Secondary rests for North Machines?

Got a pair of North Machines I'd like to put secondary rests on. Anyone else with these worked something out with either an aftermarket trigrest or an improvisation?

I eventually put a ring of hockey tape on there and it's worked well enough, but I tend to use other tools for longer, steep and sustained ice routes.

I thought about it, put one on to try at home, and decided against it. Because of the shape of the tool it was going to hit the ice/rock on the types of climbs I want the north machines for. I don’t think a secondary rest is particularly compatible, and am unsure if it’s actually all that functional given the low angle nature of where they shine. 

nah you don't need em, see here ;)

so freakin impressive...

Grivel makes one, although they're out of stock and the Grivel rep I talked to said they won't be back in stock until May: https://us.grivel.com/products/g-slider

In the meantime I've been using a Petzl Trigrest. It works well if you just want a secondary grip, but it won't slide up and down the shaft cleanly like it does on Petzl tools.

I put a Petzl trigrest on mine and it snapped off.  To be honest I didn't really like it anyway.  It would impact the ice if I was on a deep hook.  

Slight thread drift but Has anyone come up with any clever mods to make the bottom grip larger and more ergo?
even sumtec’s bottom pommel is larger than these 

Bug Boywrote:

Slight thread drift but Has anyone come up with any clever mods to make the bottom grip larger and more ergo??

Yeah, lots of people...they bought Nomics.   

NateCwrote:

Yeah, lots of people...they bought Nomics.   

But carbon fiber…

Bug Boywrote:

But carbon fiber…

Fun fact, North Machines aren't really carbon fiber. You've been duped. Way to go, Grivel. 

Christian Donkeywrote:

Fun fact, North Machines aren't really carbon fiber. You've been duped. Way to go, Grivel. 

Anyone who's pounded enough pins would find this out quickly ;)

Bug Boywrote:

But carbon fiber…

Oldest trick in the book from bike part manufacturers.... take an alloy part, apply carbon weave veneer, profit!

I think the only true carbon tools are elite climb and maybe the kestrel

Evan Gerrywrote:

Oldest trick in the book from bike part manufacturers.... take an alloy part, apply carbon weave veneer, profit!

I think the only true carbon tools are elite climb and maybe the kestrel

Elite Climb manufactures the Kestrel for Trango, so it's really just Elite Climb.  

They’re great tools. You don’t need the secondary rests.  If you wanted a tool with secondary rests/grips you should have gotten something different. 

Kai Larsonwrote:

Elite Climb manufactures the Kestrel for Trango, so it's really just Elite Climb.  

Dang didn't know that, cool.

Evan Gerrywrote:

Dang didn't know that, cool.

The Ruskies(IceRock?) Make some carbon tools, good luck finding them.

One model in particular is a work of art; Idol

Graham Johnsonwrote:

They’re great tools. You don’t need the secondary rests.  If you wanted a tool with secondary rests/grips you should have gotten something different. 

Best answer.   You rarely see good ice climbers using the secondary grips.  Will Gadd even talks about that in one of his technique videos.   The bump grip is handy for drytooling but that's not what you got North Machines for.  

Ueli Steck on Popsicle

Will Gadd

Steve House Repentance Remission

Jake907wrote:

Best answer.   You rarely see good ice climbers using the secondary grips.  Will Gadd even talks about that in one of his technique videos.   The bump grip is handy for drytooling but that's not what you got North Machines for.  

Ueli Steck on Popsicle

Will Gadd

Steve House Repentance Remission

Well you are correct regarding their use for 90% of pure ice routes, however the North Machines are advertised as a technical tool, so why would Grivel develop something so limiting? There’s really no benefit to not having an actual upper pommel other than it not getting smacked into the ice with poor technique. I think it’s a poor design, however, I’m curious if they intend their removable trigger to be used in this capacity. It’s really only a Grivel problem (they’ve done this with multiple tools now) and I can’t think of another technical tool on the market that omits this feature. They should probably ship the tool with the trigger. Isn’t the one on the Petzl Quark removable (or slideable) for plunging in snow?

And to be fair, even the mighty Steve House had to bust out the more capable tool with an upper pommel (approx 6:30 he chokes up) for Remission in that video after doing Repentence.

Every application I’ve personally chosen to use North Machines for I haven’t needed the upper pommel. I just don’t think that one missing feature should mean someone should have to buy a different tool. 

Just voicing another vote for secondary rests not being necessary on North Machines.  I put the Grivel trigger things on mine and eventually took them off, I didn’t find them useful.  I do put some sticky tape on the shafts with helps a bit with grip.  On the type of terrain you use NMs for, you can just hang onto the shaft above the little “bump” when you need to choke up or match.  For steeper terrain, a more ergo tool is better.

The ”bump” is supposed to sit between your index and middle finger when you are in second position.  If you grip any higher on the tool, the pick will shift and likely pop off whatever you are hooking on.  Putting a pommel on top of the bump is counterproductive, as it forces your hand into a higher, less stable “third position”.

“First Position”

“Second Position”

IMO, gripping the North Machines above the rubber grip, while hooking shallow placements, is not really using the tools the way they are intended to be used. 

I realize my photos are not great, but hopefully it helps people understand the potential problem with gripping above the bump on the North Machine.  There is some overlap between first and second position, so it takes a bit of practice to swap hands effectively.