Starting a rack

hey there, im just starting out on building a rack, any advice you have is welcome. im starting from basically nothing. anything that comes to mind is useful. thank you.

My advice:

Buy reasonably priced, good condition used gear so that you can afford an entire rack in one go. I didn't like 'builing it up' piece by piece because it led to a lot of runout/bails due to lack of gear. Not worth it, in hindsight.

Like I said, try your best to get a complete rack in one go. Stoppers 1-10, singles of cams from thin hands to fists first. Then small cams, then finally double up on larger cams. Don't bother w/ hexes and tricams, use that money on slcd's. Buy RP's and REALLY small/big gear as needed for specific routes you look up.

Ted's advice is good. Some people will tell you to start with only "passive pro" (nuts, primarily) and to learn first on those. But I think a single set of cams and a set of nuts/stoppers is the way to start. You'll also want to get a half dozen quickdraws, 5 or 6 shoulder-length runners and carabiners.

Have an experienced partner or guide show you how to properly place the pro, how and why to extend it and have him critique your placements.

Hey, skierhs, While many people could recommend a generic rack, where/what you want to climb could have some bearing, as does your experience. There are some memorial day sales going on right now (backcountry.com has been sending me emails), but you can often find people selling partial/full racks on this site too. With those sales on here, you need to watch for them, recognize what you're looking at and be willing to make an offer quickly.

If you were climbing here w/ me on the east coast, i'd tell you to get a set of DMM wallnuts on an Oval biner(or any other variety, I have BD, but i'd by DMM if i were getting new ones), and a set of camalots .3-3 with a biner for each one (nuetrino or oz rackpack), a set of tricams .5-2, 8 60cm slings (9/16" nylon - cheap and durable), each with 2 wiregate biners, a few quickdraws, a 120cm nylon sling, a 7mm x 20' cordolette, nut tool, and 3 locking biners.

Just read this: web.archive.org/web/2012100…

I am not a fan of buying used gear. It is life safety equipment, and I like to know its history. That is just me, and obviously others have VERY different opinions.

Unless you are 100% sure you want to climb for a long time, don't buy. if you are committed to climbing for the long term, then buy the best. So, what is "the best?" That depends. Where do you live and what do you climb. What do your current partners use? What gear are you familiar with and what do you like? Almost everywhere a good set of nuts and C4s will work great and form a strong foundation.

As far as specific gear, I am a fan of C4s and I absolutely LOVE DMM offset nuts.

Good luck!

Edit to add...
Get color matching carabiners for your cams. These things are the greatest invention since free internet porn.

Ted's advice is very good. However don't rule out tricams. Depending on the kind of rock you climb, these guys are as bomber as a C4 (and place in unusual places).

i know i am going to regret this...

buy tricams much later, if at all. they are specialized pieces of gear and there is a reason you almost NEVER see more experienced climbers using these things on hard routes. I have them, used to use them, seldom do any more.

I hardly ever see Honnold use a rope on hard routes. Time to get rid of it, totally outdated...

Just because the pros climbing 5.13 and harder routes don't use tricams doesn't mean they are useless. If you are climbing routes with good stances to place gear from, they can be invaluable, fitting in places a cam wouldn't and saving your cams for the crux when you don't have a good stance to place gear from. While I don't place my tricams as often as my nuts or cams, when I do place them, I am glad that I had them with me.

Larry S wrote:Hey, skierhs, While many people could recommend a generic rack, where/what you want to climb could have some bearing, as does your experience. There are some memorial day sales going on right now (backcountry.com has been sending me emails), but you can often find people selling partial/full racks on this site too. With those sales on here, you need to watch for them, recognize what you're looking at and be willing to make an offer quickly. If you were climbing here w/ me on the east coast, i'd tell you to get a set of DMM wallnuts on an Oval biner(or any other variety, I have BD, but i'd by DMM if i were getting new ones), and a set of camalots .3-3 with a biner for each one (nuetrino or oz rackpack), a set of tricams .5-2, 8 60cm slings (9/16" nylon - cheap and durable), each with 2 wiregate biners, a few quickdraws, a 120cm nylon sling, a 7mm x 20' cordolette, nut tool, and 3 locking biners.

I think this is a good point. I recently went through this activity with my climbing partner in order to go take a two day clinic on trad leading. And the first thing we led on the second day was a 5.7 75ft hand crack. We had 2 #2 and 1 #3 in our rack and doubles of everything else. We had to add a bunch more #2's and #3's just to get through the lead - literally no small protection anywhere. I learned a great lesson that day about what your rack does - it can make you succeed or fail (bail). So, thinking about destination IS good. Build a basic rack, but then if you wanna get into crack climbing or go climb something with desperate .4's, consider that you may need doubles or more to pull off the route.

Let's try and not turn this into a long dialog about the usefullness of tri-cams.

Elaborating on my prior post where i touched on where/what you climb... in some areas, people don't really need the smaller cams as much, and don't like the wide head width of the .3 and .4 black diamonds. For me, on what i climb, everything between .3 and .75 I find to be my "go to" pieces, and i feel the same with the tricams. People get very polarized on tricams, out here, i don't leave the ground without them - when i was climbing out west, i ended up leaving them in the pack because i was never placing them. Lastly, routes i climb tend here to wander, so more slings is important for me. If you're somewhere else with different rock, you might not need so many slings, the smaller cams, or the tricams for a beginner rack.

Experience is the best teacher, see if you can find someone to follow on the routes you'd like to climb, and see what they use.

tricams are gold in pockets and horizontals, just saying...

Will depend on what and where you will be climbing.. When I started I was brand new to climbing and I was buyin small groups of gear.. If ur new leader and won't be leading in 5.10+ range you can get away with out the smaller cams which are expensive, use nuts.
.3 - 2 C4 or any brand of cam they all work. You will end up with doubles and can spend $$ when u know more
BD nuts 4 -12

If u will be practicing trad leads on 5.5-5.8 for awhile get #3 C4 then start doubling up from 2 back down to .3

If u will be leading routes 5.9+ soon start building the + & - finger sizes up cuz u will need em.

Double up w/ some metolius cams they compliment ea other well.. Offwidth and large gear gets expensive, but with confidence and good technique you can reduce the amount of gear you need. People try to sew offwidths up or bump a 6 through every move because they are scared.
I never appreciated the nut till I started aiding... They are bomber when placed right, place quickly and light weight to carry..
Stuff I leave behind all the time.. Doubles of 3, a 4 +, Tiny metolius and c3's
I Never leave the ground without double .75 or .5 and a set of nuts!

I prefer the metolius curved nuts to the BD's. I'll assume you have a belay device, harness and other things, but not draws and such. Also keep in mind that my suggestions come from someone who likes granite and doesnt really do any desert splitter climbing or things that require a lot of same-size gear.

That said I'd buy (in this order):

6 to 8 decent normal draws
4 or 5 runners with single carabiners
a set of metolius nuts
one of the BD cam sets, probably the 0.5-3 (it might be to #2, I dont remember) w/ racking carabiners (I'd go nuetrino rack pack)
your choice of metolius cams (master cams, TCU's whatever) in a size 1 and 2 (blue and yellow).
A selection of anchor materials if you dont already have them. Try some different stuff out, cordalette, long webbing, whatever and a couple lockers.

A lot of what you want will be dictated by where/what you climb, so take all these recommendations with a grain of salt.

It definitely depends on where you climb as far as what you need doubles (or more) of, but just starting out I'd avoid doubling up and just get the basics. Once you start leading more you'll realize what you end up borrowing the most. for example I borrow a #1 and #2 C4 on almost every route I do where I climb, but rarely need doubles of anything smaller. You might find the opposite where you climb -- don't spring for doubles until you know you need them.

A "bare bones" rack to me is:

BD C4 0.5-3
Mastercams #1-4
Set of stoppers 4-13

Personally I also have pink and red tricam (lots of horizontals and pockets where I climb).

As far as slings, I carry 6 24" slings tripled as alpine draws, 4 24" slings with a single biner over the shoulder, and 1-2 48" slings doubled on a single biner. The routes where I climb wander a lot so I extend almost every placement and never carry quick draws. If I don't want to extend I just leave the runner tripled or clip straight into the cam. Again, depends on your area but you will want at least a few 24" slings and probably at least one 48".

1. ask the locals where you climb ... they know better than an random intrawebber

2. go climb with experienced people who have all the gear already ... once you use their gear youll find out what works and what you like

its REALLY that simple ;)

harness, rope, biner

1 full set of any nuts
1 full set of BD or Metolius (whichever your partner doesn't have), or Friends. If your partner doesn't have any cams, take your pick.

IMO, buy all new stuff. Having complete confidence in your gear when you are starting is a big deal. Falling on gear for the first time is scarier when it is used gear (at least in your mind).

Where you climb matters a lot, and the advice to ask locals is good.

Having said that, a 2-3 micro cams (eg blue & yellow + maybe orange & purple Mastercam or similar), and a set of C4s from 0.5 to 3 is a good start for cams regardless of where you climb. Get a set of nuts (eg BD stoppers from #4-12) and learn to place them. A lot of people these days rely on cams too much IMO. Make sure to have some extendable draws as well as anchor building materials.

Later on, add doubles of 0.75, 1, and 2 when you can afford it, and get a 4. More micro cams too. I'm not a fan of the link cams, but the yellow can double as a 1 or a 2, and sometimes a 0.75, so this may be worth considering. What you add will depend on where you climb, and what routes you want to do. RPs or similar are nice to have, and are necessary for some routes (typically as they get harder). Get more extendable draws, particularly if where you climb has a lot of wandering routes, or really long pitches. You may want doubles of some of the more common nuts.

Don't get anything other than C4s in the larger sizes. Aliens are great instead of Mastercams, but a bit more expensive. Don't get small C4s or C3s. Don't get hexes unless you want to advertise your noob status. Some people like Tricams, but I never have.

If you are climbing multipitch routes, get an ATC guide or equivalent and learn to use it. Become more efficient.

Have fun.