Do you stick clip? Why or why not?

I rarely use any lingo besides send/sent/sending and clean, its easier that way.

dont you bros just send shit?

An interesting bit from http://eveningsends.com/adam-ondra-and-pre-clipping/

"Chax Raxi starts out on a 30-foot blank face that contains a V14 boulder problem crux. Sharma had originally envisioned stick clipping a high first bolt due to how difficult the first 30 feet are, but Ondra wanted to climb the route from the ground, sans any pre-clipped bolts."

It seems some route setters want you to stick clip the first bolt.

dino74 wrote: It seems some route setters want you to stick clip the first bolt.

Most (local) sports routes bolted recently have the 1st bolt place with a stick clip in mind.

So many things have changed since I returned to climbing after 20 year break. We would push ourselves on TR and lead on lower grades. Stick clipping is just a TR until you feel safe at the first bolt. Safety is great. And you have just completed a "mixed route" of TR+sport. Other options: place some pro and do a mixed route of trad+sport or work up to that grade in the gym/easier climbs and then do it as straight sport.

Paul Deger wrote:

So many things have changed since I returned to climbing after 20 year break. We would push ourselves on TR and lead on lower grades. Stick clipping is just a TR until you feel safe at the first bolt. Safety is great. And you have just completed a "mixed route" of TR+sport. Other options: place some pro and do a mixed route of trad+sport or work up to that grade in the gym/easier climbs and then do it as straight sport.

Have you read all 23 pages of this thread? 

Yes, a lot has changed in the 20 years you've been away, yet you're completely missing the point of stick clips - and the intended intentional use by the route developer - and applying a 20 year old viewpoint that is now totally outdated. 

People, including us, were sticking in Rifle in the early 90s...so, more than 25 years ago?

Marc801 C wrote:

Have you read all 23 pages of this thread? 

Yes, a lot has changed in the 20 years you've been away, yet you're completely missing the point of stick clips - and the intended intentional use by the route developer - and applying a 20 year old viewpoint that is now totally outdated. 

bit fucking harsh m8.

Marc801 C wrote:

Have you read all 23 pages of this thread? 

Yes, a lot has changed in the 20 years you've been away, yet you're completely missing the point of stick clips - and the intended intentional use by the route developer - and applying a 20 year old viewpoint that is now totally outdated. 

I failed to acknowledge I did not read 23 pages (call me lazy) and recognize the value/safety of stick clipping - and by definition it is TR until you reach the clipped bolt. 

This may have covered in the past 23 pages, but why does a route developer not place a lower #1 bolt - isn't that the safest option?

Paul Deger wrote:

I failed to acknowledge I did not read 23 pages (call me lazy) and recognize the value/safety of stick clipping - and by definition it is TR until you reach the clipped bolt. 

Same as clipping a bolt above your head is by definition a TR.

Jason Todd wrote:

Same as clipping a bolt above your head is by definition a TR.

Great point! now I see how this went 23 pages! I better quit while I am already behind!

"Most (local) sports routes bolted recently have the 1st bolt place with a stick clip in mind."

Yeah, for 5.12 and up.   Give me a break-  If we are stick clipping 5.8's we have really sunk to a new low.

Russ Keane wrote:

"Most (local) sports routes bolted recently have the 1st bolt place with a stick clip in mind."

Yeah, for 5.12 and up.   Give me a break-  If we are stick clipping 5.8's we have really sunk to a new low.

I don't know about 5.8's needing a stick, but I've certainly done 10d routes that had 10b moves before the first bolt, which was intentionally placed by the developer at ~15+' with stick clipping expected since the landing zone was littered with boulders.

Paul Deger wrote:

This may have covered in the past 23 pages, but why does a route developer not place a lower #1 bolt - isn't that the safest option?

NO! A low first bolt is essentially useless as it protects basically a single step up - iow, you clip, you step up once, and instantly you're in ground fall range again. 

The other consideration is the cost of bolts and hangers.

Yes, both of these points were covered earlier, several times.

BrianWS · Sep 16, 2013 · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2010 · Points: 790

It's pretty clear why would one use a stick to protect high, occasionally cruxy moves to the first bolt. As another poster mentioned, climb enough lines harder than 5.11 in the SE (or any sport-heavy crag for that matter), and you will come across many many climbs with first bolt well off the deck and with movement at or near the overall grade going to it.

Russ Keane wrote:

"Most (local) sports routes bolted recently have the 1st bolt place with a stick clip in mind."

Yeah, for 5.12 and up.   Give me a break-  If we are stick clipping 5.8's we have really sunk to a new low.

No, not really. How can you speak to every route, every climber, at every location, in every circumstance?

And yes, I'm the weenie who wants a rope on fourth class. "Don't fall" sure, but as my only defense against certain injury? Why bother with a rope or belayer at all? 

Best, OLH

If it's a big deal to someone id say they're climbing for the wrong reasons it's sport climbing no one cares. I'd feel pretty stupid if I broke both my ankles or busted my ass and was out for the season because I did not stick clip a first bolt on a climb. 

I think it's courteous after hanging the draws to leave the rope through the first and if the climber does not want it they will pull the rope themselves and lead it.

Also stick clipping is a great idea at the end of the day when your getting tired as we all now accident usually happen towards the end of the day

The rate of a climb has absolutely nothing to do with the landing area if one peals by accident, which all falls are basically accidental.  Since when does it make a climber lesser of a climber for being safe?

Eyes open and lessons learned!

I think to stick clip on a sports route or not comes down to one's comfort level at the base of a climb.  I tend to stick clip less at my "home" crag of Rumney but more while I am on the road, be it NRG, RRG, or parts of CO.  Also, some routes down at RRG have a HIGH first bolt which is meant to be stick clipped.

If there are hard or insecure moves before or at the 1st bolt, I will stick clip the rope, regardless of grade or location.  

One variation of of the stick clip that I have done for routes which have a steep start and initially climb sideways is to clip the first 2 draws, but not the rope, to the bolts.  This makes for easier rope management between the climber and belayer (rope not pre clipped) but still gives the climber expediency moving thru the first two bolts.  It won't prevent  a busted ankle if the climber were to fall before clipping the rope but it does reduce that risk somewhat.  I just did this on Bullwinkle Crater.  Years ago, I also pre hung the 2nd and 3rd draws with a stick on Cereal Killer and only stick clipped rope to the 1st bolt.  I may pre hang the first two draws on Peer Pressure too the next time I climb it.  Note that all these examples have the cruxes after the third bolt.

It's cool, do your own thing.   You can also set up top ropes on bouldering problems.   YMMV

The idea of lead climbing is not to fall.  When did sport climbing become an exercise in taking falls all day?  All I see at sport crags is "TAKE" at each bolt, projecting up, stick clipping, etc.  It's not a gym.  There are piles of boulders at the base of the climb because nature put them there.