Sasha article on body image

Pretty good, I thought. You don't have to be an elite athlete to face the need to accept the body you inhabit. That's what you have to work with.

And sheesh. Is there anyone out there who can easily find clothes that fit? I admit, it caught me totally off guard when the arms in tshirts started getting tight. Holy crap! I got muscles I didn't know I owned!

It's extremely satisfying, and frustrating, I admit, this new thing, a climbers body.

Best, OLH

Geez. Sorry guys, got the link on there now..

Best, OLH

s.price wrote: Good read. Thanks OLH.

Stickers on the way:)

Oh yay!!!

Frustrating to have muscles?   Come on.

Russ Keane wrote: Frustrating to have muscles?   Come on.

Frustrating to shop for clothing when you have muscles.  

Russ Keane wrote: Frustrating to have muscles?   Come on.

Frustrating to have failing knees, just when I find a passion (for the first time in my life) that involves athleticism. Like I said, the body we are issued is what we have to work with. The muscles showing up are pure delight!

Best, Helen

Russ Keane wrote: Frustrating to have muscles?   Come on.

Frustrating to find clothes that accommodate the muscles, and look good. I haven't found a tailored shirt/blouse that fits me in a very long time. Thank god for knits and working in a place where t-shirts are just fine to wear under lab coats.

Old lady H wrote: 
And sheesh. Is there anyone out there who can easily find clothes that fit? I admit, it caught me totally off guard when the arms in tshirts started getting tight. Holy crap! I got muscles I didn't know I owned!

It's extremely satisfying, and frustrating, I admit, this new thing, a climbers body.

Best, OLH

Try heavy back squats and deadlifts for a while and get back to me about clothes fitting.

Thanks for mansplaining clothes fitting. I was worried there for a second....

right, because getting your clothes tailored is how humanity does it...more privileged mansplaining...

Next you will tell us how easy it is for you to fit jeans as a man when there are 4 different pelvis types in female Homo Sapiens. Males have one.

Guess what, boys? You don't know anything about how much harder it is for women to get clothes that fit.

t.farrell wrote: It’s a shame that this mentality exists. Companies use just a handful of fit models and somehow this idea is misconstrued as how everyone ought to be.

Fit models in America typically reflect “average” build especially when you look at brands whose customer is the average person and not a specialty market (ie, outdoor clothing, etc). Either way, people come in all shapes and sizes. There’s such a huge variation. I don’t know why anyone would expect something to fit them perfectly off the rack when there’s such incredible diversity. I honestly would think it’s super weird if anything fit truly perfectly. It’s just not practical for a company to make a size for every body type. That’s why tailors exist. 
I know she touched on other issues but it all seemed to boil down to her clothes not fitting, which is an easy fix....

I think the article was more about trying to break the mentality of "clothes don't fit -> therefore there is something wrong with me (too fat, too skinny, the shoulders are too big, the boobs are too small, the hips are too wide/narrow, the butt is too big/flat/small, the hands are ugly, etc. etc.)", rather than just about clothes not fitting.

Edited to add, while I agree that it is ridiculous to think that way, I can also relate. The only time I have looked at my hands and thought "ugly" was when I tried to put on rings. That's when you notice the lack of manicure, the calluses, the beat-up knuckles. And it is something that society reinforces, "man hands" is a negative thing for a woman. My Mom certainly likes to talk about how I used to have such pretty hands, and I ruined them by climbing... so it takes mental effort to counter such narratives. And you usually get confronted with it more specifically when you are trying on something.

Lol, on clothes, eh? My best friend is a big guy, who has to workout to stay in shape. Every pair of pants for work has to go to the tailor.

Me, I just buy whatever, used, and live with it. Kinda never any good at the clothes, hair, nails type stuff.

For a red carpet event? Yeah, she probably did get a dress altered. I think it's more what we are staring at in the mirror. Most every woman I know (maybe the men too, but they aren't talking about it??) isn't particularly happy with her looks, just....we have what we have. Even women who are subjectively gorgeous by most people's reckoning. Saddest of all is when kids feel they need to be something...else. Boys and girls both, of course. 

"Old" is another part of it. That's getting better, sorta, but people in their 60s plus aren't in many ad campaigns for anything besides pharma, sheesh!! That's really stupid, considering how much money boomers have, and our complete refusal to grow up!

Climbing is such a great pursuit, and I am Soo glad I stumbled into it. Yeah, there may be other things like it to ignite passions, but boy, this is IT, for me. I feel like "climber" is what I am, and it just took most of my lifetime to discover that.

Best all, you are all hotter than hell, to my eyes! ;-) Helen 

I'm a totally ugly bastard.

Own it.

OLH it's kinda funny that you are taking the notion of getting into good shape and using it as a means to say something "profound" on the internet.   Give me a break.  You're climbing, getting good tone and muscles, and this relates to body image issues?   There's nothing but positive vibes to people being fit.    Find some more athletic clothing for gods sake.   Body image issues in women are so much different than worrying about your t-shirt being too tight because of your awesome guns.

I really liked her writing about how great it was to be in with all those lady athletes, at a dress up event. Those ladies, in formal gowns? Man, those pics are what we need to see more of also!

Best, OLH

JSH wrote:

Try being a woman (just that alone! never mind muscles!) and get back to me about clothes fitting.

Fair enough! I can't speak for anyone elses experience, only my own, but I know the only clothes, especially pants and jackets, that fit me are tailored. 

Normally I say "this thread is a mess" but in this case "some of the bros posting on this thread are a mess." 

Russ Keane wrote: OLH it's kinda funny that you are taking the notion of getting into good shape and using it as a means to say something "profound" on the internet.   Give me a break.  You're climbing, getting good tone and muscles, and this relates to body image issues?   There's nothing but positive vibes to people being fit.    Find some more athletic clothing for gods sake.   Body image issues in women are so much different that worrying about your t-shirt being too tight because of your awesome guns.

Russ? You clearly missed the "first time in my life" part. I've lost close to 30% of my body weight in recent years. You bet I'm still adjusting to it. Laugh all you want, one of the "scariest" things I've done, is the first time I wore yoga type tights to the gym, to climb in. Again, later, my first sports bra, and a skimpy tank top. My first swim suit purchase in 20 years was about a month ago. Not an "old lady" one, either.

This is all in just the last half year, the clothes part. I am in a body I never knew existed. Every week I discover some "new" bone or muscle poking out, and it astonishes me!

I post this, because I know I am not remotely alone in it, and I hope others are encouraged, too.

Best, Helen

Russ Keane wrote: OLH it's kinda funny that you are taking the notion of getting into good shape and using it as a means to say something "profound" on the internet.   Give me a break.  You're climbing, getting good tone and muscles, and this relates to body image issues?   There's nothing but positive vibes to people being fit.    Find some more athletic clothing for gods sake.   Body image issues in women are so much different than worrying about your t-shirt being too tight because of your awesome guns.

I think the point is that societal norms for men and women are different in a way that can be hard for female athletes.  Having an overdeveloped upper body like Alex Puccio is not classically seen as attractive, whereas this would be a plus for men.

Guys still have the right to complain on this issue. It might be unfair that women are expected to wear things more figure fitting than males, but we struggle finding clothes that look good too! Suits have to be tailored for me or its just nonsense. I'm sorry we can get away with poor fitting clothes because we're not judged as harshly on body image ... but we still struggle when we wanna find something that fits well.   We just get away with being judged on an unfair scale compared to females.

I blame all the fat nonathletic Americans because companies have to cater to those demographics.  

do you think in the future an ugly guy will be able to complain about how he has to dress up and be expected to look good when he knows his facial features and grooming style are not classically attractive and he fears judgement on this?    one can dream .... 

Ted Pinson wrote:

Having an overdeveloped upper body like Alex Puccio is not classically seen as attractive, whereas this would be a plus for men.

Lol. Alex has a developed upper body, saying "overdeveloped" adds nothing to the argument while including a perpetuation of the negative gendered aspects of the beauty myth. 

Perhaps you meant "Having a upper body like Alex Puccio that would be considered overdeveloped by those adhering to gendered norms of what is classically attractive..."?

I'll stop my virtue signalling now and see myself out.