When do you say something at the gym/crag?

It's kinda a "duh" question. Make an adult judgement and say something if need be.

There’s so many sorry ass belays be given these days.. We keep walking until there’s no one around doing dumb shit. The hour or two hike is worth it.

When I see some bogus stuff going down I usually say something to the climber like...

“Do you know your belayer is trying to kill you”

“Looks like you clipped the rope wrong- have you ever climbed before?”

OR I say something to my partner like...

“Let’s amscray before someone gets killed, we don’t want to fill out the paperwork again.”

Always trying to be helpful.
  
Always!

When Im surfing and there comes a kook longboarder with his girlfriend right over the most shallow part of the reef, I no say nattin cuz the guy will fully assume I'm trying to alpha him in front of his girlfriend. That would be far more painful to him than scraping some reef. Maybe even dying even.

Hey Clay, can I borrow your credit card for a bit?

Aaron Livingston wrote: It's not so much about when to say something as it is about HOW to say something. Be courteous, don't be accusatory, and don't act like gods gift to climbing when informing someone of a mistake you believe they are making. We were all new at one time or another.

That can work. The problem is some people , like myself, are not cut out for approaching folks and saying things nicely. Maybe its my face, maybe its my background in construction, maybe both but my experience in trying to "help" people does not always go smooth. Another problem is that many n00bs think they are Gods gift already, especially the n00b pack leaders.

T Roper wrote:

That can work. The problem is some people , like myself, are not cut out for approaching folks and saying things nicely. Maybe its my face, maybe its my background in construction, maybe both but my experience in trying to "help" people does not always go smooth. Another problem is that many n00bs think they are Gods gift already, especially the n00b pack leaders.

That construction comment...

Walk up and tell that "apprentice" that his belay looks like "dog shit", both laugh hysterically for a minute and then the apprentice fixes it immediately.

Tradiban wrote:

That construction comment...

Walk up and tell that "apprentice" that his belay looks like "dog shit", both laugh hysterically for a minute and then the apprentice fixes it immediately.

my go to is to just start screaming like a psycho off his meds so even a relaxed and nice form of this seems to be too much for some people. I try sometimes usually with no success. 

Hell, the guy who almost landed on our climbing party that day had been warned to not descend the way he was going and he ignored good advice and took a grounder. Darwin had many good points. 

All the time outdoors. Indoors less so.
Everyone I've said something to outdoors has been super cordial and grateful, whereas indoors you'll get a stupid amount of brodudes with fragile egos. unless there's a clear danger to the people around them, it's probably best to just leave the A-types alone

T Roper wrote:

 Another problem is that many n00bs think they are Gods gift already, especially the n00b pack leaders.

 Wow.. I witnessed a noob pack leader last night. That’s a pretty good name for them.

T Roper wrote:

That can work. The problem is some people , like myself, are not cut out for approaching folks and saying things nicely. Maybe its my face, maybe its my background in construction, maybe both but my experience in trying to "help" people does not always go smooth. Another problem is that many n00bs think they are Gods gift already, especially the n00b pack leaders.

Hahaha! Must be your face for sure.

I've had very good reception when I choose to say something. I can think of only couple cases where the people were not receptive and rude. But I think it is because I am generally friendly. if someone walks in and I am climbing, or if I walk in and someone is already at the crag, I generally say hello. A lot of times people might be looking at the guidebook trying to figure out where they are, and I would offer help. or there might be a polite chitchat along the lines of 'Where are you guys from?" or "those are my draws, but feel free to jump on."  So it sort of establishes friendliness before there is ever a need to make some kind of a suggestion/correction/comment. And most of the time, of course, there is no need to correct anyone. But if I do want to say something, it doesn't come out of the blue, KWIM? And it is better received.

Wrote this up in "Unbelayvable"  in Climbing Mag one time.
Found a person getting ready to clean one time and going direct to anchor from her gear loop.
Her crew was trying to direct instructions up to her from 70' below on the ground.
Spoke up.  Stopped her.  Asked if the adjacent climber (also at a set of anchors) could guide her thru cleaning.
She was grateful.

It feels good to help someone who is thankful.
Also, I've been on site of severe injuries and rescues.
It doesn't feel so good watching someone almost die.

The other day someone at the gym told me I was spilling chalk everywhere while I belayed. Thusly how I learned to either cinch or take off my chalk bag before belaying.

If it's someone that seems like a beginner but is clearly trying, I'd say tell them politely if they're doing something pretty wrong/bad etiquette. How else will they know?

T Roper wrote:

That can work. The problem is some people , like myself, are not cut out for approaching folks and saying things nicely. Maybe its my face, maybe its my background in construction, maybe both but my experience in trying to "help" people does not always go smooth. Another problem is that many n00bs think they are Gods gift already, especially the n00b pack leaders.

This strikes true for me. If I see something. And if I say something. I tend to be more concerned with communicating information than preserving someone's feelings. 

Hell at the gym my belay partner told me I stepped on someone's foot on the way over to the wall in a crowded area of the gym this week. Not realizing I had done so I told the guy he was standing too far away from the wall and that he could avoid being stepped on by not being too far from the wall as people are trying to get past. This might make me sound like a horrible person but it's no different than blocking a trail outside and it's a bad habit to belay from so far from the wall.

Lena chita wrote:

Hahaha! Must be your face for sure.

I dont think its possible for me to wipe the "WHAT THE FUK ARE YOU DOING" look off my face, its a muscle memory thing.

Tradiban wrote: It's kinda a "duh" question. Make an adult judgement and say something if need be.

You did like 35-37 sketchy things at the gym when we climped, but I kept m'mouth shut

Tomily ma wrote:At a crag, I told someone i did t think it was a good idea to climb a mixed route with only one cam (his only cam) even though his friend told him he thought it was the right size.  He told me it was an easy route for him because he climbs 5.10 in the gym. I said then you might as well free solo it. This guy was pissed I got in his business, but I didn’t want to clean blood off my stuff... 

I mean, if it was an easy route that only needs one cam I probably would've been a bit prickly about someone telling me to take an entire rack too.  

physnchips wrote: I saw an elderly lady climbing way off route on an autobelay, and I told her that she should probably come down because the swing would be really bad, break a bone or something. She was grateful. She didn’t know and just wanted to try another route, kind of sad and lonely experience that she felt limited to an autobelay. Glad I said something to keep her safe, gave her a belay on the route so she could try.

I'm another sad, lonely elderly lady who sometimes autobelays. Maybe my husband couldn't belay me that day, maybe my friends weren't around, maybe I just decided to go climb by myself. Anyway, it was nice of you to warn her about the danger and offer a belay. Personally, I don't accept belays from someone unless I've at least observed them and am confident that they're competent belayers. Otherwise, I feel safer on an autobelay.

And, seriously, you probably see lots of younger climbers using the autobelays and don't think they're having a sad and lonely experience. I don't know how she was feeling, but I think it's cool that she was getting out on her own.

Sometimes a situation is just so f**ked up that it requires some tough love. I was up at T-Wall in '98 or so (yes, this is not a new problem), when a couple of kids, brothers, (17, 18 something like that) show up spraying about how they're driving from CO to FL for some family thing, they climb 11+ in the gym and sport climbs at Table Mt., heard about T-wall, thought they'd check it out, and BTW, where are the bolts? There were a few bolted lines then, but my partner and I say, "guys, you need a rack to climb here." they look at each other and leave.

A few hours later they're back. Seems they had daddy's credit card with them, so they went into Chattanooga and bought a spiffy new rack. All cams, no nuts. Ooookay. The older brother starts up Golden Locks, a classic, splitter 5.8 hand crack ( I guess they call getting off the ground 9 now). It's terrifying to watch, teetering, wailing, fumbling with gear. He makes it to the top without falling, thankfully. Younger brother can't get off the ground. Brother on top is totally nonplussed about how to rappel and clean (fortunately). I say, 'ok, I'll clean it for you'.

This is horrifying, tipped out cams, umbrellad cams, cams shoved in with the stems (still rigid stemmed Friends in those days) sticking straight up. I seriously doubted a single piece would have held a fall. You would think any idiot could protect a splitter, but apparently not. I get to the top and the 'anchor' is a sling around a 1.5" pine sapling, (brown and clearly dead for some time) and a cam shoved under a loose detached block. I calmly clean the 'anchor' for him, guide him over to the rap tree, and closely monitor his every move until we are safe on the ground.

Then I lit in to both of them. "You don't have any f**king idea what you're doing, and you need to get the f**k out of here and not come back until you do, cause you're going to kill yourselves or worse kill someone else.' (like me, I wasn't worried about falling on the climb, I'd soloed it before, which is why I let myself get in the situation in the first place. But still, s**t happens). 'And I'm not up for a f**king body recovery today.'

They slunk off. I'm sure they later rationalized that I was a world class a**hole, after all, they climb 11+. But I didn't feel bad about it and still don't. I hope it saved their damn fool lives.