Bitter and Hostile Former Climbers Over 50 #1

Stick clipping is cheating

What do you mean I can't use my stitch plate or figure 8 to belay at the gym?  Both were perfectly fine in 1993.

" Bitter and Hostile Former Climbers Over 50 #1"

That was supertopo....that pos is shut down.  Go take a $hit somewhere else.

K Weber wrote: " Bitter and Hostile Former Climbers Over 50 #1"

That was supertopo....that pos is shut down.  Go take a $hit somewhere else.

Buzzkill.

K Weber wrote: " Bitter and Hostile Former Climbers Over 50 #1"

That was supertopo....that pos is shut down.  Go take a $hit somewhere else.

You're right. Back to discussions about how to use our 4 years of climbing experience to get in the proper headspace to mock lead our TR project.

don'tchuffonme wrote:

I'm close, but not over.  I say if you have a problem with the following, this thread is for you (and me):

• Ropes hanging on routes with no one climbing as some sort of half-ass reservation
• Hostile, unleashed dogs
• Dogshit at the crag
• Human shit at the crag
• Groups of five or larger on a route (particularly if it's a good warmup and motherfuckers are hangdogging the piss out of it and not even at the crux yet) and taking forever- like all damn day
• Hammocks blocking the trail
• Hammocks, period
• Music- of any kind.  No one wants to hear what puts you in the "zone" because everyone has different tastes.  Leave the goddamned speaker at home.
• Gear thrown everywhere
• Spray- of any kind.  Spray about your prowess, spray about your accolades, spray about beta on a route (especially if it's unsolicited)
• Arguing couples/partners
• Generally being loud af and obnoxious.  Some people are actually there to focus and try hard.  We don't need to hear about the person you hate at work or the person you're trying to nail- from five routes over.
• Trash/left gear (same thing here- if you leave shit at the crag, whether it's actual "shit" or whether it's a rack of cams, it's littering.)  Don't ask for it back.  It's not hard to do a gear check before you leave for the day.  If you don't possess that very basic skill of keeping track of expensive gear that you paid for, then you probably lack the basic skill and memory to competently climb outside in the first place
• If you rappel from sport routes equipped for lowering, you are a permagumby- especially if you're teaching other gumbies that this is the only way.
• Parking like an asshole.

Did I miss anything?  Oh, and while I'm at it, and since Mark has afforded us the venue in which to vent- I'd like to thank Alex Honnold, Tommy and Kevin, the douchers at Reel Rock, every gear company anywhere that's well-known and has a large marketing budget, and every gym ever for making climbing so popular (you know, "GROWING THE SPORT")  and making cragging such a miserable shitshow.  I used to be able to go out and be a LNT 5.11+ chuffer in peace.  Now it's hard to escape the list above and on some weekends, I experience EVERY FUCKING ITEM on that list, at the same crag, on the same day.  So to everyone that made this the case, here's the most sarcastic "thank you" I can muster.

And yes, to those that say "everyone has the right..." and "it's up to the people doing it correctly to pass on...." and "you're just a curmudgeon..." and "you don't own the rock..."

Yeah.  I get it. You're right.  I do.  I'm trying, it's just impossible nowadays because there's not enough of "us" to keep up with the volume that's being churned out of gyms.  And IMO opinion, no amount of curmudgeonly disdain is going to make up for the fact that areas are being run into the ground, erosion is increasing exponentially, and it is affecting access, for ALL OF US.

Also, before this rebuttal is offered, there isn't enough "trail day climber festival kumbaya" nonsense to keep up with it either.  Every year, there are multiple "festivals" and "trail days" that take place.  Super.  Great.  Every year the list of infractions also gets bigger- so it doesn't look like one really has an effect on the other.

If we're honest with ourselves, it's not sustainable, and access will be cut off or severely restricted eventually as a result.  When that happens, I hope you blame the aforementioned responsible parties as much as you blame the gumbies.  

In case you haven't read it, here's just a hint of what's to come.  This list below, if you added in all the places that have been closed or restricted but don't make it to the list because they're not "destination" areas, the list would probably be five times as long.

Oh yay- "poop crisis"  - there's literally a "crisis" for human shit.  It's exceedingly easy to police your own feces, yet here we are having this conversation.  But hey, at least the stoke is high because climbing is going to be in the olympics.  Here's hoping the competitors learn to hand jam.

*HUG*

Cor wrote:Act now or forever hold your piece.

Now that I can get behind

I'm home at last!

don'tchuffonme wrote:

I'm close, but not over.  I say if you have a problem with the following, this thread is for you (and me):

I'm not bitter, nor hostile, nor a former climber, but I am over 50 and this list is completely brilliant.

Yeah, the shit thing is out of control.  Back when I was young enough to sometimes have an unpredictably timed need to shit, I had a quart sized yogurt container that I had taped up so I could clip it onto my pack.  I would use that thing when out cragging if the need arose and then carry everything out.  Really not difficult to do.  And now they have these wag bag things - no excuse for anyone.

Don'tchuff missed one of my pet peeves - the new generation of climbers who go climbing in strange places without a guidebook, or even a few pieces of paper printed out, and then wander around staring at their Mountain Project app on their phones.  Look, the MP routes database can be a useful tool AS A SUPPLEMENT to a guidebook, but it's not a substitute.  Last month I was standing at the base of Dike Route at Pywiak and two young people walked up, pointed up at Zee Tree and asked "Is that Holdless Horror"?  I was dumbfounded and thought it must be a joke (because you know, for one thing, Holdless Horror is an obvious crack route on a smallish dome and Zee Tree appears like a blank face on a much, much larger dome) but then I realized they were serious.  My partner gave them instructions to Dozier Dome.  The guy look chagrined and said, "it's kind of hard because all we have is the MP app."  I'm not trying to embarrass these particular people, they seemed quite nice, but you can buy 5-10 used guidebooks on Amazon for the price of one pair of fancy climbing pants.  

And I have not and will never see FreeSolo.  End rant.

Post apartheid separatism. 

Wag bags are the shit   
I like the Restop 2 bag, the seal really contains the smell. $48 for 12.

This thread is destined for greatness.

Eras mus wrote: Hi don'tchuffonme,

Brilliant list, I myself am old in a young man'ses bodiez. The lawn gets trampled cuz younguns weren't taught respect. And cuz at our advanced age arthritis in the hands keep us from punching someone, that and understanding gravity and consequence. I solemnly vow to only mentor non chuffers who stand on the porch for days waiting for a chance to be admitted to the club. And then, only if they have a recommendation from don'tchuffonme , Numsie or Tradiban, although I hear Tradi will help just about anyone, that guy's too religious.

Back on topic, Make Climbing Great Again. Which period? To steal from recently: when women could't vote or lynching was allowed? Or the only way you could climb full time was if you ate cat food and month old eggs for weeks. Or rope was hemp, you climbed in boots and nuts were steel and slung? I helped someone recently cuz they were about to hurt themselves, the thanks I got was a stare down. Next time I am filming and posting on youtube, that all may glory in millennial climbing prowess.

You sir, are a fraud. No self-respecting (and we are all VERY self-respecting)wanna be or actual climber over 50 will spell with false Z.

phylp wrote:

Don'tchuff missed one of my pet peeves - the new generation of climbers who go climbing in strange places without a guidebook, or even a few pieces of paper printed out, and then wander around staring at their Mountain Project app on their phones.  Look, the MP routes database can be a useful tool AS A SUPPLEMENT to a guidebook, but it's not a substitute.  Last month I was standing at the base of Dike Route at Pywiak and two young people walked up, pointed up at Zee Tree and asked "Is that Holdless Horror"?  I was dumbfounded and thought it must be a joke (because you know, for one thing, Holdless Horror is an obvious crack route on a smallish dome and Zee Tree appears like a blank face on a much, much larger dome) but then I realized they were serious.  My partner gave them instructions to Dozier Dome.  The guy look chagrined and said, "it's kind of hard because all we have is the MP app."  I'm not trying to embarrass these particular people, they seemed quite nice, but you can buy 5-10 used guidebooks on Amazon for the price of one pair of fancy climbing pants.  

Yeah, I totally agree about the guidebooks. I think some people are just too cheap to buy guidebooks and others don't know any better. Over the years, the requests come in to MP for sun aspect, long/lat coordinates, etc. And most of those requests have been met. But MP is no substitute for a guidebook.

don'tchuffonme wrote:

• Hammocks blocking the trail
• Hammocks, period

Seriously. 

Fuck you and your 20 year old back that can take an hour in a hammock without having to chase a bottle of motrin with a couple beers just to walk back to the car.

And leave your damn rescue dog at the house so we don't have to sit around and wonder what 5 breeds he/she is made up of. My designer labradoodle is much cuter and well behaved AND I left her at home.

When I beg for partners in the northern Utah and Idaho forum, MP tells me to post in the partner forum instead. There isn't one. Does this make me a snowflake, if this blatant, across the board, rejection brings tears to my eyes?

Uh, anyone wanna climb anywhere between City of Rocks and Maple canyon, around 9/30-10/2ish? Gotta have wifi 10/1.

Best, Helen

phylp wrote:

Don'tchuff missed one of my pet peeves - the new generation of climbers who go climbing in strange places without a guidebook, or even a few pieces of paper printed out, and then wander around staring at their Mountain Project app on their phones.  Look, the MP routes database can be a useful tool AS A SUPPLEMENT to a guidebook, but it's not a substitute.  Last month I was standing at the base of Dike Route at Pywiak and two young people walked up, pointed up at Zee Tree and asked "Is that Holdless Horror"?  I was dumbfounded and thought it must be a joke (because you know, for one thing, Holdless Horror is an obvious crack route on a smallish dome and Zee Tree appears like a blank face on a much, much larger dome) but then I realized they were serious.  My partner gave them instructions to Dozier Dome.  The guy look chagrined and said, "it's kind of hard because all we have is the MP app."  I'm not trying to embarrass these particular people, they seemed quite nice, but you can buy 5-10 used guidebooks on Amazon for the price of one pair of fancy climbing pants.  

My wife and I were hiking along Lumpy Ridge a couple of weeks ago, and we had the same experience with two different parties without a guidebook who were looking for routes. For one party I pointed out some of the obvious routes on the Book. The other party was looking for some shade (it really wasn’t that hot) and I suggested some routes on the east side of the Twin Owls. They had no sense of where the Twin Owls were or the climbs on it. I was tempted to steer them towards the Crack of Fear, but my wife intervened and prevented me from doing that, and I sent them to the more moderate routes on the east side of the formation.

don'tchuffonme wrote:

fact that areas are being run into the ground, erosion is increasing exponentially,

​Anyone using "exponentially" when a simpler and more accurate term is appropriate should be banned from posting on MP

Well... I was a little dubious when I clicked on this thread, I’ve stepped deep into e-shit on this site before, but...

God (or insert deity of choice) Bless Everyone who’s posted on this thread! Chuff- you especially made my day :)

I think that's the best post I've ever read on MP, Chuff. Well done.

i blame guidebooks

you give a gym/new climber the sharp end, tell them to scope a line and climb it, most will go running back to the gym

the few that don't get to stay on the lawn

but i only climb 4th so what do i know...