If looking out for the health of society

Is “morally superior”, then yes, I am morally superior to the hoarded flocking to Moab, ignoring stay at home orders and people climbing at crowded crags.
I don’t see how this is being turned into a term against people taking a global pandemic seriously. 

I can walk to over 50 climbs from my front door and nobody is ever there. I am local.

Also, people who live in remote areas make sacrifices to do so. No nearby coveffe shops, movie theaters, resturants, poor health care, no climbing gyms, days without power during storms, etc, etc. Most are usually happy to share because most visitor are usually considerate.

But if you are not local and still visiting small rural comminities and/or interacting in groups just to get your climbing/outdoor fix you are a selfish asshole, end of story.                                                                                                                    

Dillon Smith wrote: Gosh dang social justice warriors!

Easy on the language Dillon. 

Wayne Curr wrote:
I can walk to over 50 climbs from my front door and nobody is ever there. I am local.

Also, people who live in remote areas make sacrifices to do so. No nearby coveffe shops, movie theaters, resturants, poor health care, no climbing gyms, days without power during storms, etc, etc. Most are usually happy to share because most visitor are usually considerate.

But if you are not local and still visiting small rural comminities and/or interacting in groups just to get your climbing/outdoor fix you are a selfish asshole, end of story.                                                                                                                    

I'm also a local.  I walk out my back door and am immediately in the Columbia boulders in CA.  Yesterday I was walking around (not climbing) and ran into 5 out-of-area parties.  They were all climbing the same boulders "the locals do".  If any of them has COVID, they will deposit germs on the holds that 'locals' will carry back home.  Even as a local, your crag is a potential disease vector.

It really just isn't a good time to climb for anyone - even locals.  Go for a walk outside and appreciate nature in ways that don't involve heights and shared surfaces.

Wayne Curr wrote:
I can walk to over 50 climbs from my front door and nobody is ever there. I am local.

Also, people who live in remote areas make sacrifices to do so. No nearby coveffe shops, movie theaters, resturants, poor health care, no climbing gyms, days without power during storms, etc, etc. Most are usually happy to share because most visitor are usually considerate.

But if you are not local and still visiting small rural comminities and/or interacting in groups just to get your climbing/outdoor fix you are a selfish asshole, end of story.                                                                                                                    

Define "local".

Moab "locals" are petitioning to build a wall around the town. 

trailridge wrote: Moab "locals" are petitioning to build a wall around the town. 

Make the Coloradans pay for it

Tradiban wrote:

Define "local".

Seriously? 

Simple: you live (for real - don't try to come up with some BS loophole about mailing addresses or other nonsense) in the community where the cliffs are located.

Marc801 C wrote:

Seriously? 

Simple: you live (for real - don't try to come up with some BS loophole about mailing addresses or other nonsense) in the community where the cliffs are located.

Yes, seriously. For example who gets Indian Creek Monticello or Moab? Or are those the same "community". If so, where do the community boundaries begin and end? Who gets to decide that?

Tradiban wrote:

Yes, seriously. For example who gets Indian Creek Monticello or Moab? 

Monticello. Moab is in a different county. One that has restricted all hotels and camping - and that's all camping, not just campgrounds - but to county residents.

Or are those the same "community". If so, where do the community boundaries begin and end?

Your address.

 Who gets to decide that?

Whoever has legal jurisdiction.

Build the wall!

These days, if you have to get in a car, ya ain’t local.

Marc801 C wrote: Monticello. Moab is in a different county. One that has restricted all hotels and camping - and that's all camping, not just campgrounds - but to county residents.

Your address.

Whoever has legal jurisdiction.

I think that's fair, "local" is by county. Could cause some problems here and there but I think we could sort it out. There's some big counties out here in California.

So how long does a van dweller have to live in the county to be counted as "local"?

Interesting topic this moved to.  I grew up in Tahoe.  I wouldn’t consider a 1 or 2 season worker a local despite living there.   So how long does one need to be vested in an area to be local?  5 years? 10? A generation?  I mean if you aren’t at least 51% Native American can you claim to be local anywhere in the states?

Local = paying property taxes there

;)

Marc801 C wrote:

Seriously? 

Simple: you live (for real - don't try to come up with some BS loophole about mailing addresses or other nonsense) in the community where the cliffs are located.

seriously? if you haven't lived continuously in an area for 20 years or more, you aren't a local, so don't kid yourself.  i have to laugh at these 20 something kids that have lived in moab for 6 months or maybe a  year (oooh, OG's!!!) and call themselves locals. bitch please...

trailridge wrote: Moab "locals" are petitioning to build a wall around the town. 

I'll play.

How about all non locals build a dome out of slick rock over Moab to protect the locals.  You guys can stay in there and be safe.  Then, the rest of the country can drive right over it to access the millions of acres of public land that belongs to the public, not you.  

Seriously though, if you are local and genuinely concerned that you might bring the virus back into your community after climbing rocks where out of towners have been, then you are just as culpable as anybody else.  Stop climbing.  It is that simple.  It is really reckless for locals in small towns to go out and climb rocks where outsiders are climbing and then possibly bring the virus back into a small town.   Personally, I have stopped climbing altogether, even locally.  There are other things much more important than climbing right now, well always.

The entire country is getting shut down.  Far beyond the illness and death coming from the virus, massive pain and suffering is coming from the millions of layoffs and destroyed businesses.  Let's stop blaming everybody else and do something constructive.

I think Greg D may be on to something...

Really, i just wish people would refrain from climbing as a sign of respect for all that's going on. There's mixed opinions about whether is spreads the virus or not - so just stop. It's for what - 2 weeks? 3?  Countless people have lost their jobs back home. It's hard to then hop on a climb and have a blast, when so many people are hurting all around. It just doesn't feel right. But that's me. 

Matt N wrote: Local = paying property taxes there

;)

So land owners only?  No renters, no year round RV's?  Is this England 200 year ago?  You do know there are many people that own land there, pay property taxes, have a residence elsewhere, and don't actually live there, don't you?

^^^ Bitterroot Valley in Montana anyone?  Or Sun Valley?