Are these new route names offensive?

Nevermind

is this what a life in insurance leads you to?

Thank you for starting a divisive thread.  Because we haven't already been through this. Jeez.

The fact that you're asking about these routes means that you know the names are going to bug some people, which means you're just here to argue. I find that terribly obnoxious, but hey, free country and all that. 

I couldn't care less about your route names but I try to not make myself or my work a bother to others when I can avoid it. Pretty easy to do and I live a mellower life because of it. 

Noble attempt to pull the butthurt culture warriors over to a new thread, Trev. Hopefully they can enjoy spilling their outrage to each other here and leave the rest of the forum alone for a bit.

If you have to ask if a route name is offensive, consider using another name.  There's not a guidebook on how to come up with route names so we have to use a subjective opinion.  But, I think a good measure if you think someone might be upset then someone probably will be.

Nobody cares.....

Ok, I'll engage you in good faith.

Gunfire Abortion (Elaina Turner Story) - I'm NOT super familiar, but from what I gather, it was a taser, not a gunshot? So straight away it's at least an inaccurate name. Second, this took place in Chicago and y'all are developing in WA? Weird choice, but whatever, developers come up with all kinds of dumb names. Seems like you're really trying to double down on the irreverence here for shock value. I think this is just a bad name, period. So I'm curious why "reading the context" should change anyone's opinion on the name here. Is there an Exit 38 / WA connection here I'm missing?

Miscartridge of Justice - I don't get the play on words with miscarriage/miscartridge? If you meant "Miscarriage" then I don't see anything wrong, though you're obviously trying to be quite cheeky with the name; if you meant "miscartridge" I'm just left scratching my head. 

Barrell in the Butt - makes sense to me based on your description of the problem.

Cock the Hammer - dunno what about the problem would lead to this name, but as you say, there's nothing inherently wrong about this phrase. Again, are you just trying to rustle jimmies, or does the name fit in context of the climb?

Safety Space, and Trigger Warning - the existence of these two names, in addition to your original diatribe, does make me lean a certain direction in answering my own question above: "Are you just trying to rustle jimmies?" 

In conclusion, I would say two or three of the six names seem fine. The rest just seem like y'all have a real lack of creativity in naming your climbs. 

Dude I'm glad you're contributing to a thriving forum, but this is one thread that doesn't need to be re-started. Re-read the pages and pages of older threads if that's your itch.

J Pwrote:

Ok, I'll engage you in good faith.

Gunfire Abortion (Elaina Turner Story) - I'm NOT super familiar, but from what I gather, it was a taser, not a gunshot? So straight away it's at least an inaccurate name. Second, this took place in Chicago and y'all are developing in WA? Weird choice, but whatever, developers come up with all kinds of dumb names. Seems like you're really trying to double down on the irreverence here for shock value. I think this is just a bad name, period. So I'm curious why "reading the context" should change anyone's opinion on the name here. Is there an Exit 38 / WA connection here I'm missing?

Miscartridge of Justice - I don't get the play on words with miscarriage/miscartridge? If you meant "Miscarriage" then I don't see anything wrong, though you're obviously trying to be quite cheeky with the name; if you meant "miscartridge" I'm just left scratching my head. 

Barrell in the Butt - makes sense to me based on your description of the problem.

Cock the Hammer - dunno what about the problem would lead to this name, but as you say, there's nothing inherently wrong about this phrase. Again, are you just trying to rustle jimmies, or does the name fit in context of the climb?

Safety Space, and Trigger Warning - the existence of these two names, in addition to your original diatribe, does make me lean a certain direction in answering my own question above: "Are you just trying to rustle jimmies?" 

In conclusion, I would say two or three of the six names seem fine. The rest just seem like y'all have a real lack of creativity in naming your climbs. 

Well the theme is pistols since its underneath an area called gunshow. I could use a different person for gunfire abortion as I said you can google shot pregnant woman and you get a huge list of results, I just worked in police liability for a long time and needed someone I would have not had access to their personal data. I would consider a tazer shot a form of gunfire but regardless its still a issue. 

Cartridge is a play on the pistol thing. The rest are also plays on pistols.

Context is important in general. You could write something that says "Blackman Attacks." Well this could be about POC attacking, could be attacks a black people, or it could be someone named Blackman. People simply won't read more than 5 words, I want to make that point that reading should be encouraged.

Big Redwrote:

Dude I'm glad you're contributing to a thriving forum, but this is one thread that doesn't need to be re-started. Re-read the pages and pages of older threads if that's your itch.

Well I could re read those pages upon pages that give absolutely no indication what is bad and not or I could just ask mountain project.

Edit: I am raising that gun violence is worth consideration if you name an area gunshow and pistol boulders. Not that all guns are violent or that people with guns are inherently violent. I am just trying to make the point that just because all the other climbs are pistol themed then that doesn't mean I think everyone should be armed at all times. I appreciate you actually reading! I might just call it the stun gun incident. 

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Well the theme is pistols since its underneath an area called gunshow.  

Ah, I getcha now with the thematic naming, I didn't realize at first.

I would consider a tazer shot a form of gunfire but regardless its still a issue. 

So... you're trying to raise a point about gun violence? I feel like there are other ways to do this - I'm not sure the "in your face" intensity of the name is really going to compel a lot of folks to research the issue...

Cartridge is a play on the pistol thing. The rest are also plays on pistols.

Ah, in that case, I think "miscartridge of justice" is actually better than miscarriage, in terms of not being offensive. I'm open to being convinced otherwise.

In 2010 I named a route "Slanted and Enchanted" because 1) the crack itself was slanted and 2) I'd just seen a reunion tour concert by the band Pavement, and one of their best albums is called Slanted and Enchanted. I love rock, I love rocks, it made sense. To me. I didn't realize in 2010 that the term "slant" was then and is now considered by some to be an asian slur.

Would I use that same name in 2021? No. As much as I hate censorship, including self-censorship, I'm now aware that somebody somewhere might take offense to the word "slanted." To avoid consciously riling up people, I would find another name. This isn't about cancel culture, or being woke, it's about not causing harm when it's so easy to find another name.

Should my route name be redacted on MP? No. I think it's going a bit far to redact every name that possibly gives offense to someone, somewhere.

Should the band Pavement redact their album title? No. 

Do I think twice about route names these days? Yeah. I named one "Rodeo" a month ago but  maybe in 2031 I'll realize climbers who are animal rights activists have always considered the word "Rodeo" to be offensive since rodeos are a venue in which animals are treated poorly for human pleasure, so it's an offensive word to them. Sigh. Maybe "Route #2" wouldn't offend? Except for everyone suffering from PTSD from coming in "just  #2" at something. Sigh.

. 

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Well I could re read those pages upon pages that give absolutely no indication what is bad and not or I could just ask mountain project.

And the result would be identical to those pages and pages.

As others have said, it just seems like you want to argue.

Princess Puppy Lovrwrote:

Well I could re read those pages upon pages that give absolutely no indication what is bad and not or I could just ask mountain project.

Then you already know what to expect from crowd-sourcing this question, and I'd be surprised if you expect a clear answer or civil discussion. If you really don't know what is offensive, then put the routes up and see if they get flagged/redacted. Or if that's too slow, reach out to regional admins, Nick, or the folks who run the site directly through the Contact feature and ask them.

The world as it should be and the world as it is are not the same.  Perhaps people should research and understand context, but they often won't, and it is probably asking too much to expect that climbers will research vague phrases like the ones you propose to better understand the context intended by the FA.  You can feel however you want about that, but it won't change the fact that some people might be put off by the names, rightly or wrongly.  

I would suggest that you add one sentence to the description of each route explaining the name.   People viewing the route can then have the benefit of your explanation at the outset and draw their own conclusions.   

JP was helpful, others were kinda helpful, most of you were useless. Totally changed my mind though so, consider that a win.

So my name contributions to trevor and my boulders, well I wasn't trying to make a point with them but just to make plays on words with a gun theme. Serious question to the community is something that just says 'gun' or is related to it offensive to you? And why?

Examples of my names:

Spinal (Double) Tap

.45 Up 46 Down

Wearing a Full metal Jacket to Work

Trad Climbers & Gun Range Posers

Rock Six Shooter Shooting Six Rocks

Holster a Glock = Climb Wearing Socks

9mm 2-finger Hang

I guess some are drug related too.

I actually think Misscartridge of justice is brilliant. A cartridge being the propellant and projectile that fires out of a pistol or rifle.  The name implies that rather than try someone in a court of law that they  were simply summarily shot. 

Daniel Chode Riderwrote:

I guess some are drug related too.

I think this is definitely the best of those names. What's the story behind "I guess some are drug related too?" Seems like a fun and enigmatic name for a climb.

JonasMRwrote:

I think this is definitely the best of those names. What's the story behind "I guess some are drug related too?" Seems like a fun and enigmatic name for a climb.

Hehe.

I'm totally using that.

Ok, now I am convinced that this guy is Tradiban. Same dopey style begging to argue about everything.