Is trad climbing safe if you're fat?

matt c. wrote: also, how does one make prestigious list of climbing well?? i just want your approval...

Sport climbing begins at 12c, but that is a different thread all together.

Trad is more subjective, it's important to think of what the average person can do, then what the average climber with a few years can do, then to add a standard deviation to it. It's about 11c by my reckoning.

The best I ever climbed was at 145 lbs.

I never went all Napoleon on you. You're the one flying off the handle. Did I touch a nerve? I'm simply waiting to get more lives on Candy Crush.

Do you want to turn this into a losing weight to improve climbing thread? We can. There is overwhelming evidence in all disciplines to prove my point. There is the occasional outlier on your side (assuming you are arguing from 180-220, if 270 is your argument, there isn't a single case).

I'm sorry that you will have to work harder to climb. I'm sorry that your body isn't built to go up. If I've learned anything about the human body in my time though, it's that life is not fair.

nicelegs wrote: Sport climbing begins at 12c, but that is a different thread all together. Trad is more subjective, it's important to think of what the average person can do, then what the average climber with a few years can do, then to add a standard deviation to it. It's about 11c by my reckoning. The best I ever climbed was at 145 lbs. I never went all Napoleon on you. You're the one flying off the handle. Did I touch a nerve? I'm simply waiting to get more lives on Candy Crush. Do you want to turn this into a losing weight to improve climbing thread? We can. There is overwhelming evidence in all disciplines to prove my point. There is the occasional outlier on your side (assuming you are arguing from 180-220, if 270 is your argument, there isn't a single case). I'm sorry that you will have to work harder to climb. I'm sorry that your body isn't built to go up. If I've learned anything about the human body in my time though, it's that life is not fair.

haha you are a very sad little man...

matt c. wrote: haha you are a very sad little man...

quite so

Kirby1013 wrote: Is trad climbing safe if you're fat?

Nope. Better quit.

Obviously lose weight but in the meantime yes the gear will hold. Maybe be careful about taking huge whippers on micro cams but I think that's probably a good rule in general...

Just move to Boulder you ll be thin in no time

Kirby1013 wrote: I was hoping to get some opinions on taking lead falls when you're fat. Plus the weight of some of you bigger guys who have fallen on gear. I weigh 270 lbs and have started to trad lead stuff that I wouldn't solo. So now I'm starting to think what if? I have had proper instruction from many different qualified people. I've had more than one well known guide follow me to evaluate my gear placements. So the knowledge is there but I'm still worried I'm too heavy for any gear to hold. What you think? Is a mock lead fall really a good idea? I don't wanna damage a cam or weld a nut into a crack while pretending.

Read this

safeclimbing.org/education/…

As to pro ... Double it up ... Rock can break, and even "well placed" micros can walk inti marginal placements (hint about rope drag) ... No matter what MPers tell you small gear does pull occasionally even from "good" placements

And realize that the forces will be higher ... Mitigate this by lessening rope drag, using a softer catching rope (warning you will fall farther), and by placing more gear

Or just dun fall

;)

@ NICE LEGS,
so your saying all big people are fat? and that they are crappy climbers as a result? one of my best climbing partners is 6'8 and weighs every bit of 260. we trad climb well together, he's a strong and competent climber, weight is not the problem, so long as you know how to consider this when building anchors, placing gear anchoring a belayer (or dynamic belaying). *(edit im also not saying that hes leading 5.12, rather the point of 'a fall is a fall, regardless of grade'

To the OP,
No it isn't safe for you to fall off, but not because of your weight.

I had a look at your profile. Falling on a 5.6 just isn't a good idea. There will be ledges and blocks and corners between you and where the rope comes tight. You are very unlikely to create a massive force on the top piece as you won't be taking one of those big air falls you see in the videos, but cart wheeling down the face.

If you plan to fall, you need the fall zone to be steep. I'd just a climbing gym until you completely understand how far you might drop.

Agree with the last post about hitting ledges. Know the area and route as much as possible. Some areas are notorious for having ledges and nice rests, then 20ft of 5.10 climbing, but since most of the route is easy, grade is still 5.6 or 5.7.

Thanks for all the replies and good advice! I enjoyed the silly comments and advice I didn't want too.

I should've thought out a better title! I wanted something catchy but now I see it sounds like I'm asking if trad climbing is safe. Haha.. I really just wanted to know if well placed gear will pop out because I'm 270. I was hoping to hear from guys close to my weight that have fallen on gear. Might be waiting while on that one.

Nicelegs, Matt's right.. You come off like a real d*ck. You are right none the less.. I should lose weight. The last 80 pounds isn't functional for climbing but climbings not my entire life. I think if I put more efffort into wanting to be a better climber I would lose weight.

My friends love to climb with me. They catch me just fine on bolts.

Kirby1013 wrote: Thanks for all the replies and good advice! I enjoyed the silly comments and advice I didn't want too. I should've thought out a better title! I wanted something catchy but now I see it sounds like I'm asking if trad climbing is safe. Haha.. I really just wanted to know if well placed gear will pop out because I'm 270. I was hoping to hear from guys close to my weight that have fallen on gear. Might be waiting while on that one. Nicelegs, Matt's right.. You come off like a real d*ck. You are right none the less.. I should lose weight. The last 80 pounds isn't functional for climbing but climbings not my entire life. I think if I put more efffort into wanting to be a better climber I would lose weight. My friends love to climb with me. They catch me just fine on bolts.

I used to climb with a guy who was about 220-230 (not quite your size but close) and caught a few whips. His gear always held.

Meanwhile I weigh 170 and I fell on a yellow TCU and pulled it because the placement was shit.

It's more about the placement than your weight. Not saying weight means nothing just that it's not like the gear won't work at all if you weigh above X lbs.

i agree w/ nicelegs - i wouldn't want to belay a person who outweighed me by 100 lbs. i am about 40 lbs heavier than my wife, and for routes that have cruxes within the first 4 bolts or so, it is not fun for her.

Seems to me like you guys dont prefer the soft touch. I weigh 200 right now and love it when I got a little weasel for a belay. When I go flying on small gear, they go flying up and give the best catches :)

goingUp wrote:@ NICE LEGS, so your saying all big people are fat? and that they are crappy climbers as a result? one of my best climbing partners is 6'8 and weighs every bit of 260. we trad climb well together, he's a strong and competent climber, weight is not the problem, so long as you know how to consider this when building anchors, placing gear anchoring a belayer (or dynamic belaying). *(edit im also not saying that hes leading 5.12, rather the point of 'a fall is a fall, regardless of grade'

I never once said anyone is fat. To be fair, I didn't say anyone was muscular either. Big people weigh more and there is a point where any pure strength advantage due to size will be negated when trying to move up. This point is surprisingly low.

To focus on fat though, I think we can assume that Kirby probably has more than he needs. In fact, even if he was a pro footballer (or lumberjack or something where big dudes excel) he'd still have more fat than needed. Look at the latest stats, more people on this planet have excess fat than don't. It's time stop getting offended by it and instead do something about it.

I'm proud of your tall friend. Now go back a page and read what I wrote about outliers vs overwhelming majority.

I just thought of something. I'm skinny and my ropegun/fiance is way smaller than me. We don't climb with a huge rack. Is this why my truck seems to get better MPG than most?

Not to downplay the importance of fall factors above 1, but the chances of of that happening on a single pitch route is almost 0. The person will meet the deck before they get that 1.1 fall factor, unless they belay on a ledge.

That being said, I think your concerns on gear are valid mentally and in a few cases physically. Until I welded a BD#3 stopper into a crack, I didn't trust that the gear would hold. You will go farther, faster, if you learn to trust your gear. Just remember that smaller gear will hold falls a LOT better the higher they are on the route. I wouldn't use any piece rated below 2Kn if I expected a fall, if I were you. I think the BD#3 stopper and a 00 C3 is about at small as you want to fall on, and that will hold probably 90% of your falls. Unless you fall close to the start of the route you will most likely be in the area of .3-.5 fall factor or less.

But all gear holds when you don't fall. If it doesn't...then you're a bad person and you should feel bad.

Kirby1013 wrote: Is a mock lead fall really a good idea? I don't wanna damage a cam or weld a nut into a crack while pretending.

plug a new pink tri cam in a solid placement, and back up it with an anchor. All doubt over trad gear should be dispelled after that point.

I am 6'1" and 235 or so and the times I have fallen on gear it has held with the exception of a micro nut that I knew was not that good and standing a KB on an aid climb. As many others have said if you place solid gear it will hold. However, as a heavy climber you WILL put more force on the gear so mediocre placements will be in greater danger of blowing. Maybe consider using screamers on anything questionable or just on everything if it really worries you.

I outweigh my wife and partner by 110 pounds and we are fine climbing together. She usually elects to belay me with a Gri-Gri and on trad routes she will usually anchor with 6-8' of slack (so that she doesn't end up ripping the 1st piece out if she gets yanked up to it, which is not an issue on sport routes).

If climbing is your primary activity then yes loosing weight would potentially help you, however, it sounds like climbing is more of an occasional recreational activity for you. Don't let the scrawny climbers pressure you into loosing weight if you are happy with you life and body. For all we know loosing weight might risk your NFL paychecks just to tick a few more routes :)

Wait, was trad climbing ever safe? I didn't get that memo. People aren't still dying on 5.8s, are they?

Nick Mattson wrote:Seems to me like you guys dont prefer the soft touch. I weigh 200 right now and love it when I got a little weasel for a way. When I go flying on small gear, they go flying up and give the best catches :)

Exactly!!! On the other hand I have tried to perfect jumping to lessen the force on the climber I'm catching. I think guys wouldn't wanna me to belay them not you worrying about belaying me.

Nice legs, I just went bike riding... I definitely weight more than I need! Another sport where my weight hurts me. There's a chart I read that shows the heavier you are the slower you climb uphill The only time my weights come in handy is fist fights. My size intimidates so most of the time it's over before it starts. If it does happen I wrestled in high school. The heavier wrestler has the advantage if it goes to the ground. What can I say I'm white trash.

Eliot, Your comment made me laugh! I've followed people when here comes a cam or a nut down the rope. I just leave it at my waist so I can show it to the leader.... who turned white. Haha..