How good do you have to be at subpar crack sizes to do well at IC?

Looking to go to the creek soon for the first time! Hoping to lead some of the 5.10s (though I'll still have a blast even if I can only TR them).

One of the gyms I've been practicing my crack climbing in has ~50ft plywood splitters. While it's amazing for cruising handcracks (there's even an overhanging one, great for training), in these splitters can, counterintuitively, have seriously awful cruxes because even a manmade plywood splitter is not perfect. At the bottom it may be perfect hands, but maybe in the middle it becomes teacup hands, and maybe the last ten feet is small hands a bit too big for ringlocks. Whatever the awkward section is, it is a splitter in that awkward size, sustained for maybe 10ft. Is the creek like this too?

Most of my crack climbing experience is in the gym (not a lot of my climbing friends want to go out to Trout Creek with me here in Oregon...sadface), but I will say I'm pretty confident in my skills for good sizes. I can cruise the overhanging hand sized splitter in my gym. There's a handcrack that leans ~30 degrees left or so at the bottom, and sustained ~15 degrees right at the top, people frequently stop to ask me how I managed to do it without cheating onto the footholds. I also am feeling more comfortable on fists, though my ability to practice at that size has been limited (more outdoors here, where constrictions help a lot). I've also been practicing resting on handcracks and feel like my endurance is going up exponentially.

Where I think the creek is going to hand my ass to me: it's simply amazing how quickly my skill drops off at awkward sizes. This is of course not unique to me at all, but it makes me wonder, is creek climbing skill more about mastering the good sizes, or mastering the bad?

I'm hoping to lead some 5.10 hand cracks and hoping that that doesn't involve ~10ft of sustained thin hands, and ~20ft of fists with ~10ft of teacup fists to go with the ~80ft of hand jamming. Anybody want to confirm or dispel my fears?

The creek is like that, but not always (see Generic Crack aka The Golden Treadmill).

I can't think of a ton of super leaning cracks at the creek that aren't also sorta roofish.

No worries, a few days at the creek of working your bad sizes and you'll be fine. 

Try all the sizes! I thought I knew my fav sizes till I went to the creek and realized I was completely wrong about everything.

Some of the cracks in the creek are consistent in size, but the majority of them will have enough variation that you won't just get perfect hands the entire way.

But really, the whole point of going to the creek is to improve your crack skills. You're not going to do that if you only climb perfect #2 cracks all the time. Just remember that for most cracks, you can plug gear and hang wherever you need to if you start struggling at the size. Sit there a bit and figure out the technique you need to climb the section ahead of you. 

If it's an awkward size that you're not super comfortable with, you may have to just punch it through that section to get to the next good jam that you can place gear from. But in the worst case scenario, you can always pull on gear to get through a tough section, then work that section a bit on toprope when you're getting lowered.

Don’t worry about it.
Go without expectations.
Surprise yourself! 

Mtn Catwrote:

You're not going to do that if you only climb perfect #2 cracks all the time. Just remember that for most cracks, you can plug gear and hang wherever you need to if you start struggling at the size. 

Thanks Johnny, a good reminder to rely on the gear.

I'm not the most experienced/confident trad leader, hoping to push myself on my trip since

• the gear is cenerally very good
• you can sew it up easily
• many routes are endurance problems, a single take halfway up make may the climbing way easier
• almost always possible to french past a hard section
• very steep, few ledges to hit in a fall

That said, I have not yet taken a single lead fall on gear, and don't have a lot of lead falls on bolts to my name either. So I realize now that my question maybe is more about my mental game than the actual climbing.

Which is a great reminder! I am going to push myself on this trip because I believe its possible to do so safely. (Or at least, as "safely" as "safely" can mean in the context of a dangerous sport that can cause injury and death.)

Bring on the small hands, I guess! Just not the teacup fists unless someone is lending me a bunch of #4s. :)

Michael Fairhurstwrote:

Bring on the small hands, I guess! Just not the teacup fists unless someone is lending me a bunch of #4s. :)

FYI, when it gets to #4s that are too wide to fist jam, I've found it easier to either just armbar/elbow lock them or do butterfly stacks. Teacup fists are typically pretty garbage unless you're on low-angle terrain.

That being said, you should absolutely jump on a crack with some short #4 sections to get that practice in :)

Michael Fairhurstwrote:

Thanks Johnny, a good reminder to rely on the gear.

I'm not the most experienced/confident trad leader, hoping to push myself on my trip since

• the gear is cenerally very good
• you can sew it up easily
• many routes are endurance problems, a single take halfway up make may the climbing way easier
• almost always possible to french past a hard section
• very steep, few ledges to hit in a fall

That said, I have not yet taken a single lead fall on gear, and don't have a lot of lead falls on bolts to my name either. So I realize now that my question maybe is more about my mental game than the actual climbing.

Which is a great reminder! I am going to push myself on this trip because I believe its possible to do so safely. (Or at least, as "safely" as "safely" can mean in the context of a dangerous sport that can cause injury and death.)

Bring on the small hands, I guess! Just not the teacup fists unless someone is lending me a bunch of #4s. :)

It sounds like you don’t trust your gear and your head game is probably severely limiting you. Luckily, the creek is a good place to develop and push your head game!

You should work on falling. Find a climb with safe falls. Climb up until you are in safe fall territory. Place a bomber piece above your head, fall. Check the piece. Note what it did. Climb up to it. Fall. Check the piece. Note what it did. Climb a few inches above. Fall. Check the piece. Note what it did. Climb a foot above the piece. Fall. Check the piece. Note what it did.

If you don’t feel confident in doing this, you should consider French freeing and easy aiding to watch a cam move as a load is applied.

It will astonish you how much learning how to fall and being comfy with your gear will allow you to unlock new things

Have a blast!!!

Michael Fairhurstwrote:

At the bottom it may be perfect hands, but maybe in the middle it becomes teacup hands, and maybe the last ten feet is small hands a bit too big for ringlocks. Whatever the awkward section is, it is a splitter in that awkward size, sustained for maybe 10ft. Is the creek like this too?

Where I think the creek is going to hand my ass to me: it's simply amazing how quickly my skill drops off at awkward sizes. This is of course not unique to me at all, but it makes me wonder, is creek climbing skill more about mastering the good sizes, or mastering the bad?

I'm hoping to lead some 5.10 hand cracks and hoping that that doesn't involve ~10ft of sustained thin hands, and ~20ft of fists with ~10ft of teacup fists to go with the ~80ft of hand jamming. Anybody want to confirm or dispel my fears?

Yes, the Creek is like this for the most part, particularly if the route is not short.

Accept that you are going to get spanked, particularly since you don't seem like you have much if any experience leading 5.10 cracks. Far more experienced leaders show up and get spanked first time. Repeat spanking is often par for the course if you can't spend a lot of time in the area getting dialed. You might have more fun if you do a lot of toproping at first to get a feel for how to climb splitters with rare feet and infrequent rests. 

But really, the whole point of going to the creek is to improve your crack skills.

This is good advice.

Keep in mind that not all gear falls are safe in sandstone. Cams can and do railroad/track out of cracks sometimes. I've seen it happen.

Usually the cruxes of hand cracks in the creek for me are the big pods in the middle of the route where you have to do 5-6ft of awkward offwidth/chimneying to get back into the perfect hands. I never ran into anything smaller than #1 small hands on any 5.10 route.

Have fallen on the crux of Super Crack and am still alive.   However my pride is destroyed. 

Anthony Lwrote:

You should work on falling. Find a climb with safe falls. Climb up until you are in safe fall territory. Place a bomber piece above your head, fall. Check the piece. Note what it did. Climb up to it. Fall. Check the piece. Note what it did. Climb a few inches above. Fall. Check the piece. Note what it did. Climb a foot above the piece. Fall. Check the piece. Note what it did.

Sounds like a great first day warm-up! This is more or less what I'm planning to do, although I'll also plug one (or two!) extra pieces below it beforehand :)

I have done some aiding to get confidence in gear, so falling is next, and the creek has got to be one of the best places in the US to step it up.

Of course, the awkward sizes may still shut me down. But if I have fun, improve my crack climbing, improve my mental game on gear, that would be one hell of a great trip.

Training wise, focus on doing cracks with just 1 foot in, and 1 foot smearing. You'd be surprised how even the most splitter of splitters still lean juuuuusssttttt a bit ever so slight in 1 direction. Or how placing gear is sometimes easier with 1 foot smeared out. I learned this the 1st time I went. Took it back to my home gym and practiced. For the most part the guidebooks are pretty spot on for what you'll encounter. If it says hands it'll be hands, if it says exciting finish it'll be exciting often for even strong climbers.

And for the obligatory: 1. Be a good steward. Clean up trash, even if it's not yours.

2. If you're not pooping in the bathrooms, for everyones sake and every dog/cat/coyoytes sake. Bag your poop and drive it out with you, or at least burn it (it won't stink on a hot fire).

3. You're gonna get spanked, just have fun with it....but on that note don't be that guy that takes 90 mins to get up blue sun. Think of it like golf.