Which bi- patterned rope?

I have been fantasizing about a bi- patterned rope and now that a trip to Yosemite is one the horizon I need to make my choice. My top pick is a 70m 9.8 sterling Evolution Velocity. Anyone have any other thoughts? And why?

Blue Water Lightning Pro 70 m bipattern

I've used that rope. It was pretty nice. I personally prefer a skinnier rope, though. Just picked up a sterling 9.4 bipattern. I've also used the bluewater lightning 9.7 bi pattern that held up really nicely...and have a maxim glider in bi pattern (kinda like a steel cable though).

Sterling marathon pro 10.1

Mammut

climbing friend,

the sterling 9.8 it takes the abuse.

many falls and draggings over the rock for times you cannot flash.

It stays strong, the sheath not even fuzzy after harsh beatings of many days, punishing the naughty rope over the climbing rocks.

I have punished mine with more fallings than I very much like admit. It stays strong, but perhaps is turning stiff in certain spots after much use, making me fear the flash. however upon inspection there are no core shot or small concentrated soft or flat spots, so I continue climbing high for flash on this sterling, even though secretly afraid.

I also have strange friend utilizing grigri lowering with brake hand straight out, which has perhaps caused the rope to run over the 90 degree corner flat end and turn into slight oval shape ... do you believe this is quite dangerous to not make flash on the oval rope with stiff spots and fall the big one? Shall I be quite afraid that some longer sections are stiff and other long sections more soft like warm spring mist near Bergen?

Jeff0 wrote:Sterling marathon pro 10.1

70m 10.1? Sheeesh... no thanks.

I just bought the Velocity 9.8 in a 60m and am very happy with it so far. Haven't used it enough to gauge long term durability but feels like a very nice rope so far and I would recommend it.

I've got 9.5 mammut 70m double dry rope with bi-pattern. The double dry may be overkill if you don't climb in wet climates a lot, but I still really dig the rope.

Monica Ragan wrote:I have been fantasizing about a bi- patterned rope and now that a trip to Yosemite is one the horizon I need to make my choice. My top pick is a 70m 9.8 sterling Evolution Velocity. Anyone have any other thoughts? And why?

Don't bother with the Bi Pattern and Save $$. Just get one that has a clear mid mark, flake to confirm it's accuracy and go.

I've had NUMEROUS Bi Patterns over the years and this is what I've discovered:

- They cost more.
- The Change Over Point can occasionally be a place for premature wear.
- The Change Over is often HARDER to spot vs a distinctly different black mark.
- Darker Colored Bi Color ropes become very hard to use (spot middle) as they get dirty.
- Bi colors are harder for the 2nd to watch for the middle as well. Once the middle is 15m up it's VERY hard to see and thus, harder for the 2nd to shout "Half Way" if they don't really watch for it
- Low Light Raps (or night raps by headlamp etc ) are faster with the black mark - more contrast

YMMV of course but for Yos a 9.5mm Mammut Infinity ProTec is ideal.

Although I never owned one, I'm pretty sure there used to be bi-color ropes on the market. I think they had a much more distinct halfway point, compared to bi-pattern. I wonder why I don't see those any more?

yesrodcire wrote: 70m 10.1? Sheeesh... no thanks. I just bought the Velocity 9.8 in a 60m and am very happy with it so far. Haven't used it enough to gauge long term durability but feels like a very nice rope so far and I would recommend it.

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Climbing-Rope-Reviews

I believe the 10.1 Marathon pro is actually one of the lighter ropes tested because sheath to core ratio allows for a super durable sheath but has less core material. That said, it's still a 10.1 so handling probably won't be as smooth as the thinner ropes.

For what it's worth, I'm on my second consecutive 70m sterling velocity 9.8 and couldn't be happier. It's been a great all around rope that has taken a ton of abuse in a lot of different settings.

Very happy with the durability and handling of my Sterling 9.8 and 10.1 bipattern ropes.

Of note: do not get their "digital camo" color choice. Once the rope gets even slightly dirty, it may as well not be bipattern anymore.

70m 10.1 will herniate one of your discs, dude!

go Euro-made. apologies to the US ropes...but man, sheath slippage, furry sheaths....yuck.

i've got a 9.2mm Topaz bipattern by Edelrid and it's great--70m, relatively light, handles beautifully, "bluesign" certified (meaning it's environmentally-conscious/something)...loving it. only had it a few months, but i work with it and it's been good so far....

anyway---good luck!

I think they don't make bi-color due to the fact that they actually had to change the thread, rather than just the pattern being woven, so it created a weak point.

I've always been very happy spending the extra money on a bi-pattern and haven't had the issues noted above, but of course that's an individual choice.

Currently using the Beal Booster 9.7 bi-pattern unicore - seems durable, trustworthy, good feel.

I have been using bi-pattern ropes for decades. Black middle marks just do not hold up. PMI made a custom bi-pattern 100m x 8.1mm rope for me a while back. Great rope for ice a big alpine routes. I just picked up an Edelrid Topaz 9.2. Which like my PMI was rated as a single/double/twin rope. The sheath is thicker so it should hold up well. Too bad you did not think about this last month as REI had them on sale for $170.

mattm wrote: Don't bother with the Bi Pattern and Save $$.

Couldn't disagree more. Now that I've owned one I would never go back. A rope is a small expense spread over many years of use. The little bit extra is only 20c a week.

mattm wrote: The Change Over is often HARDER to spot vs a distinctly different black mark.

You must have had some shit bi-pattern. Distinction on my rope is night and day, far easier to find than a middle marker.

mattm wrote:Darker Colored Bi Color ropes become very hard to use (spot middle) as they get dirty. - Bi colors are harder for the 2nd to watch for the middle as well.

Aren't we talking about BI PATTERN rope not bi-colour. A good bi pattern rope is extremely distinctive.

mattm wrote:Once the middle is 15m up it's VERY hard to see and thus

I've found quite the opposite.

A GOOD bi-pattern rope should be extremely distinctive. The it also tells you much more than simply a middle marker. It tells you which end of the rope you are holding and which end is on top of the pile. I use this purpose just as often as finding the middle.

This is my rope:

Gabe K wrote:Currently using the Beal Booster 9.7 bi-pattern unicore - seems durable, trustworthy, good feel.

2nd vote for the Beal Booster 9.7. Best handling rope I've ever used and very durable as well. If you can't afford the Beal price, next choice would be Mammut 9.5 Infinity 70m duodess. The Beal feels and looks to be the same diameter as the Mammut.

...p.s., you can always mark the middle of your bipattern rope, too---just get a laundry pen....doubles your chances of seeing the middle....

Well the thing about single rope multi rappels is that you should be pulling up the ends anyways to knot em if you want to be "safe"

So a bi pattern doesnt save much time or "safety" in that regard

And for cragging never simply rely on the bi-pattern if its a 35m climb and you have a 60m rope .... Youll still deck if theres no knot in the system

Where they can be useful is for the belayer to let the climber know when its at the halfway mark for onsights and journeys into the unknown

Regardless the pattern change has to be VERY visible, no dark coloured ropes

;)

I have been really happy with the mammut infinity 70m bi-pattern. My last one lasted 4 years of frequent multi-pitch use, I only retired based on the age, the sheath and handling of the rope remained excellent. I just bought my second.

patto wrote: Couldn't disagree more. Now that I've owned one I would never go back. A rope is a small expense spread over many years of use. The little bit extra is only 20c a week.

With the caveat that these are opinions and thus, if it works for you, great...

Sterling Evolution 70m is $70 list difference between Regular and BiColor. Not exactly life changing but $70 gets you a fair amount of other climbing gear. Others may have better pricing of course. I haven't looked.

patto wrote: You must have had some shit bi-pattern. Distinction on my rope is night and day, far easier to find than a middle marker.

There are a few Bi ropes out there that do a decent job of distinguishing sides.

The VAST majority however, do a middling job at best and are terrible at worst.

Ok Coloring


Terrible Pattern

What one should note is the "better" rope has very high contrast colors. The reason the pattern change is so effective is not so much the pattern itself but how it places the black color on a very light background. A the rope images get worse, the contrast lessens and as such, so does the ease at which one can find the individual sides.

It's also noteworthy that these images present the BEST possible scenario. The ropes are clean and coiled which provides some organization to the "visual picture". A stacked rope provides no such organization so spotting the pattern/color changeover is not that simple.

Other factors that make the patten change sub-par:
- Movement: When you're pulling a rap rope through chains the colors and patterns blur together, essentially blurring the mid mark. Yes, you can spot it but a black mark on a light color rope is MUCH easier, particularly when moving.
- Distance and Angle: Looking down a hanging rope, the pattern again blurs the further down you get. Same goes for looking up. You can spot a 1m black mark no matter where it is.

patto wrote:Aren't we talking about BI PATTERN rope not bi-colour. A good bi pattern rope is extremely distinctive.

I'm fairly certain ALL "Bi" ropes are Bi Pattern i.e. the weave changes distinctively. Some "Bi" ropes also change out a few colors to aid in the distinction. They don't change all the colors and if they aren't high contrast it does't help as much. Changing the color requires more work and thus even more $$. Not an expert here but I think this requires an "air splice". This is where I feel you see a bit of extra wear near the middle as the rope fibers change over.

patto wrote:I've found quite the opposite. A GOOD bi-pattern rope should be extremely distinctive. The it also tells you much more than simply a middle marker. It tells you which end of the rope you are holding and which end is on top of the pile. I use this purpose just as often as finding the middle. This is my rope:

See above re: pattern changes and ease of identifying the middle. Contrast is KEY. Pattern is much more moot. Finding which end is which is a nice plus but I don't place much of a priority on that. Many ropes today have distinct "tags" on each end so if you did it a lot, I suspect you could figure it out quickly.

Again, I find a brightly colored rope with a black mid mark to be the best system because of the high contrast. Even as the rope gets dirty it maintains the marking better than the other options AND is less expensive. If the mark really fades or is "short", I use rope marking ink (Beal has nice stuff $15) that will do MANY ropes. Granted, the rope feel for that spot is slightly different but we're talking an extremely small percentage of the overall rope length. The contrasting black mark is also easier to find in a heap vs the pattern change.

This is the style works for me. I'd likely make the mark a bit larger but the contrast is fantastic.