Gate-less Carabiner

When do you guys think we will transition to gateless caribiners on our quick draws?

When trad climbers stop gatekeeping 

Bolt side or rope side?

Obviously rope side. I see ropeside being used constantly outdoors, maybe even as often as gate side.

I’d prefer boltless bolts to be honest…That way we can bolt all the cracks without bolts. Ja feel 

Not Not MP Adminwrote:

I’d prefer boltless bolts to be honest…That way we can bolt all the cracks without bolts. Ja feel 

Boltless bolts and gate-less carabiners would be perfect for rope-less climbing. 

Not Not MP Adminwrote:

I’d prefer boltless bolts to be honest…

Commonly referred to as glue-ins

Greg Rwrote:

Commonly referred to as glue-ins

No, no, no. I‘m talking no drilling at all, just gluing the hangar to the wall.

Besides, you are referring to glue in bolts aren’t you? Try putting glue-ins next to a crack and tell me it’s not bolted. Hangared cracks are the future!

Hm, I was serious. You just have one carabiner on your quickdraw the other wouldn't have an opening. It would just be like a rap ring pre threaded with rope.  

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Hm, I was serious. You just have one carabiner on your quickdraw the other wouldn't have an opening. It would just be like a rap ring pre threaded with rope.  

How’s that going to work for your follower?

amariuswrote:

Boltless bolts and gate-less carabiners would be perfect for rope-less climbing. 

We use ramhorns and glue ins ..... No more bolts or quickdraws needed!

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Hm, I was serious. You just have one carabiner on your quickdraw the other wouldn't have an opening. It would just be like a rap ring pre threaded with rope.  

The other problem with this is that you'd have to place the draws in the exact order that you threaded them. Also would have to have them all on the same side of your harness. No more quickly grabbing for the easiest draw at the crux. 

We already have gateless carabiners at a lot of crags and in most gyms - they're called quicklinks and they go on the bolt side of permadraws. 

cubist Awrote:

... they're called quicklinks ....

According to Kong, quick links have gates.

Climb Onwrote:

How’s that going to work for your follower?

Imagine a quick draw except one side is a rap ring pre thread through the rope. When the leader is leading they are already attached to the rope and they simply clip a carabiner to the bolt hanger. The follower than unclips the bolt hanger and simply clip it back to your harness. This way they can never drop the draw. 

cubist A wrote:

The other problem with this is that you'd have to place the draws in the exact order that you threaded them.

Yeah I dont think that would be a big deal, just rack the first furthest back.

 Also would have to have them all on the same side of your harness. No more quickly grabbing for the easiest draw at the crux. 

They could alternate

We already have gateless carabiners at a lot of crags and in most gyms - they're called quicklinks and they go on the bolt side of permadraws.

I would consider a quick link to have a gate. But if we say it doesn't these new draws could just be flipped into perma draws by the follower. The ethic could be all new routes get perma draws. 

J T wrote:

How would this work with more than one quickdraw or if you fell on lead with the pre-threaded QuickDraw, presumably attached to your harness? 

If the quick draw is loose enough nothing would happen, if it was tight though, that could cause some weird rotations. 

I’m visual learner so you may have to start drawing this shit out for us. I feel like this even more futuristic than pants over harness and that thread had demonstrative photos…..also that would be a gateless QuickDraw, not a carabiner, if I’m following correctly.

This is true. Another approach could be to just climb on ram horns (though they might need some re-engineering). I am open to other approaches, I just feel like a lot of time is wasted clipping.  

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

I am open to other approaches, I just feel like a lot of time is wasted clipping.  

Just get better at clipping

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Hm, I was serious. You just have one carabiner on your quickdraw the other wouldn't have an opening. It would just be like a rap ring pre threaded with rope.  

Most of the decent sport climbers I know only lead. After they're back down the rope gets pulled, and the next climber blasts off. Rings in place of 'biners kind of screw that up.

J T wrote:

Getting better at climbing seems much less complicated/moronic

Says the guy who wants to glue hangers to the side of a crack

These were actually made at one time in the past; I think it was in the 1990s.

They were small aluminum ovals that were sewn onto one end of a quickdraw.

The idea was that you prethread them onto your rope and head up for the redpoint, clipping the other end of each draw into a bolt hanger along the way.

The main problem was that you have to unclip the one biner, then maybe grab the rope with the same hand so that you didn't have rope friction while lifting the draw upwards.

Then you have to clip the draw into the hanger while that rope is also in your hand.

And they went out of fashion when it became routine to preclip the draws into the hangers instead, redefining the term redpoint and getting rid of that uncomfortable word pinkpoint.

Greg Rwrote:Says the guy who wants to glue hangers to the side of a crack

Look man, just cause you didn't know that glue ins were actually still bolts, don't hate on my brilliant idea alright   

Clint Cumminswrote:

These were actually made at one time in the past; I think it was in the 1990s.

They were small aluminum ovals that were sewn onto one end of a quickdraw.

The idea was that you prethread them onto your rope and head up for the redpoint, clipping the other end of each draw into a bolt hanger along the way.

The main problem was that you have to unclip the one biner, then maybe grab the rope with the same hand so that you didn't have rope friction while lifting the draw upwards.

Then you have to clip the draw into the hanger while that rope is also in your hand.

And they went out of fashion when it became routine to preclip the draws into the hangers instead, redefining the term redpoint and getting rid of that uncomfortable word pinkpoint.

Do you have any pictures of these?

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Do you have any pictures of these?

No but I saw a set about fifteen years ago. Like I said, for experienced sport climbers they are useless. Your partners can't pull the rope and lead, as most good sport climbers expect to do. So if you really want to piss off your partners, pull out a set of those and head on up.