Mountain Project sold again

Simple as the title it's been sold already

You're a week late. Check the MP News Forum.

And the two threads about it.

I thought he meant that OnX has sold MP already. 

JaredGwrote:

I thought he meant that OnX has sold MP already. 

The article about the purchase is on the MP front page dated Jan 6, so I guess he saw it there.

Those people are already using MP to do that.

The types of apps that onX offers are catered to GPS-dependent people who otherwise would not visit the remote places the apps guide them to

I don't know anyone that uses OnX in that manner. Everyone i know that uses it, does so to stay off private land or land that is otherwise off limits to hunting.  They would still be going to the same areas, they are just making sure they are not trespassing.  

JJ Keller wrote:

The types of apps that onX offers are catered to GPS-dependent people who otherwise would not visit the remote places the apps guide them to.  Bringing onX into the world of climbing information will increase impacts to sensitive places and is against everyone’s best interest.

Protect wild places and public lands by opposing this ‘partnership

We’ll make our own mountain project! With rummy and crag cats!

JJ Keller wrote:

The types of apps that onX offers are catered to GPS-dependent people who otherwise would not visit the remote places the apps guide them to.  Bringing onX into the world of climbing information will increase impacts to sensitive places and is against everyone’s best interest.

Are there that many people that can't read a map? If we actyally wanted to keep people out of remote places we would encourage people to not post pictures, detailed maps and topos. Remote multipitch climbs are generally not that hard to find due to the towering nature of what your climbing. Boulders in the woods behind city parks on the other hand GPS is a must have.

Here is a article about the sale.

https://rockandice.com/climbing-news/mountain-project-acquired-by-onx/?cn-reloaded=1

No mater who runs the web site and app. With out the climbers posting new climbing area, and routes. The site is doomed.

Jack Jones wrote:

Do you seriously believe that you are some sort of arbiter as to who is worthy of access to public lands? What a pompous ass you are. 

You should go hike the Gem Lake trail in RMNP, then hike on some of the adjacent trails, then contemplate the difference between the two.  

When information is made accessible to the point that no real effort is required on the part of anyone in order to access that information, it tends to degrade areas.  The other big one is when areas get hyped: any time a large enough swath of society insists some particular thing is not to be missed, it degrades the area being hyped.  

The nice thing about MP has always been that the information is there for anyone who cares to look, and it is not so accessible that anyone can make use of the available information without doing some amount of work on their own.  As a result, the information is free and open, but it tends not to overly impact areas.  I hope that tradition can continue under the new ownership.  If not, I am out, and all of my content will go out with me.

I have been wondering for a while if I should stop posting new routes/crags to MP. It's convenient but maybe I'm just helping to degrade the sport.

This is starting out well. 

So the outdoors is just for you then JJ?

JJ Keller wrote:

No.  I take issue with using the information collected on this site to increase traffic, and therefore impacts in fragile or pristine areas.  I especially disagree with onX justifying the increased traffic by pretending they are creating support for public lands.  

So your amount of traffic is acceptable but if anyone has easier access then they shouldn't be allowed to go to that place? The issue is that access should be equitable. The more you try to hide information, the more a select few benefit and the rest do not. A kid growing up in poverty should have the same ease of access to a place that a millennial making 150k. Say a climbing area allows a total of 10 visitations a year to preserve an area. You are saying your entitled to that privilege for all those days while others are not. Public land is for the public. If the environment is your actual concern you should be advocating for areas to limit the number of visits a person gets. Or in terms that make more sense you want 100 days of access for yourself rather than giving 100 people one day of access. 

Great, now we get to buy a membership to use MP.

Those new app features and functionality may require a membership to access.

"The onX mission is to awaken the adventurer in everyone. We do this by developing navigational software that millions of outdoor enthusiasts rely on to go further into the backcountry, safely and confidently."

Thereby eliminating any adventure.  

"Adventure" is when the outcome is in doubt.  

John Byrneswrote:

"The onX mission is to awaken the adventurer in everyone. We do this by developing navigational software that millions of outdoor enthusiasts rely on to go further into the backcountry, safely and confidently."

Thereby eliminating any adventure.  

"Adventure" is when the outcome is in doubt.  

Interesting definition of "Adventure", but its your opinion so you're allowed to define it as such for yourself. 

Thanks to Google Earth and various trip reports I knew the exact location of Mt. Saint Nicholas, what the approach was like, and what the route would be like. It was well within my partner's and my abilities to climb so the outcome was never in doubt. It was however, one hell of an adventure and I cherish the memory of that day and the time spent with my buddy. If the introduction of a GPS App removes adventure from your life then I feel very sorry for you.

It is improving public hunting opportunities here.  Not necessarily hunting success, but that's a totally different topic.  Take the same amount of hunters and spread them out to other areas vs a bunch of people in a smaller area and the hunting experience is better.  Fishing really hasn't been changed any either.  We have a site that focuses on fishing reports for every lake in the state.  There are those that bounce from lake to lake based on random fishing reports, but it hasn't had any over effect good or bad.  Those who can catch fish don't need random online reports and those who can't just go from lake to lake not catching fish.  Sadly I was in the second group, which is why I quit fishing.

Regionally, OnX hasn't put out any information that wasn't already public record and available on the internet.  They just put it all in one place and added GPS overlay.  They simplified a process, and many are willing to pay for that convenience. 

JJ Keller wrote:

No and no.  I’m disagreeing with the goal of getting as many people outside as possible, especially “off the beaten path”.  Access is at risk when traffic and impacts increase.  Don’t believe me?  Look at areas with permit systems in place; the Enchantments in Washington, Conundrum Hot Springs and soon to be the entire 4-pass loop near Aspen and Ice Lakes Basin in the San Juans...permit systems are inevitable in areas with increased traffic.

Trevor, you’re saying I should be advocating for limiting access?  That’s exactly what resource degradation leads to, permit systems.  And that’s exactly what I’m advocating against: increased traffic and impacts to areas that will lead to restricted access.

Your advocating for your unrestricted access. I am saying everyone should have access and if that means my access is reduced then so be it. Restricted access in this situation is in the eye of the beholder. People having no way to find rock climbs is in itself a form of restricted access. As for the enchantments I absolutely support the permit system. Everyone from casual hikers to hardcore alpine climbers should be able to enjoy the area, not just a select few. 

I also think good GPS makes for better access. The number of climbing areas/climbs that went up on private land/restricted land would have likely been less had people had better maps (infinite bliss comes to mind). 

John Byrneswrote:

"The onX mission is to awaken the adventurer in everyone. We do this by developing navigational software that millions of outdoor enthusiasts rely on to go further into the backcountry, safely and confidently."

Thereby eliminating any adventure.  

"Adventure" is when the outcome is in doubt.  

Right on Brother.