lead rope solo free climbing, come down the rabbit hole with me.

I'm currently injured with a bulging disc at L5S1, so I currently have a fair bit of free time on my hands. Because of this, I went down a rabbit hole of watching videos about free climbing with a rope solo system, like ol' Petey Whittaker's monstrous rope solo free ascent of Freerider.

I've done a decent bit of aid rope soloing, but have always wondered about adjusting the system for free climbing. In this article, he seems to be suggesting using a microtrax to reduce issues with a heavy "spare" side of the rope, which is something I've never thought of before and seemed pretty cool. However, there are a few differences in his system (or similar systems), specifically backups, that I'm curious about.

• Presumedly he's using stopper knots that he isn't clipped into as a backup. Is this fucked? It seems slightly fucked, as there seems to be a lot of clearance between the drum of the silent partner and the housing, unless he's counting on the microtrax AND the knot getting all jammed up in there which also seems fucked.
• Whenever I've rope soloed I've always tied into the end of the rope to close the system, or used a continuous loop method to accomplish the same thing. He doesn't seem to worry about that, but is there some sort of stopper on the end? Wouldn't it get stuck if it got sucked into any crack or whatnot? Or is the end just free-snaking down there, and he's closing the system solely with stopper knots much closer?
• There's another video, perhaps more dubiously, that suggests using slip hitches as stopper knots, but for a modified grigri. This seems potentially even more fucked, but I'm not sure. Any thoughts?

I've soloed with both a SP and a modified grigri1, and have liked different things about them. Just wondering how to adapt it to free climbing without making it sketchier than it has to be.

People at the bleeding edge are probably willing to do things normal Joes aren’t.  I’ve done my share of free and aid rope soloing with an SP.    I use a clipped in backup knots and don’t worry about the rope end.  A bit of a pain while free climbing but so be it.   Works for me. The idea of using a caming device instead of a backup knot is beyond my required safety margin but to each their own.

"2. Did you use any back up system?

No. I didn’t tie a knot in the end of the rope and I didn’t use back up loops clipped back to my harness. The knot in the end of the rope had a risk of getting caught way below me. The backup loops took too much time and energy to be dealing with when free climbing. "

https://www.facebook.com/notes/five-ten/rope-solo-q-a-with-pete-whittaker/10154815758039130/

Healyje will be along here soon to tell you he doesn't use backup knots, and he has inspired many neophytes to do the same.

I too use one backup knot tied 30 feet or so from the device (Silent Partner). I cannot fathom not doing so. There is way too much that could go askew.

I won't pretend to be an expert, but the notion that an unclipped knot will somehow jam and save you is pure fantasy IMHO. There have been incidents of people rapping off of the ends of their lines after having their "stopper knots" shoot through their belay devices.

I would really recommend the book by Andy Kirkpatrick, "Me, Myself, and I" which totally deconstructs roped lead solo.

Cheers from Osaka,

john 

John,

I have the Kirkpatrick book, it's excellent. When I wrote the original post I didn't have my SP with me to play with, but now I do. It seems like the stopper knot would get caught in the clove, not the housing, which actually seems somewhat reasonable, in a sketchy rope solo sort of way. Still seems spooky to not be tied in.

Darin,

The microtrax is for keeping the weight down on the silent partner, not as a backup.

Unless I'm remembering the incident incorrectly, Tom Randall's Exploding Grigri Incident (TM) on El Cap wouldn't've been survivable with just a jamming knot.

But as Darin said, normal Joes versus cutting edge..

Everett wrote: Unless I'm remembering the incident incorrectly, Tom Randall's Exploding Grigri Incident (TM) on El Cap wouldn't've been survivable with just a jamming knot.

But as Darin said, normal Joes versus cutting edge..

His GriGri didn’t fail; the locker it was attached to cross loaded and failed in a factor 2 fall. Lesson: don’t trust the whole system to one locker. 

You are already on the good path seeing that each device/system has its benefits.  If you are going to lead solo, go up some easy routes and test the system with safety in mind. When you find what you like then increase the difficulty.
I don't use backup knots and have not needed them (which probably is why I don't). I use a quick-link as opposed to a biner.
Whether I pack the rope or let it hang depends on the weather and route. I am not a fan of packing rope unless its alpine or a wandering route.
Darin nailed it though, even if i have seen the safest way to do it I'm still going to do it my way, but I do try others methods that i see out there or even on here.

Just for some more data collection I'll include my system since I'm using the matt hunter slip knot backups as you mention above. I use a modified grigri on a steel locker clipped up to a chest harness with a thin cord and cheapo biner designed to break in a fall. Rope stacked in a backpack with an overhand at the end on the bottom and another in the middle of the rope, slip knots the rest of the way every 10-15 arm lengths depending on route. It's important to note here that you must be certain on which direction you tie the slip not or you'll definitely die, and I'm not gonna try to describe it on here so be damn certain. Only thing I'd add is that stories like the one above make me want to consider finding a way to actually clip in with a backup knot rather than using it to jam the grigri, but I'm assuming that won't work with the rope stacked in a backpack. 

Dan Horseman wrote: Just for some more data collection I'll include my system since I'm using the matt hunter slip knot backups as you mention above. I use a modified grigri on a steel locker clipped up to a chest harness with a thin cord and cheapo biner designed to break in a fall. Rope stacked in a backpack with an overhand at the end on the bottom and another in the middle of the rope, slip knots the rest of the way every 10-15 arm lengths depending on route. It's important to note here that you must be certain on which direction you tie the slip not or you'll definitely die, and I'm not gonna try to describe it on here so be damn certain. Only thing I'd add is that stories like the one above make me want to consider finding a way to actually clip in with a backup knot rather than using it to jam the grigri, but I'm assuming that won't work with the rope stacked in a backpack. 

There's bunches of ways to have a backpack and actual backup knots.

Everett wrote:

There's bunches of ways to have a backpack and actual backup knots.

Care to elaborate? I can only imagine that you end up with half of the rope hanging below you in a loop?

Everett wrote: Unless I'm remembering the incident incorrectly, Tom Randall's Exploding Grigri Incident (TM) on El Cap wouldn't've been survivable with just a jamming knot.

JCM wrote:
His GriGri didn’t fail; the locker it was attached to cross loaded and failed in a factor 2 fall. Lesson: don’t trust the whole system to one locker.

Man! This story comes up so often!! Thanks for including the climbers name so I could actually track down the accident report!

http://publications.americanalpineclub.org/articles/13200305300/Fall-on-Rock-Inadequate-Protection-Inadequate-Clothing-and-Equipment-Weather

I’ve heard many different accounts of what happened- including that he was using a Belay Master Biner- interesting to read that the biner was missing the plastic piece that keeps it from cross loading... so basically he was on a regular biner..

“The Belay Master is normally equipped with a plastic guard that prevents cross-loading the ’biner, by separating the harness and the Grigri. But the guard on mine had been stolen so I had decided to go without one.”

More on it here for anyone who is interested:http://www.rockclimbing.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=169777

Reading this account actually increases my confidence in the GriGri system especially when used with a Gridlock Biner or other functioning anti-crossload biner 

A steel quick link is very confidence inspiring for attaching the GriGri, and not too much extra hassle compared to a locker.

I think Tom mentioned that the belay master was missing the plastic bit...I recently saw one of these biners and it seemed that the grigir could get caught where the plastic bit goes and then would be cross loaded...I wonder if this contributed to the exploding biner

JCM wrote: A steel quick link is very confidence inspiring for attaching the GriGri, and not too much extra hassle compared to a locker.

I’ll have to check to confirm- but I think my Belay Loop is too wide to fit in a properly oriented quick link 

Quinn Hatfield wrote:

I’ll have to check to confirm- but I think my Belay Loop is too wide to fit in a properly oriented quick link 

Quick links come in all shapes and sizes. A tri-axial quick link would be expected to fit prett much any size belay loop. I've heard that some people like those for this application. They are harder to cross load, since they're meant for multiple directions anyway.

I just use the basic oval shape, but my harness has a fairly narrow belay loop. The opening of the quick link I use is a hair too narrow for both plates of the GriGri attachment point to pass through at once, so I do a thing where one side of the Grigri goes in first, and the other half passes through a second later to close the GriGri. Hard to explain, but really easy to do. Again, using the quick link creates a marginal extra level of nuisance compared to a locker, but the extra piece of mind is worth it. And the anti-crossload biners are kind of a nuisance anyway, so the quick link isn't much worse.

I got the Petzl Delta quick link for soloing but the opening is too small for the Grigri. null

I use a steel locker: 40kN in the main axis and 15kN crossload axis.  The rubber piece also keeps things oriented properly.  With this setup, I feel very comfortable just using jamming knots as my backup.  I know it looks like looping the biner through the two tie in points of the harness loads the biner in multiple directions, but in reality once it's weighted both harness loops go to the bottom and it gets loaded just fine.

^^^ Any tips/info on drilling the hole in the GriGri side plate for attaching to the chest harness? What size/type drill bit? How hard was it to do?

Sam Skovgaard wrote:

I use a steel locker: 40kN in the main axis and 15kN crossload axis.  The rubber piece also keeps things oriented properly.  With this setup, I feel very comfortable just using jamming knots as my backup.  I know it looks like looping the biner through the two tie in points of the harness loads the biner in multiple directions, but in reality once it's weighted both harness loops go to the bottom and it gets loaded just fine.

Hey that’s the same steel locker I’m using. Heavy, but instills confidence! Can you show me your cord loop on the grigri for orientation? Did you drill a hole to attach it?

Originally, I had just drilled two holes right next to each other through the plastic, but that ripped through forming that one elongated hole in the plastic you see now.  Then I drilled the metal,  which was quite easy.

Obviously, drilling through the metal components of your belay device is not something to undertake lightly, and I can't guarantee that this is safe or wise.

But then again, we are talking about lead rope soloing, so "safe" has a different meaning in the context of this discussion.  All of this is inherently risky and deciding what safety margins are acceptable to you is a very personal decision.