As it should be...

Kind of sad this even needs to be a sign.

Mike Stanleywrote:

Kind of sad this even needs to be a sign.

Agreed. Seems a little obvious but times chanage

Doug Hallerwrote:

Try telling that to the victims family.

Tradibanwrote:

Try telling that to the victims family.

I do not  understand your response. Clarify?

Doug Hallerwrote:

I do not  understand your response. Clarify?

That depends on your point. I happen to agree with you (I think) but that’s just a sign, why post it here?

Agree with the top sentiments that safety is always your own responsibility.  Period.  

However, what’s the deal with Cracked Wall ? Unfamiliar with it.  Cracked sorta implies trad pro to me.  Is it a mixed crag? Was it poorly/ego bolted? Or just easy access for a ton of super gumbies to deck like flies, necessitating a sign.  

Mark Pilatewrote:

However, what’s the deal with Cracked Wall ? Unfamiliar with it.  

Cracked Wall

Here is that warning, for some reason I could barely read it in the post above - 

Tradibanwrote:

Try telling that to the victims family.

Putting yourself at risk voluntarily and then getting hurt or killed does NOT make you a victim.  Duh.  

And I would certainly tell that to the climber's family.

Tradibanwrote:

That depends on your point. I happen to agree with you (I think) but that’s just a sign, why post it here?

I do not understand who is a victim of a sign stating to take responsibility for your actions.

The word "Victim" is apparently a big trigger word for some people.  

Doug Hallerwrote:

I do not understand who is a victim of a sign stating to take responsibility for your actions.

The “victim” is the dead guy or gal. The family of a dead person will look to blame someone or something for what they will see as an accident regardless of the responsibility of the victim or what any sign says.

In other words, the sign is designed to “cover the ass” of the authority with jurisdiction and hopefully deter a few noobs, but 99% blow right by it.

Doug Hallerwrote:

anyone know where this is? who is "The Park" and who exactly is the park manager and what is the phone number or email to contact them

I feel those signs are oppressive and exclusionary. Some people are just born victims, and signs like these are hostile reminders that they are “not wanted in OUR areas” and are a denial of their personhood and humanity.   They should be able to flower to their fullest potential like the rest of us.  

As for Cracked Wall, a climber decked from 30ft on a Trad route and ripped out all their gear. I believe they're now paralyzed from the waist down. 

It's a mixed crag in a college town with easy access, but there are lots of high 1st bolts, runouts, & mixed routes where not bringing gear might bump some climbs to an "R" rating. 

What's pretty horrible is that the local gym still uses the picture of the injured climber (pic taken pre-accident) on a sign that says "Ropes? Belay Card. No exceptions."

Tradibanwrote:

The “victim” is the dead guy or gal. The family of a dead person will look to blame someone or something for what they will see as an accident regardless of the responsibility of the victim or what any sign says.

In other words, the sign is designed to “cover the ass” of the authority with jurisdiction and hopefully deter a few noobs, but 99% blow right by it.

 if people follow the sign's advice, there would not be any victims.

Doug Hallerwrote:

 if people follow the sign's advice, there would not be any victims.

If there were no victims, there would be no sign in the first place!

Sign says, you got to have a membership card, to get inside.... 

Ugh!

Mark Pilatewrote:

I feel those signs are oppressive and exclusionary. Some people are just born victims, and signs like these are hostile reminders that they are “not wanted in OUR areas” and are a denial of their personhood and humanity.   They should be able to flower to their fullest potential like the rest of us.  

bullshit. if you can take responsibility to drive to the crag then you can take responsibility to climb at the crag. 

Cherokee Nuneswrote:

Sign says, you got to have a membership card, to get inside.... 

Ugh!

yeah, you have to be an adult and take responsibility for your actions.