Another helicopter rescue on Tahquitz.

Thomas Claibornewrote:

Climb early, climb non-classics, or climb something 5.10 or harder, and this is less of an issue FYI. I can already guess what the lines were on without being there. People, for some reason, would rather be in a conga line on a "classic" but not touch something one star less in the guidebook.

He’s lying! Climb all the stars! Stars are nice and bright! Just don’t poop, don’t die, and have fun!

Sometimes you gotta strike a bargain to claim yer route. One time we came across two parties attempting to find Whampo. I said we'd show em the way if we could go first and as easy as that an alliance of gumbies was attained.

Another good option is to look for a "spectre of the Brocken" soloing all the routes in blown out Evolv approach shoes. He climbs here and there they say. Give him a shout and he will show you all the secret rap stations and routes between the routes.

jt newgardwrote:Another good option is to look for a "spectre of the Brocken" soloing all the routes in blown out Evolv approach shoes. He climbs here and there they say. Give him a shout and he will show you all the secret rap stations and routes between the routes.

Very nearly had that exact experience at Tahquitz over a weekend last Sept. Felt unworthy yet still had a great time together.  First time for something like that in 16 years of climbing ... though am not sure I was open to the possibility earlier.

Well said.

Another helicopter rescue from Tahquitz today…

Apparently an unstable ankle somehow related to rapping. Riverside Sheriff helo Rescue 9 winched them off. 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CyaIK32uptG/

Friday's helo rescue was on Whodunnit- from the location, looks like the guy fell in/near the chimney pitch.

Both climbers were winched off the route, though the injured climber clearly had a relatively minor injury without compounding conditions. It's amazing that such a high risk solution is regularly being used for low risk problems like this.

The comment from the RSO guy at the end is classic: "Don't worry about it (cost)- that was complements of Riverside County!" (This should be amended with "...taxpayers!")

apogeewrote:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CyaIK32uptG/

Friday's helo rescue was on Whodunnit- from the location, looks like the guy fell in/near the chimney pitch.

Both climbers were winched off the route, though the injured climber clearly had a relatively minor injury without compounding conditions. It's amazing that such a high risk solution is regularly being used for low risk problems like this.

The comment from the RSO guy at the end is classic: "Don't worry about it (cost)- that was complements of Riverside County!" (This should be amended with "...taxpayers!")

Yes but it’s not like taxpayers get a bill in the mail, it’s all part of the budget. In practice, all the rescues are already paid for.

You do realize where the funding for that budget comes from, don’t you?

Edit to below: Stick to comments about things you are knowledgeable about, Tradiban.

apogeewrote:

You do realize where the funding for that budget comes from, don’t you?

Yes. The point is that each subsequent rescue doesn’t cost me or us more money. 

The phrases a la “at the taxpayers expense” are hollow and trite.

Yet another helo rescue from Tahquitz this afternoon. A party on the Long Climb- leader fell and somehow incapacitated leading the second pitch. A 911 call brought Riverside Rescue 9 out for the second rescue in 48 hours. Here’s the leader being hoisted off:

Initially the plan was to immediately hoist the second climber, who was on the ledge at the top of the first pitch- they quickly changed the plan and decided to bring the leader back for medical care and to refuel the helo. The second remained on the ledge for about 30 minutes (an unenviable position to be in), then Rescue 9 returned and hoisted them off- a RMRU member was the rescuer:

No word yet on the injuries of the leader.

Looks like all my prophecies are coming true!

I saw the first person getting hoisted from the top of pitch 2 I thought. But then there was someone leading the 2nd pitch and someone belaying from the bolted first pitch. Seemed odd.

If they actually did pick the belayer off of pitch 1 ledge (which are two bolts), why didn't he just rap? (even if the rope is short)

Word is that the leader took a ~40’ fall on P2- sustained head trauma, arm & rib fractures. Was dangling there until they were hoisted off. The rescue medic cut the leaders rope at the pick off. The second remained at the ledge until they were hoisted. 

apogee, what do you think of the argument that fee-for-service SAR disincentivises use of SAR in situations that warrant it?

The argument goes that subsidized SAR would avert loss of life from situations where calling it may be delayed or avoided, to their detriment.

I learned recently from my friend in HK that apparently every HK citizen gets one rescue on the taxpayer dime. After that the bill comes.

J Lwrote:

apogee, what do you think of the argument that fee-for-service SAR disincentivises use of SAR in situations that warrant it?

The argument goes that subsidized SAR would avert loss of life from situations where calling it may be delayed or avoided, to their detriment.

I learned recently from my friend in HK that apparently every HK citizen gets one rescue on the taxpayer dime. After that the bill comes.

How many people need to get rescued twice?

That makes sense then. Helo was flying around for a good 20-30min trying to find them. Hope they end up alright

To my knowledge, NH does bill people for rescue in some cases for negligence. I think that's a fair policy in the world of rescue but then it's in the discretion of the rescuing agency whether you're on the hook. If you call for a rescue on something you could've easily walked out on though, in most cases, I'd be fine with a person getting a bill.

My information may be out of date, but I have read that climbers make up a small portion of SAR calls. Most calls are from lost hikers and to find eloping seniors (the running away kind, not the getting married kind.)

To my knowledge SAR in Canada is an inter-agency service that is predominantly made up of volunteers. I wonder if that is that the case in NH, for example?

In the case I read, a rescuee was billed $5,400 after falling into a frozen lake because he did not heed local weather reports re: fog. He bailed from ice fishing, got lost in the fog, and fell through closer to shore and local FD billed him for the rescue.

Scugog Fire Chief Richard Miller said it was calculated at $500 per firetruck per hour plus the cost of the firefighters.

I don’t know enough about such fee-for-service systems to have any kind of an informed opinion. I do know that in the US, the vast majority of SAR is performed by people who volunteer many years of their time, money and lives to helping others who are in need. And that there are resources that are used in SAR that become influenced by economic dynamics- when an EMS-related resource makes a decision to invest huge amounts of money into a system like helicopter rescue, there are strong incentives to use it and justify the programs existence. There are many instances of incidents in SAR & EMS where non-critical patients have received dangerous evacuation methods that ended in disaster for patients, caregivers and pilots.

Head trauma and fractured ribs certainly seem to be appropriate use of this kind of rescue technology. The myriad of hoist rescues that have occurred for ankle injuries in the San Jacinto mountains in recent years, notsomuch.

This might be a dumb question...do frequent rescues like this put climbing access at risk?

Pugnacious Slabwrote:

This might be a dumb question...do frequent rescues like this put climbing access at risk?

I don’t think so as climbing is entrenched here and most rescues are dumbass hikers.

A simple scroll through this single thread (amongst many others here at MP) will make pretty clear that there have been an awful lot of rescues of climbers in the San Jacinto mountains in recent years.

Over the years there have been periods where high profile rescues (&/or rescues that were related to particularly egregious climber behavior) have become a political issue, with calls for increased regulation and shifting financial responsibility to the climber. It seems like a lot of that talk has quieted in recent years, perhaps related to how climbing is now much more mainstream, and there seems to be more of a cultural acceptance of the risks and rescues that go along with it. Land manager policies for access have certainly tightened for commercial guiding, and there are definitely peaks within the NPS that have increased their screening of climbers (Denali is a good example). Years ago, in order to legitimately climb Snow Creek (N face of San Jacinto), the Superintendent of San Jacinto State Park required a climbing resume to obtain a permit- the rationale was the expense and risk of rescues on that side of the mountain.