PSA reminder to leave your Drones at Home

Marc801 Cwrote:

He won’t but a judge could. 

That's why when shooting a drone down, you need a full mask to conceal your identity and then leave the area.

Good point AV on difficulty of downing drones. My understanding is the Russians and Ukrainians have had the best luck with jamming drone communication.  Very difficult to down a drone with small arms at distance.  

These guys sell a handheld jamming unit if anyone is interested.

https://drone-detection-system.com/sensor-types-overview/anti-drone-jammer/?gclid=CjwKCAjwrpOiBhBVEiwA_473dM-bgRBXDwR4T-Ys27NR65wg_W33-wUu1axs9lfPE5jl9iZD7_7u7hoCh_8QAvD_BwE

Been flying FPV drones since a few months before the pandemic.  On private property in suburbia and never in anything that could be construed as the backcountry.  Its so much fun.

There are even smaller, lighter 2.4ghz and 5.8ghz jammers on the market.  Have zero experience with the legality of using these.  But would likely be highly effective against DJI and other digital drones.  Hear the drone of the drone, flip it on for 30 seconds, dodge it as it falls out of the sky.  Seems like a better option than firearms or the steep, slippery slope the video crazed crowd is currently embarking on.  

Is this the correct situation to shout "rock!!"?

http://jammers4u.com/drone-jammer-28w-rc-gps-2.4ghz-5.8ghz-up-to-500m

I have heard, but cannot confirm so probably shouldnt even mention, that the NPS and BLM are already using similar tech on public lands where recreational drone use is illegal but happening regularly.

A V wrote:

I’ve already answered that - disclosing specifics of litigation publicly is unwise. Go to your lawyer and discuss details with them and nobody else. 

But, in general - this how it’s done: you can’t squeeze blood from a stone, especially if you can’t find that stone because its always on the move, climbing. I make enough money to cover my immediate bills and thats it - no real savings, assets, nothing like that. If you had a judgement against me you wouldn’t get anything, because I don’t have anything to get. I don’t have shit outside of worn out climbing equipment and my camera. Also, my work location and place of employment changes constantly as a function of my climbing. 

Ah, so you didn't get out of paying back your loans.  You're just ducking the creditors and collectors.  Got it.  

Sounds like a stressful way to live.

A V wrote:

Hey it’s better than dying in a trench in Ukraine so I’m quite happy with how my life is turning out ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Military aged Russian men probably have different standards for “stressful” then y’all do - it could always be much worse. The government could mobilize you and demand that you invade a brother nation with an AK in your hands (or spend a decade in an a hellish disbat)

Climbing mountains and living my life sounds a lot less stressful than that.

Being at war is almost always going to be the more stressful life option.  Doesn't change the fact that you didn't get out of paying back your student loans, you're just constantly avoiding creditors and debt collectors.  You're basically a fugitive always running having to constantly worrying about being caught.  

T1

Ask yourself "if everyone did what I do what would the world look like?"

What does it look like if every single person that recreated outside flew a drone each time?

What does it look like if every single person that voluntarily signed up to receive something of great value then scammed their way out of paying for it?

What does it look like if every single person who was annoyed by something used a firearm to resolve the situation?

Edit- typo

A V wrote:

Caught? in what way? I’m not running and nobody is catching me. It’s quite peaceful and much better than the constant stress of that payment hanging over my life decisions.  

Now I have freedom - back then I didn’t. I feel like you’re imagining this to be much different than it actually was. This is the way in that so much advice is so bad - the right decision (choosing things premarital sex, drugs, going climbing instead of wasting your life in an office, etc) is often is hung over people’s heads with these outlandish tales of how “bad” life is going to be if you go down “that road”. But then you go down those roads and you realize that the older generation and the people they’ve duped are full of shit. 

Freedom to live life like you want to is the ultimate wealth that there is - is it not? I’m living life exactly how I want to - it’s it gotten richer than I could ever have imagined. All of the risks to get here were more worth it than I could have previously imagined.

I never said any of that.  You said that you got out paying back your student loans.  You didn't, you're just not paying them and hoping you don't get caught.  Their is a difference.  

You said you constantly change your jobs, move around, and don't own much of anything so that you don't get caught.  Seems like running to me.  At the very least actively hiding.  

You came here when you where what, 16 years old?  Unless your student loans were issued in another country and the $1,700 a month payment was in Rubles then the amount of debt you've purposefully defaulted on is a felony in the US *.  It's your life, you can live it how you want. 

* Edit:  I should of said if you purposefully defaulted on a a loan it could be a felony.   If the feds prove that you never intended to pay back a loan then it can be considered fraud and that can have a felony charge (depending on the amount) and possibly jail time.  It's not common but can and does happen.  You can't be sent to jail for simply defaulting on a loan, that's illegal.  

T1

AV, Chad is absolutely showing how weak your argument is. I suggest hiding again, mainly because your argument makes you seem like an entitled rich kid with no worries. Now go fly your drone out of the back of your sweet truck, we await your 5 star FAs.

A V wrote:

I’m living life exactly how I want to 

0/10

Your argument appears to be that your happiness is the only thing that should matter both to you and to the rest of the world.  You have one life to live and so any action you take is justified.  And because you don't see any direct negative impacts from your actions you believe there are none.  

Do you honestly think society would function if everyone believed like you do that each member of society should only prioritize their own instant gratification and pleasure?  It's hard to believe someone can be so proudly selfish.  Please don't let me ever tie in with you.

Have you thought to consider that one of the MANY causes higher education is unreasonably expensive in the US is that many people volunteer to receive educations they never plan on paying for?  This is one of the MANY reasons we also have exorbitant health care costs- the people who pay their bills help pay for the people that don't pay their bills.  You brag about maximizing your leisure time while also bragging about scamming higher education out of a degree.  It's mind boggling to me.  

I volunteered to spend 6 years going 120 days at a time without sunshine or fresh food on a US Navy submarine that sat off the coast of N Korea and Russia as part of the (so far successful) strategy to discourage autocrats and dictators from using nuclear weapons to selfishly have their way.  One of the main reasons I chose that path was because at age 18 I realized I would struggle to afford to repay student loans and didnt want to burden myself or whoever would foot that bill if I couldn't.  

You claim that you did not commit fraud.  You are lying to yourself.  

That $1700 bill you keep bragging about dodging is simple math that you were required to be able to do before being accepted to college. It wasn't a surprise.

If I didn't already recognize its a fools errand to try convincing someone that is proud to be a narcissist to not be selfish I would have more to say.  So I'll just say it again- ask yourself, if everyone did what you do how would society function?

I don't know why this thread wasn't already locked.

The current discussion around personal responsibility feels very relevant to the original post.  The drone offender who sparked this thread seemed just as clueless when I confronted him as Av seems now.  

Some people just don’t know what they don’t know. That’s why smart people need to stand up and correct the bull.

A V wrote:

So many angry boomers in this thread, its incredible. Keep it coming, I can do this into infinity. So you were a storm trooper for the empire, and you did that for six years - do you really believe that every student that can’t afford higher education must join possibly one of the most sordid and blood stained institutions on this planet (for 6 years) in order to then go to school? I’m sorry man - but didn’t you know that college is free in Europe? You shouldn’t have to sign up to bomb brown people in order to earn your seat. 

Ugh, this ignorant shit again - I don’t meet the legal standard for “fraud”, not even close. Bring me a “fraud” case of where the student was unemployed (got fired at time of default, wasn’t able to find any work outside of manual labor on a farm, had to live in my car to afford the bill, etc), without assets and responsible for a 1.7k+ monthly bill on a 120k amount (that comes due all at once the default happens) - and then you might have an argument. You won’t by the way, because it’s never happened - because thankfully the country isn’t run by facist idiots (yet). These are just words to make you and the geriatric pitchfork mob (that I’ve whipped up throughout this thread via being snarky and unsubmissive) feel better. These are feelings not facts.

This is a silly question - isn’t that what the USA already does and why y’all are in the mess in the first place? 

Is there a magical reason that higher education is free or affordable in every other developed nation - but wildly unaffordable in the USA? Is 120k a reasonable amount to pay for a 4 year degree? Just wondering

I’ve heard the same and worse from my native Russians that feel this exact same way about me (that I’m a selfish narcissist, asshole, fraudster, etc) because I dodged my mobilization (draft) order for the military while other people “honorably” answered the call. I don’t listen to perspectives like this because they are usually used to manipulate and shame well meaning + proud people in horrendously evil, exploitative ways. 

These online hordes of enraged nationalistic right leaning boomers from America, mean nothing to me - no matter what insults they throw my way for being unable to afford my student loan bill. Their strategy is never reason - its just increasing levels of insults and slander towards a stranger because their nationalistic feelings are hurt. If I gave into this kind of pressure my life would be every bit as dysfunctional and bitter as theirs. 

You know if you boomers directed this kind of anger towards the parasitic billionaires and the wealthy socialite class, you might actually get somewhere with society one day. Right now you’re just mad at a foreign lower middle class dude with more debt for four years of school than you took for your starter home back in 1980. And its not like I was even a bad student - I was a perfect student in a difficult program - and I try my best every day at work. I just legitimately can’t afford that bill, sorry this makes you as angry as it does. 

I’m not going to kill myself over it though - literally or spiritually - (then the boomers would win) I’ll just go live my life with joy and peace in my heart instead - I am confident to say that I deserve a little bit of self fulfillment and happiness before the curtains close on life for good. 

Oooh, the big bad world was mean to me!

A V wrote:

So many angry boomers in this thread, its incredible. 

the student was unemployed (got fired at time of default, wasn’t able to find any work outside of manual labor on a farm, had to live in my car to afford the bill, etc), without assets and responsible for a 1.7k+ monthly bill on a 120k amount

This is a silly question - isn’t that what the USA already does and why y’all are in the mess in the first place? 

because I dodged my mobilization (draft) 

These online hordes of enraged nationalistic right leaning boomers from America, 

You know if you boomers 

I’m not going to kill myself over it 

No.

No.

No.

No.

No.

No.

No.

I can't tell if you cut class the week your professors went over logical fallacies or if you just actively choose to use them to justify hedonism.

Choosing to prioritize leisure time over work is not "unable to find any work" and therefore justification for not paying back (read: stealing) $120K from the man.  And its a sad thing to be proud of.

I'm a 33 year old dude that put down roots in Seattle, that caucused for Bernie Sanders in 2015 and 2019 and that identifies as a buddhist democratic socialist.  

You sound foolish as you move from straw man to non sequitur to just plain old name calling all while actively ignoring my basic rebuttal.  I hope you are able to one day stop distracting yourself with pleasure long enough to see that your actions can consequences even when you choose to ignore them.  And that one persons misdeeds are never justification for your own. It will probably take some variety of tragedy to snap you out of it. But I have hope for you because so many members of the climbing community understand these basic ideas and choose to act in the best interest of the community. An idea you seem unable to consider.

In the mean time, have you considered running for congress here in the US?

bryans wrote:

 Anyone participating in this thread should appreciate their role in this dynamic and consider just letting this thread go silent.

No. The drones would win. That’s how we end up with terminators. Death to drones forever!!!!!

Klaus theKwrote:

No. The drones would win. That’s how we end up with terminators. Death to drones forever!!!!!

Wait, is there a drone Skynet?  Who would be our John Conner then?  I must know! 

bryans wrote:

Artem, you think you're trolling people, but these long-winded posts are a sign of unhappiness, and deep down you know this.  Healthy, balanced, stable people do not post multiple times a day to justify their life decisions to strangers while also winding those strangers up just to continue the mutual antagonism. Consider working these issues out with a counselor. Almost every adult has seen one at one time or another, or is seeing one right now. It's a normal thing to do. You think you are bravely poking the bear and holding your ground, but most observers see a man-child publicly melting down. Anyone participating in this thread should appreciate their role in this dynamic and consider just letting this thread go silent.

Bryan’s, you are a good person

ryan climbs sometimes wrote:

Speaking of droning on and on…how about those drones at the crag 

Ima go out on a limb and guess the median age in this thread is around 35, has mortgage payments, debt , works 40 hours a week maybe a kid or two , drives a vehicle from the mid 2000’s and still manages to climb… ( doesn’t own a POV cam or a drone) 

Rather close.  I'm about a decade older, no kids, have a mortgage that will be paid off in three years.  No other debt.  Own a four year old car.  

Thanks to this thread I'm thinking about getting a drone.    

bryans wrote:

 it's a shame you waste it like this.

Please AV keep wasting your time like this!  A submarine, a guy on the run, drones! This is better than Netflix.

This all started from flying a drone? I gotta go back binge read all the seasons.

Bill Kirbywrote:

Please AV keep wasting your time like this!  A submarine, a guy on the run, drones! This is better than Netflix.

This all started from flying a drone? I gotta go back binge read all the seasons.

I'll give you a synopsis:

AV says: 

• Only suckers pay back their student loans. 
• He got out of repaying his student loans by constantly moving, changing jobs, not owning anything, and hoping the creditors don't find him.
• He's doesn't think you can go to jail for commiting fraud if it's related to a student loan. 
• He's way more free than the rest of us.
• He's way more resilient than the rest of us
• His life isn't as stressful as being at war so thus it's not stressful
• He thinks anyone who works is corporate slave and should kill themselves.
• He really wants to prove how happy he is and justify his lifestyle.

A V wrote:

You do realize that free college for all is a central point of Bernie’s platform?

I do.  And you missed the softball I threw your way- he wants to "forgive" the vast majority of outstanding student debt.  The difference between his approach and yours is that he wants to FIRST reform the US tax code so that the burden is placed on the corporations and wealthy individuals currently enjoying the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act and not paying what he sees as a fair share.  

Your approach was to place that burden on the other students (who must pay more to offset the fraudsters) and the middle/upper middle class currently footing an outsized portion of the publicly funded programs in the US.  

What would happen if everyone did this?  There would be no higher education in the US within a few years.  And the rate of state budget deficits would be 100%.

I'm curious.  Exactly what degree did you get and never pay for? Was it a liberal arts degree that somehow did not include a 100 level English class or 100 level philosophy course that would have introduced you to critical thinking skills and logical reasoning?  Or was is a science degree that somehow did not include 100 level algebra or psych class?

A V wrote:

But the mistake was made, and all you can do with that after the mistake is made is to solve it. 

I think that's the closest anyone will get to a reasonable response from you on your sub par life choices and pride in them.

That will be the last of my input here in this wonderfully entertaining and sometimes depressing discussion.

Don't forget to check you knot!