Hey everyone. I am exploring making a new cam removal tool and would like to get your opinion on something.
For context, I am a relatively new trad climber. I recently left a cam behind (BD X4 0.75) because it was too far and narrow into the crack for me to get my fingers to the trigger. I only had 1 nut tool and was unable to depress the thumb loop while pulling on the trigger as the stem would simply bend side to side. Yes there are other methods to remove this like using multiple nut tools, a quickdraw sling/spline, even water. I have no doubt someone more experienced or more persistent could have gotten it out but that is not the point.
My questions are: 1) Have you left a cam behind because you could not reach the release trigger? Not because it was over cammed. 2) Are there any specific tools out there that are designed for cam removal? Sure a nut tool can be used to remove a cam but I don't believe it was originally designed for it therefore it doesn't work in all the time, i.e. when you need to depress both triggers evenly. 3) If there was a specific tool designed for this purpose, would you use it?
Long Beta wrote:My questions are: 1) Have you left a cam behind because you could not reach the release trigger? Not because it was over cammed.
Yes. Usually this is only an issue for .75 and smaller cams. There isn't enough space in the crack to turn the nut tool and grab the triggers. The hooks on your device would have to be very small, or retractable.
2) Are there any specific tools out there that are designed for cam removal? Sure a nut tool can be used to remove a cam but I don't believe it was originally designed for it therefore it doesn't work in all the time, i.e. when you need to depress both triggers evenly.
3) If there was a specific tool designed for this purpose, would you use it?
No. There are dirt-cheap ways to make your own cam removal tool.
Another consideration is you need to pull the cam out. You can sometimes do this with the double nut tool method, but it can also lead to you pulling the cam to a flared/wider section, causing it to fall.
That crack did you a favor! x4 .75s are super floppy!
I've had success using the loop on the end of two nuts to get out a cam stuck like this. They're small enough to fit in pretty much any crack a cam will go in, added bonus of you're probably already carrying them around anyway.
Haven't happened to me so far. I did get booty on Cannon Cliff once using a nut tool & biner/sling - a .4 that was nudge pretty deep in a crack.
IMO it's not really worth it - it's not expensive but then it's yet another thing you have to lug around. If you don't burry cams in the cracks & extend most placement, this shouldn't happen much. And then for THE time where it will well loosing a piece every once in a while is part of the game.
Before you go inventing something, don't discount the idea of just learning to get a bit better at cleaning. There is an art to it, and patience and creativity are key. I tend to err towards over- rather than under-camming and if I had a cam for every time I've had to go back and retrieve something a partner declared stuck I'd have a rack... (Oh wait, I do!)
The tools that people have mentioned are enough to do the job. On a couple of very tightly stuck large cams, I have actually found that a tire iron is helpful to get the lobes moving (by twisting it between the lobe and the rock).
A few years ago, someone made a specialized tool: https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/107844812/cam-extractor It would handle cams that are out of reach with the conventional tools. It's not something I would buy, though, since I have only seen a few cams over the decades that I could not reach.
The DMM nutter was my first nut tool. The trigger hooks on the end managed to catch on everything and eventually it unclipped itself and I lost it. I did use it a few times to get cams out but these were likely shitty placements due to my inexperience. I’ve never been so happy to lose a piece of gear...
For really deep ones, you can link two nuts together. Put the nut each nut thru the loop of the other, making a sort of larks foot hitch /square knot, then slide one of the nuts down. Make two of them, one for each trigger.
slim
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Jul 10, 2019
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Unknown Hometown
· Joined Dec 2004
· Points: 1,093
1) in over 30 years of climbing i haven't lost a single cam under any circumstance, but i am picky about who i climb with. 2) glen is correct, the booty clapper is what you need. 3) see #2
Long Beta wrote: My questions are: 1) Have you left a cam behind because you could not reach the release trigger? Not because it was over cammed.
No. Never.
2) Are there any specific tools out there that are designed for cam removal? Sure a nut tool can be used to remove a cam but I don't believe it was originally designed for it therefore it doesn't work in all the time, i.e. when you need to depress both triggers evenly.
Yes, as others have mentioned.
3) If there was a specific tool designed for this purpose, would you use it?
No. Another pointless piece of non-essential stuff.
slim
·
Jul 11, 2019
·
Unknown Hometown
· Joined Dec 2004
· Points: 1,093
easy marc, do NOT discount the bootyclapper as essential equipment!!!
Does anyone have a link to the booty clapper? There is a cam that ended up walking back super far into a crack I am trying to retrieve so I am looking at different cam retrieval options.
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