Unfortunate crag interaction

1. I'm not sure what the point of sharing this story is. Maybe it's just therapeutic to write.

TL;DR: Entitled climbers expect to own the crag, berate a climber for trying hard and asking for beta, rage and demand that I fight.

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My partner and I went to a less-popular single pitch trad crag. As we got there, there was a group of 3 top roping. We began racking up at the base of an easy climb to warm up. The group's gear had been spread out and they came to clean it up. They asked what we were going to climb and we said this easy climb plus the harder crag classic.

They say that they don't know what anything is, but are climbing the entire crag right to left. They also say that everything is dirty and chossy. I offer them my guidebook, but they say they have it and just didn't know it contained this area.

My partner and I are a bit confused at this interaction, but shrug it off. My partner leads our warmup, struggling at the harder part but sends it. I quickly follow it. We see they have moved their top rope to the classic. We head over to watch beta and see how long they'll be on it.

I ask if they all planned on climbing it and they say yes. They offer to put our rope up when they're done, which I decline saying I want to lead it. We watch the 1st climber struggle for a bit before we decide to climb a grungy moderate 15' right while we wait. We asked them if they climbed it and they said no. (So much for them climbing everything right to left, but understandable they wanted to get on the classic once they knew which it was.)

I quickly lead the moderate and my partner then begins TRing it. It's relatively hard for them and they work their way up, asking how I did a few spots. At the short OW section they struggle, hang, and ask for beta. After a couple of minutes of them trying different things and me explaining my footwork suddenly things go badly.

The 2nd climber in the group had been struggling and hanging. They turn and absolutely explode at my partner. I was shocked and don't remember everything they said, but it included "YOU HAVE TO FUCKING CLIMB IT FOR YOURSELF!" and "STOP BITCHING YOUR WAY UP THE ROUTE!" My partner briefly tries to defend themself but gives up.

The 3rd person in the group begins loudly complaining about us to the 2nd climber. "They're being annoying as fuck but try to ignore it," and similar things. I considered saying something at this point, but held back for safety and just continued to belay quietly. My partner was visibly shaken, but finished the climb, cleaned the anchor, and lowered off. In the meantime their 2nd climber gave up and lowered, and their 3rd climber attempted the route and also gave up and lowered.

At this point everybody was on the ground and finished climbing. I calmly but sternly told the 2nd climber that yelling at my partner like that when they were on the route was not ok. "I don't fucking care," they responded. They went on to say we were being disruptive and annoying and invading their space. I respond that if we were being loud or annoying then go ahead and politely say that and ask us to be quieter, and don't just start berating somebody for the way they are climbing.

Unexpectedly the 3rd climber went from zero to raging anger instantly. Literally flexing at me, they began yelling: "SHUT THE FUCK UP! SHUT THE FUCK UP! DO YOU WANT TO GET FUCKING PUNCHED? LET'S FUCKING GO!" Taken aback, all I responded with was "I'm not going to fight you. I'm not going to fight you."

The 3rd climber calms down slightly and then yells that we knew they were climbing everything right to left, and that we were assholes for coming over and being annoying next to them. I naively try to explain that I also said we wanted to climb it, we didn't come over to annoy them, and that climbing a neighboring route while waiting is completely normal.

The 3rd climber began raging again, "PUNCH ME! PUNCH ME! IF YOU'RE NOT GOING TO FUCKING PUNCH ME THEN SHUT THE FUCK UP!" They started closing the distance to me, and I again calmly responded "I'm not going to fight you." The 2nd climber starts saying that they were "doing my partner a favor", and they heard my partner struggle on the warm up and that their attitude is "going to get them hurt" if they keep climbing like this.

There is a lull and the interaction ends. Responding would be unproductive and unsafe. The group packs up and leaves, continuing to unabashedly complain about us. My partner and I waited around for a while, but after that experience we were done for the day and left without getting on the classic.

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I don't understand the other group. They acted normally at times. They were all top rope flailing, power screaming, and yelling beta, too. The whole thing went from normal to worst day at the crag instantly.

I suspect the 2nd climber was frustrated at themselves and took it out on my partner. When confronted they were naturally defensive, but maybe knew deep down that they were wrong.

The 3rd climber is a dangerous person and I would absolutely share who they were if I knew.

Holy guacamole. Post the vid.

I am truly sorry you had to go through that.

Dudes were just a bunch of cowards, Austin.  Good on you two for keeping your cool.

I've heard of smoking weed and climbing, but meth? Must be a new thing

That is fucked - what absolute assholes. Well handled, given the circumstances.

Locker wrote:

^^^

your first mistake...

As their third wheel I take offense to this :)

Damn. Sounds like you found Mountain Project in the wild.

Roid rage? I'm sure some climbers have done cycles. 

jbak xwrote:

Holy guacamole. Post the vid.

I am truly sorry you had to go through that.

Afterwards I thought about how video would have been good. But if "I'll want this on video" crosses my mind, I'm just going to walk away instead.

Every time I see a ‘bad behavior at the crag’ I assume I’m gonna be reading a story about something I did.

This on the other hand....sounds like roid rage.  Maybe the heatwave fried they brain 

Not Hobo Greg wrote:

This is why you pack the giant yellow tricam.

... or the little #4 BD nut and assure them that great things come in small packages.

Austin Donisanwrote:

Afterwards I thought about how video would have been good. But if "I'll want this on video" crosses my mind, I'm just going to walk away instead.

Video might have been good, but I don't think that crew would have reacted well if they figured out that you were videoing them. Walking away sounds like the best option. You seem to have handled this well.

This sounds like a terrible experience. I would definitely be crying if someone did this to me. It is ridiculous to think that one is entitled to have an entire crag to themselves wherever they go, and to not even talk to your climbing partner while they are struggling is obscene. 

Austin Donisanwrote:

I'm not sure what the point of sharing this story is. Maybe it's just therapeutic to write.

TL;DR: Entitled climbers expect to own the crag, berate a climber for trying hard and asking for beta, rage and demand that I fight.

------

My partner and I went to a less-popular single pitch trad crag. As we got there, there was a group of 3 top roping. We began racking up at the base of an easy climb to warm up. The group's gear had been spread out and they came to clean it up. They asked what we were going to climb and we said this easy climb plus the harder crag classic.

They say that they don't know what anything is, but are climbing the entire crag right to left. They also say that everything is dirty and chossy. I offer them my guidebook, but they say they have it and just didn't know it contained this area.

My partner and I are a bit confused at this interaction, but shrug it off. My partner leads our warmup, struggling at the harder part but sends it. I quickly follow it. We see they have moved their top rope to the classic. We head over to watch beta and see how long they'll be on it.

I ask if they all planned on climbing it and they say yes. They offer to put our rope up when they're done, which I decline saying I want to lead it. We watch the 1st climber struggle for a bit before we decide to climb a grungy moderate 15' right while we wait. We asked them if they climbed it and they said no. (So much for them climbing everything right to left, but understandable they wanted to get on the classic once they knew which it was.)

I quickly lead the moderate and my partner then begins TRing it. It's relatively hard for them and they work their way up, asking how I did a few spots. At the short OW section they struggle, hang, and ask for beta. After a couple of minutes of them trying different things and me explaining my footwork suddenly things go badly.

The 2nd climber in the group had been struggling and hanging. They turn and absolutely explode at my partner. I was shocked and don't remember everything they said, but it included "YOU HAVE TO FUCKING CLIMB IT FOR YOURSELF!" and "STOP BITCHING YOUR WAY UP THE ROUTE!" My partner briefly tries to defend themself but gives up.

The 3rd person in the group begins loudly complaining about us to the 2nd climber. "They're being annoying as fuck but try to ignore it," and similar things. I considered saying something at this point, but held back for safety and just continued to belay quietly. My partner was visibly shaken, but finished the climb, cleaned the anchor, and lowered off. In the meantime their 2nd climber gave up and lowered, and their 3rd climber attempted the route and also gave up and lowered.

At this point everybody was on the ground and finished climbing. I calmly but sternly told the 2nd climber that yelling at my partner like that when they were on the route was not ok. "I don't fucking care," they responded. They went on to say we were being disruptive and annoying and invading their space. I respond that if we were being loud or annoying then go ahead and politely say that and ask us to be quieter, and don't just start berating somebody for the way they are climbing.

Unexpectedly the 3rd climber went from zero to raging anger instantly. Literally flexing at me, they began yelling: "SHUT THE FUCK UP! SHUT THE FUCK UP! DO YOU WANT TO GET FUCKING PUNCHED? LET'S FUCKING GO!" Taken aback, all I responded with was "I'm not going to fight you. I'm not going to fight you."

The 3rd climber calms down slightly and then yells that we knew they were climbing everything right to left, and that we were assholes for coming over and being annoying next to them. I naively try to explain that I also said we wanted to climb it, we didn't come over to annoy them, and that climbing a neighboring route while waiting is completely normal.

The 3rd climber began raging again, "PUNCH ME! PUNCH ME! IF YOU'RE NOT GOING TO FUCKING PUNCH ME THEN SHUT THE FUCK UP!" They started closing the distance to me, and I again calmly responded "I'm not going to fight you." The 2nd climber starts saying that they were "doing my partner a favor", and they heard my partner struggle on the warm up and that their attitude is "going to get them hurt" if they keep climbing like this.

There is a lull and the interaction ends. Responding would be unproductive and unsafe. The group packs up and leaves, continuing to unabashedly complain about us. My partner and I waited around for a while, but after that experience we were done for the day and left without getting on the classic.

------

I don't understand the other group. They acted normally at times. They were all top rope flailing, power screaming, and yelling beta, too. The whole thing went from normal to worst day at the crag instantly.

I suspect the 2nd climber was frustrated at themselves and took it out on my partner. When confronted they were naturally defensive, but maybe knew deep down that they were wrong.

The 3rd climber is a dangerous person and I would absolutely share who they were if I knew.

What would you like us to learn from this post?

I can’t wait for someone from the group of 3 to chime in and offer their version of the story justifying their actions and then this turning into an 8 page shit show on crag etiquette.  

What crag?

Bryanwrote:

I can’t wait for someone from the group of 3 to chime in and offer their version of the story justifying their actions and then this turning into an 8 page shit show on crag etiquette.  

I mean, that is bizzare enough of an encounter that I am certain the other folks have an entirely different account of what happened.

The OP story is weird enough that it straight doesn't make sense, which makes it very hard to take at face value.

But then, I am a cynical old man and have been skeptical about stranger things which turned out to be simple and true.

Tradibanwrote:

What would you like us to learn from this post?

He's probably just warning us that the crag is a dangerous and unpredictable place, and so not appropriate for children.

Jay Crewwrote:

sounds like you try to act bad and impress the girl you were with and almost got your ass kicked.

I can guarantee you this was not the case. Sounds like you are talking out of your ass.