harline wrote:

Yeah, the hauling does kinda suck 

Does it?
or is it really that Hauling Kinda Sucks- and this is most people’s first experience with hauling?

I mean, yes it’s worse than hauling the bags off the ground to the p2 anchor on Zodiac, but not as bad as hauling the bags on the last pitch of South Seas.. 

I’ve solo’d to Dinner and had my bag only catch on p3.. 

Quinn Hatfield wrote:

Does it?
or is it really that Hauling Kinda Sucks- and this is most people’s first experience with hauling?

I mean, yes it’s worse than hauling the bags off the ground to the p2 anchor on Zodiac, but not as bad as hauling the bags on the last pitch of South Seas.. 

I’ve solo’d to Dinner and had my bag only catch on p3.. 

I'm a big wall punter so I can't really say from personal experience, but I've heard lots of big wall climbers say pitches 1-3 blow for hauling. I even used a nose cone and it still got stuck like six times on pitches 1 and 3. 

Perhaps you've got enough skill and experience to avoid getting the bags stuck? 

60ft R—> L walk between the top of P1 and start of P2. Rocks, sticks, and dirt that would be preferable to not dislodge. Hauling bottom of P2 to Dinner is doable, but still will often require babysitting by the second.

The pitches up to Dinner ledge aren't steep splitters on an open face (easy hauling). They include broken rock, a walk along a ledge between pitch 1 and 2, and plenty of things to get the haul bag stuck on while hauling. So you're better off keeping the bag light and a 1:1 haul. The first person leads and starts hauling. The follower jugs along next to the bag and frees it / moves it over obstructions / walks it from the top of 1 to the bottom of 2.

Not sure if I understand the point of the post… I assume it’s not to point out that guidebook distances are notoriously inaccurate… or maybe it is? 

Kevin DeWeese wrote:

Then please just don't say Ricky. 

My experience on SFWC is significantly more relevant to OP than yours or Quinn's. Y'all are so good you can't relate to beginner struggles anymore. 

I've been sandbagged by y'all so many fucking times, you guys are pretty clueless on what is and isn't easy to beginners. If you want me to shut up then all y'all experienced wall climbers can stop sandbagging me and all my big wall novice buddies =p

I think we tugged the atom smasher hand over hand. Don't recall it getting stuck.

SFWC was my first hauling experience. Carrying the pig to the base was by far the crux (brought too much and took a couple wrong turns before finding the correct approach). But the hauling was easy. Bag certainly needed an assist from the second once or twice, but not a big deal. Very straight forward.

As an aside, I’m all for reading books and forum posts to learn new skills. But nothing can replace learning by doing. You’ll learn more in a couple hours going out and hauling at your local crag than dissecting who said what about it here.

I know a few parties, including one that was right behind us, bail off SFWC because after climbing a couple pitches past dinner ledge they were just not into it. Scared, not psyched anymore, whatever. IMHO lots of folks with a good amount of free or trad experience naively assume aid climbing won’t be that big a deal. Only to find that even though C1 isn’t “hard” for them per se, it’s way more complicated than an easy pitch of free climbing and as a consequence takes longer. And very simple and small mistakes can be punishing, ending up being huge time sucks.

No forum post, how-to-book, or gym training regiment is a replacement for real world practice and experience. And isn’t the later way more fun and the whole point anyways? 

Kevin DeWeese wrote:

I think you're confusing "begginer" with "hasn't done the requisite practice before getting on a bigwall and expect everything to just go well because... reasons" 

and if someone gets sandbagged because they didn't do what anyone should do to respect the task at hand before getting on with that task, that's not being sandbagged, that's your own lack of preparation smacking you in your face. 

This is also what I was trying to say. Didn’t see your post Kevin until I submitted mine. Dovetails with the recent training thread….

I've ran into a few parties on walls where it was their first time aid climbing! Imagine doing a 10 pitch free climb as your first trad climb. I did a few practice aid pitches, then I did El Cap tree as my first multipitch aid climb which was great. Because it leans left you learn to deal with how awkward it can be when the climb doesn't go straight up. Plus I did my first hook moves.

Hey folks,

Don’t get discouraged by big wall ego nonsense. These peeps know their stuff, but maybe also can come across impolite on Internet forums.

I’ve put together some info that may help mitigate a potential shitshow between your party and other wall parties (the point is fun right? Shit shows are only fun if it’s not affecting you)

1. Getting stuff to the base can be strenuous. If you’re not used to humping loads to base (read:uphill) consider breaking up the load into small loads and doing it over a few hours, bringing less stuff (bbq grill could maybe stay at home), and bringing your food last.

2. First pitch is pretty slabby and I’ve noticed some peeps building the anchor lower than they need to. Consider hauling as high as possible and having the follower bag-tend as needed (as others have mentioned). If you’re trying to hit a bunch of walls and stay up at dinner ledge for a bit, maybe haul a few loads in the non-busy part of the day.

3. Pitches two and three can grab your bag if not careful (5.11 corner on p2 is an easy haul but may need some help around the top of the corner by a bag-tender).

4. Be psyched, you’re doing something fun and probably learning a whole lot about problem-solving and your communication style with your partner. I bring little sugar snacks (sour patch watermelons) to resolve any conflicts with myself or my poor partners dealing with my grumpiness.

Thank you for your time,

Some doofus on mountainproject

*oh something else: South Face is cool, but skull queen and southern man are also really fun. Skull queen isn’t much harder aid wise and has a super rad 5.10 pitch at the end

Agreed about sour patch watermelons. Fill your haulbag with those and no matter what happens you’ll have a good time.

To throw in my two-pence, I think the hauling on the three pitches up to dinner ledge is pretty bad. Another reason aside from the crowds why I don't think it's a great beginner wall.

Fell Over wrote:

To throw in my two-pence, I think the hauling on the three pitches up to dinner ledge is pretty bad. Another reason aside from the crowds why I don't think it's a great beginner wall.

Or...that's exactly why it's good for wall beginners. Better to learn about hauling problems there than 10 pitches up.

As others have said the approach with a heavy haul bag is the crux. I hiked up to check out the approach on a different trip before I did it with a bag which was super helpful because it's not a big deal if you get lost and have to backtrack and you can find the easiest way. If you don't do that you can either have the lead partner take the smaller load and find the easiest approach. Or do multiple loads starting with the lightest one. It's tempting to pack it all up and do it in one trip but if your pack is over 20-25% of your body weight you either need to get rid of some stuff or do multiple loads. If you go too heavy it wrecks your body and you won't be able to climb as well.