Fleece or Puffy?

I don't really like paying 4 times as much for basically the same thing that also comes with an advertisement, especially since I'm content with the 200.

I'd look at polartech alpha as well:

millyardage.com/SearchResul…

Its like a very high loft fleece fabric you combine with a shell fabric resulting in a jacket that is compressible like a puffy, offers good weather protection and is almost as breathable as a fleece. Most primaloft etc jackets which tend to use very tight weave face fabrics to keep the fiber in and don't breath as a result. Alpha also doesn't require baffles like some synthetics so the jacket should be relatively quick to sew.

The breathability a really versatile mid/outer layer for being active in rally cold conditions though i prefer a standard non breathable puffy for "belay coat" use where I'm only wearing the coat at rest stops/camp and need to maximize warmth and wind protection for the weight.

Look at something like a westcomb tango or rab strata for ideas.

For an everyday coat, fleece or wool seems more desirable than a puffy. Puffys don't take to regular washing as well, and the simple act of sitting in a chair, car, or other seat for hours a day will begin to kill the loft in the back of the jacket.

I have fleece, and I have synthetic & down puffys. The fleece layers better & breathes way better, so I often put it on first. Then, if it's really cold, I bring a puffy and add that on top when I am moving slowly.

I find two layers of puffy or two layers of fleece is obnoxious. Too much fleece restricts movement & is claustrophobic, not to mention too heavy. Too much puffy makes you a marshmallow man. One layer of each, on the other hand, is really nice. (fleece inside the puffy)

ryanb, at $50 a yard the polartech alpha does not seem worth it when the climashield apex is around $10 a yard.

That's a good point Patrick, the fleece would probably still be more durable and I will wear it most days during the winter. The two layers of fleece do get bulky, but again if I end up needing both of those it's probably because I'm sitting still for quite a while so a hindrance to movement is as big of deal then.

The fleece will be simpler to sew as well. I can still get the fleece to go into a smaller space, it just takes more work than a puffy.

I'm really struggling to see what's to debate. If it's a midlayer it stays on unless going through huge temperature changes through out the day. You guys really need to read Mark Twight's extreme alpinism.

Scott McMahon wrote: To this point are we talking lightweight microfleeces like a marmot dri-clime or a brushed fleece material? Or something like a light merlino wool style fleece or an R1? Those definitely have a place in the quiver.

It's an alpine type microthin polar tech aconcogra light, I think.

Seb, when I do a 14er it could 60-70 at the trail head and 30 at the summit. So yea, I can get some pretty big temperature changes on a day hike.

Brady3 wrote:Seb, when I do a 14er it could 60-70 at the trail head and 30 at the summit. So yea, I can get some pretty big temperature changes on a day hike.

Great so you need,
1. The warmest baselayer best ventilating baselayer for the approach
2. A fleece of appropriate weight for when moving.
3. The warmest belay jacket you are willing to carry
4. A wind jacket.
5. A stupidly light and cheap waterproof.
This covers pretty much every situation i could imagine for mountain use where the temperatures don't go above 70 or below 20. Also to back my point up even more it's pretty much what Steve house used on nanga parbat and has written in his book "training for the new alpinism".

A fleece with a shell is a more versatile system since the fleece is comfortable while active and the shell makes it way warmer and waterproof.

A puffy will be slightly warmer and pack better than the fleece and shell.

Seb, you are suggesting that I take 5 articles with me instead of 3... I have my baselayer shirt, as it starts to get colder I put on the shell, when it gets even colder closer to the summit I put the fleece on underneath then reverse going down. I could do the fleece first if I wanted depending on wind. If I think it will be warmer I can bring a lighter fleece.

wisam, I do want more versatility. So while before I was thinking puffy, after others pointed out it will degrade faster in certain areas (the back) I have moved back to the fleece.

Brady3 wrote:Seb, you are suggesting that I take 5 articles with me instead of 3... I have my baselayer shirt, as it starts to get colder I put on the shell, when it gets even colder closer to the summit I put the fleece on underneath then reverse going down. I could do the fleece first if I wanted depending on wind. If I think it will be warmer I can bring a lighter fleece. wisam, I do want more versatility. So while before I was thinking puffy, after others pointed out it will degrade faster in certain areas (the back) I have moved back to the fleece.

If you are only climbing with 3 layers in such a massive range of temperature you are making massive compromises in comfort, versatility, function and safety. Your idea exposes you when moving in and out of your layer constantly and leaves you with pretty fuck all if you were to get benighted or had to stand still for extended periods.

I realize in some situations you should bring things for possibly getting benighted, but in some situations it is just overkill. For most CO 14ers it would be overkill. If I were doing a longer one then I would obviously bring more just in case, but most of the time there are literally hundreds of people going up and down everyday. The last one took us 5 hours from car to car and we were done before noon (I even got a friend to DIA by 1pm). And with the 300 fleece it is warm enough that I can comfortably sit on the summit (if I can mostly get out of the wind) on most days that I would do a 14er. I just don't see the point in carrying 20lbs worth of gear for a day hike. Again I have other layers that I can bring if I think it will be necessary. I'm only asking about what recommendations are for a thicker insulating layer, fleece or fill.