Locker vs non locker for anchors

Hey all, question about anchor building at bolted anchors. What’s the common practice for locker vs non locker at the bolts? This image shows the lockers but I feel like I’ve seen it both.

It's personal preference. Some people are pretty locker-insistent, but I'd wager that most aren't. I would only feel like I needed them in a circumstance where the anchor was in a weird spot and there was a chance of gates being pushed open by contact with the rock, etc.

It's redundant, so even if the cordelette were somehow to pop out of one of the biners, you're still OK.

But if you've got lockers with you and nothing else to use them for, it's hard to see why you wouldn't use them at the anchor.

You don't need lockers for the two carabiners on the bolts.

If you’re going to be there, hanging on this anchor while you belay, you probably don’t need lockers since you can keep an eye on things and adjust if necessary. If this is a top rope anchor that’s going to be unattended for a while you belay from below, I would use lockers.

The theory of lockers is basically: when it’s not redundant, or when it will be unattended (or both), use a locker. 

Thanks all for the responses!

I always use lockers on my anchor unless (always an unless) I use the old quick draw anchor then I don't.  As Ben said, if you got them .....

Lockers are great for anchors that you might not be able to watch while your group is climbing. Non-lockers are also great but can come with additional risk if there is a chance something could interfere with your equipment. If I am taking a group to a top rope crag for a day and setting anchors I will not be actively attending, I will only use lockers as my hardware. If i am hopping between crags with a group and setting up TR on sport routes, i might use non-lockers on the bolts to make cleaning easier and faster. If you have them, might as well use them.

Just make note that if you're a beginner you might not realize the times when a locker is important vs when its not. This makes you more susceptible to putting a non locker in the wrong place at the wrong time. This is easily mitigated by just using lockers. At least in the context of top roping when you only need a few carabiners. By the time you get to more involved climbing (sport, multi pitch, trad, etc), you will likely know what can and what shouldn't be a non-locker. When I first started climbing multi pitch I had major heebie jeebies when anything in the anchor wasn't a locker. Eventually I learned through experience and came to trust the non lockers, which eased up my gear load.

I mildly prefer lockers on the rock side for an unattended top-rope anchor. But I consider it to be an essentially unimportant increase in safety.

I prefer thick round-stock lockers on the rope side for an unattended top-rope anchor, and for most any lower-off anchor.  On the unattended TR anchor, I think there is more risk of "something" strange happening on the rope side, especially as the carabiners are together and may brace/rub-against each other.  I prefer fat round-profile carabiners for the rope side for any lower off because they handle the wear a lot better than the thin/light/shaped carabiners that non-lockers (including on quick-draws) usually have.

For a lead & lower-off, e.g. where everyone is going to lead the route, I'm fine with a "sport anchor" of two draws from a safety POV, but for wear mitigation, still prefer the rope-side be thick round-profile carabiners.

For an attended anchor (e.g bringing up a second in a multi-pitch setting) I'm happy with non-lockers everywhere but the rope, and a single locker on the rope if doing a sling-shot belay.

My friends and I have started using two dedicated, longer quickdraws for anchors. To that end Edelrid has a nice setup with steel inserts for extra wear resistance while toproping. You have lockers for attaching to your fixed anchors and one locker and one non-locker for the rope. This allows someone leading after the first leader to have a non-locker to quickly clip on their lead. 

Non lockers for lead and lower and a tr lap or two, lockers for a gang bang tr anchor. For my usual sport climbing, I only bring a locker for my belay, with a larger group, maybe a locker draw

I've always gone with whatever I have left. KISS

Making up rules of such things only helps to bring out perfectly reasonable exceptions.  That said, I think of lockers as appropriate when either the carabiner or the rope will be subject to lots of motions (beyond just running along the rope path).  The point of lockers is to prevent accidental opening of the gate, and this requires some kind of energetic motion to happen.  So the carabiners at anchor pieces are subject to very little motion and so don't need to be lockers, whereas carabiners clipped to master points with clove hitches and anchoring people who may move around should be lockers.  Another instance, although I can't claim to be consistent about this, is long slings.  We don't need a locker on the piece end, but the rope end has a lot of potential movement and a locker makes good sense for that.  (My lack of consistency with this is mainly because I use alpine draws fabricated with non-lockers, and when they are opened to full extension the result is non-lockers on both ends.  In some cases, I'll double up on the rope side with a second gate-opposed carabiner if I don't like the way the sling may be smacking into the rock.

One situation subject to energetic rope motions is a piece below a piece that pulls. The snap-back reaction of the rope produces a chaotic configuration of loops and coils than can and has, sometimes with tragic consequences, caused the rope and even the entire draw to unclip. For this reason, lockers are a good idea on the "back-up" pieces placed below marginal gear. I've taken to carrying a "locking draw" for such purposes, which I also use on any really mission-critical piece where accidental unclipping would be catastrophic.

The final application I'd mention is for unattended top-rope pieces, where the party can't tell what's going on at the anchor. For such things, I think it best to have lockers on everything.

rgold wrote:

Making up rules of such things only helps to bring out perfectly reasonable exceptions.  That said, I think of lockers as appropriate when either the carabiner or the rope will be subject to lots of motions (beyond just running along the rope path).  The point of lockers is to prevent accidental opening of the gate, and this requires some kind of energetic motion to happen.  So the carabiners at anchor pieces are subject to very little motion and so don't need to be lockers, whereas carabiners clipped to master points with clove hitches and anchoring people who may move around should be lockers.  Another instance, although I can't claim to be consistent about this, is long slings.  We don't need a locker on the piece end, but the rope end has a lot of potential movement and a locker makes good sense for that.  (My lack of consistency with this is mainly because I use alpine draws fabricated with non-lockers, and when they are opened to full extension the result is non-lockers on both ends.  In some cases, I'll double up on the rope side with a second gate-opposed carabiner if I don't like the way the sling may be smacking into the rock.

One situation subject to energetic rope motions is a piece below a piece that pulls. The snap-back reaction of the rope produces a chaotic configuration of loops and coils than can and has, sometimes with tragic consequences, caused the rope and even the entire draw to unclip. For this reason, lockers are a good idea on the "back-up" pieces placed below marginal gear. I've taken to carrying a "locking draw" for such purposes, which I also use on any really mission-critical piece where accidental unclipping would be catastrophic.

The final application I'd mention is for unattended top-rope pieces, where the party can't tell what's going on at the anchor. For such things, I think it best to have lockers on everything.

Side note on those long slings: I'm usually carrying them as alpine draws with two wire-gates. If I'm clipping into a cam and worried about the lay of the single carabiner I just clip into the racking carabiner and opposite and opposed the two wire-gates from the alpine. Works out to basically the same security as a locker, it isn't any heavier, I don't have to find the dedicated locker alpine, and it cleans easily too. If I'm really worried about it (ex. high winds, sharp edges or brush that might entangle, etc...) I can clove either side as needed to limit cross-loading or migration. Obviously the clove will take more time and introduces a weakening hitch (though not much weaker) but I don't have to find/carry/use the extra locker I might prefer in my anchor. .02