Chicken clipping ice tools fail?

I was wondering if people who chicken clip the eye holes on the bottom on their tools to hold body weight is rated for that. I have the Cassin X-dreams. 

Alex Langfield wrote: I was wondering if people who chicken clip the eye holes on the bottom on their tools to hold body weight is rated for that. I have the Cassin X-dreams. 

No. You take the rope and toss it over your tool if you're going to do that, and have your partner take.

DrRockso wrote:

No. You take the rope and toss it over your tool if you're going to do that, and have your partner take.

I guess you don't have much of a bevel on top of your pick to slice the rope.  Bad idea.

Prefer throwing it over the bottom finger rest/pommel on X-Dreams...beefy enough and not running over a steel edge...

Skibo wrote:

I guess you don't have much of a bevel on top of your pick to slice the rope.  Bad idea.

The sharp part is in the ice or you're doing it wrong ;). 

Well, I don't have CAMPs like the OP or those BDs, but you couldn't bury a Petzl pick enough to make that reasonable, the edge is sharp all the way to the head. I can't imagine it's a good idea in any case.

DrRockso wrote:

Lovely drawing, but absolutely not. You put the rope over the pinky rest / handle. PLEASE DONT DO THIS. 10/10 art though, would enjoy again.

Alex Langfield wrote: I was wondering if people who chicken clip the eye holes on the bottom on their tools to hold body weight is rated for that. I have the Cassin X-dreams. 

Also yes if you clipped the eyehole on an x dream it will hold body weight. 

I guess your YMMV, people have been doing it the way I described for years and it hasn't cut the rope yet. 

DrRockso wrote: I guess your YMMV, people have been doing it the way I described for years and it hasn't cut the rope yet. 

I was also just thinking of the lever action, but yes, I guess if you're gonna peel do what you can.

There are many options for chicken clipping. For many years climbers would keep a cliffhanger or fifihook tied to their harness that could be quickly deployed, hooking it to their leashes or a loop on the spike. Flipping the rope over the head of the tool is also common. Tools with std hammer or adze are fine as they will prevent the rope from slipping off. Tools sans a hammer or adze are more problematic. The sharp edge on picks is not going to slice the rope. However, the edge is sharp enough that when the rope goes taunt that it will rake the sheath which could damage it. 

jdejace wrote: Well, I don't have CAMPs like the OP or those BDs, but you couldn't bury a Petzl pick enough to make that reasonable, the edge is sharp all the way to the head. I can't imagine it's a good idea in any case.

Same with the Trango Raptors.

I can't tell if you're all being serious or not.. The blade top is pretty sharp and I don't think I'd trust it. I've looked online at the specs for the x-dream hole at the bottom and it looks super solid but I can't find anywhere about how it's rated. I had a guy tell me it's not good to clip into those for body weight. And I'm not sure I believe him. Been doing it for years with my quarks not problems ever. 

The new Petzl Nomics have ratings and specified resting techniques in the provided paper work.

P.S. 150 daN = 337 lbf

This has come up previously with regards to the pommel spike on vipers. If I recall correctly I think a BD rep, or someone in the know, said it was considerably burly and could tolerate bodyweight without issue. Can anyone confirm or deny my memory on that?

I'm curious if the pommel spike on the Alpine x-dream can tolerate that as well, if not are the eyeholes in the grip big enough for a biner? I know the regular x dreams don't have the spike so the option is limited. 

Similarly is it ever practiced to build an anchor on easy terrain with two tools and skip screws? For example - top out a pitch of WI2-3 on a large stance where you wouldn't need an anchor or protection to comfortably move or belay the next pitch. Fire in both tools shaft deep and clip the head holes, grip holes, or pommel spikes, and sling them accordingly to bring up the second in guidemode - keeping the anchor load down.

Keeping out the idea of the leader falling off the next pitch and dragging the party down the whole flow before placing a few screws - what does everyone think of the tools function in that scenario?

Can confirm I've hung on the bottom hole of the orange vipers. Seemed solid. I'd grade it C2 max.

Jon L wrote: The new Petzl Nomics have ratings and specified resting techniques in the provided paper work.

P.S. 150 daN = 337 lbf

Interesting. That's a Quark in the pics, I think the spike is part of the handle whereas on the Nomic it's just part of the little plastic bottom griprest that is held on by a tiny bolt. 

Also interesting they specifically recommend against clipping the hole in the head. I think with the carabiner behind the tool like in the pic and the climber leaning away it's obviously a bad idea because it can pull away from the ice and rotate the head, but with a quickdraw between the tool and the ice and the load more downward it seems reasonable? Not that different from a pecker. 

Jamie Severini wrote: This has come up previously with regards to the pommel spike on vipers. If I recall correctly I think a BD rep, or someone in the know, said it was considerably burly and could tolerate bodyweight without issue. Can anyone confirm or deny my memory on that?

https://kellycordes.com/2013/01/06/chicken-clip-ice-pro-pointer/

jdejace wrote:

Interesting. That's a Quark in the pics, I think the spike is part of the handle whereas on the Nomic it's just part of the little plastic bottom griprest that is held on by a tiny bolt. 

Also interesting they specifically recommend against clipping the hole in the head. I think with the carabiner behind the tool like in the pic and the climber leaning away it's obviously a bad idea because it can pull away from the ice and rotate the head, but with a quickdraw between the tool and the ice and the load more downward it seems reasonable? Not that different from a pecker. 

Very different from a pecker, a pecker has a shape similar to an ice tool clipped from the bottom. Levers.

https://uiaa-web.azureedge.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/UIAA152-Ice-tools_2.jpg